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Ned Kelly

  • Posts: 15
1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« on: February 09, 2019, 10:17:58 pm »
Ever since I got my Airflex vac booster for my Airflex pro I've been using 50 feet of 2" hose for most jobs between 25- 100 feet . Yesterday I cleaned  wool mix carpets with the 2"  50 footer vac hose and today on a different job I decided to just use the 1.5"  50 footer on another 80/20 mix and for some reason the carpets today seemed drier. My question for you tec guys is: does the 1.5" hose perform better with distances under 50 foot? The wand when using the 2" hose  is always whistling way stronger than the 1.5" but does this reflect on the performance?

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2019, 12:07:04 am »
what is the spec of your airflex pro ... is it two in series or two in parallel  , i know u have the booster also .

nobody has done the definitive test that answers your question ... mainly because of all the variables that can effect the results .
In general two inch seems to preserve airflow on longer runs . 
At 50 foot it may not have made such a difference on that day with that carpet , other factors maay have helped drying also , like wand contact on that particular carpet ... ambient temperature etc
I try and use two inch as much as possible , but if its easier to use 1.5 in a particular job , il use that ... or combine both .

Ned Kelly

  • Posts: 15
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2019, 02:27:21 pm »
Thank's for the reply John. The spec of my pro is HDVS 1 X 1400 watt 3 stage,1 x 1200 watt 3-stage Lamb Ametek in parallel  with the booster pod which is a 6.6 vac motor which brings it up to the same kind of vac performance as the Storm. It's a 400 psi pump. Couldn't believe the extra power the pod gives me the first time I used it and wouldn't be without it now on every job. Another wee question,does the 6.6 booster pod have more power than the two vac motors in the machine and also would adding a short length of 1.5" whip hose on the end of the 2" for convenience of use have much of a detrimental effect on vac performance ? I know this has probably been covered a thousand times here but any advice would be appreciated.

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2019, 03:02:13 pm »
Im sure it works well ,  boosters are under used in the UK really .
No matter how you add it up you should about 20% more performance than a 6.6 storm or  twin 8.4

The two vacs compared to the booster ?   single 6.6 in the booster would have about 650 airwatts whereas your twin 5.7s would be about 800 .   The single 6.6 would draw about 7amps ... the twin 5.7 about 12 amps  ( the more amps the more power )
The single 6.6 would peform at about 140cfm and 10HG .... the twin 5.7 would perform at about 190cfm and 9.5HG

Overall id say you have about 10HG and 330cfm  .....   where as a storm should be about 10Hg and 290cfm

Hose wise ,  i have two inch wand and sometimes run 100+foot of two inch to it  ....  but really i cant stand that in a cramped smaller house , fine if you have a place with big rooms to do .   Use whatever makes life easier for you , you have enough performance so as a whip hose wont make a huge difference .

Ned Kelly

  • Posts: 15
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2019, 06:34:32 pm »
Thank's for taking the time to put all that together for me John...much appreciated. I was thinking of upgrading to the Storm with the auto feed and the auto empty  in the Autumn but if I can get more cfm with the pro and the booster pod( its so easy to use it just hooks on the back of the machine) than a Storm or any other machine I will just ask the guys at Cleansmart to fit the auto feed and auto empty on to my pro. The vac booster can also act as a back up if one of the vac motors on the machine goes which I don't think you can do on the Storm.The benefits for the pro and the booster over the Storm seem to be a no brainer.

MarkSutcliffe

  • Posts: 190
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2019, 11:28:39 pm »
I have the same set up as you... exactly the same..

I've ran 175 ft (that's all i have pipes wise), and worked great!

love my machine!

And i use a 10 ft whip with no issues..

Ned Kelly

  • Posts: 15
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2019, 09:33:31 am »
Mark, do your run it primarily from the van or take it into the house? I was thinking of going down the route of van mounted most of the time with water tank,waste tank and generator ( I know I'd need a big one lol). Seems we're not that far away from entry level truckmount performance.

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2019, 10:08:18 pm »
Ha , is this some of you guys  , its loud  , great to have an empty house to dry cushions in the kitchen  :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vq7db-OhMBA

Ned Kelly

  • Posts: 15
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2019, 10:58:54 pm »
  ;D Using the old wet side dry side trick John

Nick Day

  • Posts: 13
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2019, 09:06:10 pm »
This question has intrigued me for many years. I have an inches of water lift meter and built an air speed meter. I have tested many different vacs. The results were always the same,there was no difference in the readings between 1.5 or 2 inch diameter hose.

