[David Kent @ KentKleen]

Sorry Vin just seen you are a member. I am the 3rd class. 

[Perfect Windows]

Sorry Vin just seen you are a member. I am the 3rd class. 

I'd like to be in the membership class to be called "bottom of the barrel".

Vin

[♠Winp®oClean♠]

Yes it should, all areas of window cleaning. STANDARDS is key IMO.
Cleanclear, my business plan is 100% domestic so my commercial are all a bonus. I personally don't see the need to join anything, but training and standards are key to business growth.  

F**k me, another Alan Sugar!

If you knew the background to the Guild then you'd realise just what utter migraine inducing sh*te you are talking!

[Perfect Windows]

I agree smaller companies might be happy just sticking with residential and the odd commercial

Some "larger companies" are happy just sticking with residential.  Ask Ian Lancaster.  Where will they fit in your H&S rankings?

Vin

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

And whys that winpoclean? And not quite an alan sugar yet, BUT with 3 full time vans in 2.5 years and another 2 starting this year I AM on my way. Crack on.

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

Oh yes, and is this the holy grail in mean 'guild' that has had to find a new owner?

[♠Winp®oClean♠]

 

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

 
Didn't really do it for me. 

[Pete Thompson]

most hilarious thread ever!

I think for guild membership, you should have to agree to Lee living with you in your house for a week.  He will watch you eat, to make sure you have nice table manners.  He will make note of the TV shows you watch, to make sure your viewing habits are appropriate (by his standards).

He will make a note of what time you go to bed, how much alcohol you drink and how you treat your wife and children.

He will also inspect your internet browser history to make sure you meet his standards.

And he will watch you clean windows, as he is the supreme expert of the world in all matters of window cleaning and a technique is only permissible if he says so.

If I was a member of the guild, I would now leave it since a muppet is now in charge.

[David Kent @ KentKleen]

That's a bit unfair pete.
IMO Lee is doing more than you are for the window cleaning industry.
Correct?

[G Griffin]

I think he's Guilding the lily. 

[Lee Burbidge]

Can a sunday afternoon football referee take charge of a Premier league match?
Why should someone with a £60 insurance certificate be entitled/considered to take  charge of a large 2,3,5, 10k contract?

Standards are a must.
IMO

I agree but I think there is a misunderstanding here about what I said..... you would obviously have to have the right insurance for one. The next level is uploading your health & safety credentials for the next level of membership is what I was asking. 

Ppl have to start somewhere, why not. I remember my first massive contract.... do you?

[Lee Burbidge]

How d'you prove you have health and safety competence?

By uploading your training certificates.

[Lee Burbidge]

Lee, as long as everyone gets a sticker for there van everyone will be happy!

Without a CSCS card you cant get on a modern building site to clean windows. Why would a window cleaning 'Guild' let any tom dick or harry join?
No offence tom dick and harry!
If the 'Guild' is to attract serious customers, businesses wanting to join it WILL put the time and effort in to train up in all aspects of window cleaning.

STANDARDS ARE NEEDED !

 

Funny and well said.

[Lee Burbidge]

Yes it should, all areas of window cleaning. STANDARDS is key IMO.
Cleanclear, my business plan is 100% domestic so my commercial are all a bonus. I personally don't see the need to join anything, but training and standards are key to business growth.  

Well there's a problem. I thought (maybe incorrectly) that the benefits of joining a trade association might be that they could help you qualify for stuff. There's a sticky at the top of this forum from the FWC that helps you get accreditation. So if you NEED to already have accreditation to join a Guild, then what sort of trade body is it? An advertising funnel for qualified cleaners, or, a genuine trade body for its members?

The Guild is new to me and I have had it less than a week. Who says the Guild cannot help facilitate this. Its only natural for me to explore this as I want whats best for its members.

[Window Lickers]

There are guys on here who were cleaning windows before you were conceived Lee. And you think uploading a few training certificates qualifies them for a few extra bumper stickers?

I'll send you mine, they're forged, but they're certificates.

[Lee Burbidge]

I clean domestic only.

My franchisees clean domestic only.  They are businesses independent of mine.

None of us have more than five employees, so we don't need written risk assessments.  We'd presumably be second class citizens in this new guild order.

Vin

Vin since this is an open to debate and discussion, please do not assume you are 'second class', you would not be and you are not. Actually, its good practice and common sense to start thinking and training about health & safety on or before your first employee. If you have employees you will still need to back yourself up to show that you have a risk assessment for the work your employees carry out....... if something happens to your employees they dont say we wont investigate or check what you have in place for safety awareness because you have less than 5 employees. Working safe starts with YOU, then your first employee when they arrive.

[gary999]

Is there one window cleaning organisation or standard that is
legal requirement for anyone to be a window cleaner in England

Until then the likes of the fed or the co-operative known as the guild
are pointless.

[Perfect Windows]

I clean domestic only.

My franchisees clean domestic only.  They are businesses independent of mine.

None of us have more than five employees, so we don't need written risk assessments.  We'd presumably be second class citizens in this new guild order.

Vin

Vin since this is an open to debate and discussion, please do not assume you are 'second class', you would not be and you are not. Actually, its good practice and common sense to start thinking and training about health & safety on or before your first employee. If you have employees you will still need to back yourself up to show that you have a risk assessment for the work your employees carry out....... if something happens to your employees they dont say we wont investigate or check what you have in place for safety awareness because you have less than 5 employees. Working safe starts with YOU, then your first employee when they arrive.

I understand what you're saying.  However, for those of us that franchise, we're not going to be employing anyone, ever.  So, our risk assessments don't need to be written.  In your plan, we could have a hundred franchisees and not have a written risk assessment within the organisation (remember, domestic only).  How would we get to the stage of Level 2 (or whatever) of membership?

Vin

[Lee Burbidge]

There are guys on here who were cleaning windows before you were conceived Lee. And you think uploading a few training certificates qualifies them for a few extra bumper stickers?

I'll send you mine, they're forged, but they're certificates.

I think pulling the age card is low. Does it matter? Its action and ideas I look for. Just because window cleaners have cleaned before other window cleaners were in nappies does not mean none of us should think out of the box and look for improvements in the industry.

I dont think anything of the sort re certificates. And you missed the point of the Guild completely. I have taken on the Guild to offer something really valuable to window cleaners.

I respect your decision for your business. You make lots of micro decisions for your business through out its life, what is not appropriate for your business does not mean it is not appropriate for another business. You are entitled to your views but assuming other window cleaners don't need something for their business is wrong. It's just not right for your business.