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2019, 10:00:28 pm »
This question has intrigued me for many years. I have an inches of water lift meter and built an air speed meter. I have tested many different vacs. The results were always the same,there was no difference in the readings between 1.5 or 2 inch diameter hose.

what guage have you ?  total lift wont drop much unless u put on 200ft or so  ...   airflow will drop with increasing length ...   the question is how much does 1.5" drop relative to 2" over increasing lengths

Matt @ Cleansmart

  • Posts: 12
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2019, 10:30:35 am »
Just to clarify;

The Airflex Pro with Booster POD would have a little more airflow than a Storm, but you would have less water lift: When you mix vac motors types in parallel you only get the lift of the weakest motor (with the least lift) . So, you'd have 145" lift on the Storm, 116.7" lift on the Pro with Booster POD.

On the carpet, the performance between the two is pretty close, with the Storm winning it due to the better lift.

If anyone's got any questions please feel free to email me at Cleansmart info@cleansmartsupplies.co.uk

Hope that helps :)

Matt

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2019, 12:05:17 pm »
Hi Matt , yes I should probably have factored more a lift drop into my guesstimate.
Have you tried boosting the storm and did that work well ? 
Do you plan any future machines or innovations in the airflex range ? 

Robin Ray

  • Posts: 1240
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #13 on: February 15, 2019, 01:53:04 pm »
Just to clarify;

The Airflex Pro with Booster POD would have a little more airflow than a Storm, but you would have less water lift: When you mix vac motors types in parallel you only get the lift of the weakest motor (with the least lift) . So, you'd have 145" lift on the Storm, 116.7" lift on the Pro with Booster POD.

On the carpet, the performance between the two is pretty close, with the Storm winning it due to the better lift.

If anyone's got any questions please feel free to email me at Cleansmart info@cleansmartsupplies.co.uk

Hope that helps :)

Matt

Is the storm only fitted with the electro motor now? as the 6.6 motors have 131" of water lift.

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #14 on: February 15, 2019, 02:09:22 pm »
That's about all I get from testing them ,well 10 HG , about 135 .it's possible there is a rise from two together in parallel which would account for Matt's figure .
Nothing like getting your own gauge though and measuring yourself
.also the lift drop issue can be fixed in the pro by replacing the 1200w with another more powerful 5.7 .but it's not something any of the UK manufacturers can endorse ...but many of us do it .

Robin Ray

  • Posts: 1240
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #15 on: February 15, 2019, 02:23:16 pm »
The lift dro in the pro with the booster may be down to using a single stage 6.6 in the booster with provides 162 cfm but only 95 inches of water lift. Coupled with the other motors in the system this will produce approx 115 inches of lift eg: (148" (1600w) + 122" (1200w)) + 95" (1stage 6.6) divided by 3 = 115"

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2019, 02:29:18 pm »
You sure it's a single stage in the booster ! If so I didn't know that and that would change a lot of things .
Can't see why the 6.6 two stage wouldn't be used though .

Robin Ray

  • Posts: 1240
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2019, 02:33:34 pm »
You sure it's a single stage in the booster ! If so I didn't know that and that would change a lot of things .
Can't see why the 6.6 two stage wouldn't be used though .

I'm not totally sure to be honest, however it used to be advertised as adding 160 cfm. and that is what a 1 stage 6.6 produces. It definitely has a 6.6 of some sort in. Maybe cleansmart will clarify?

The figures fit though.

john martin

  • Posts: 2268
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2019, 02:37:12 pm »
Ha , no I think the 160 CFM is the two stage , it might not be accurate and it might but nick was claiming 160cfm for a 6.6 so clean smart will not sell it self short .
CFM is difficult to measure though .

Matt @ Cleansmart

  • Posts: 12
Re: 1.5" or 2" Vac Hose
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2019, 02:37:40 pm »
Ametek have upped the power output on the new 6.6's. They now do 144.9 inches lift and 659 peak air watts, but still only draw just over 7 amps, so by far the most efficient motors out there.

If you replaced the 1200 watt motor in a Pro machine with a 1400 watt (so 2 x 1400 watt motors) you would be drawing over 16amps through a 13amp power socket which is illegal, voids the machine warranty and voids you public liability insurance if the machine caused a fire, which it could well do - you can put big thick cables on the machine all you like but you never know what the wiring's like in the property you are working in. It only takes one bad connection.

Not good for the machine either, as you'll be pulling higher amps and everything will be running hot.

Definitely not something we'd recommend!

The Booster POD does use the 6.6 two stage.

Matt