[Johnny B]

I think the whole trad v wfp thing is a shame.
Yes I am wfp but I can also trad.
Personally I don't give a t*ss what anyone else does because fundamentally...I don't care.
I have a few bungalows that I still do trad (the old dears love it) and I actually really enjoy doing it, especially when the sun's on your back and there's a cuppa and a biscuit waiting for me 
Personally I wouldn't waste my time slagging one method off against another (I don't think the customers really care). I would spend my time selling the benefits of MY company and the high quality of clean that I provide; whichever method it is.

Well said. 

John

[trippyboy]

I wasn't too happy with the plumber recently,he used a set of springs to bend the pipe,i wanted him to use pipe benders.
My chippy arrived the same day,told him off for using his cordless planer,told him to use his spear and Jackson.
Went to the dentist for a check up, I was so annoyed he didn't do an xray after the check up unlike my old dentist.
Took van in for a service but only allowed the mechanic to do the service after I carefully inspected all his tools and he explained in full detail what his method was going to be.
WFP... SAFE EARNS ME DOUBLE
TRAD... DANGEREOUS SLOW CANT BE DONE IN RAIN AND ITS PAST ITS SELL BY DATE.
DO I CARE WHAT CUSTOMERS THINK,HELL NOOO ITS MY BUSINESS AND MY FUTURE

[Smurf]

I take it you don't do many shop fronts or inside jobs then?

[tench0771]

ive hurd ladders resting on the sill can make them leek its a lot of pressure with ur waight resting on a bit of upvc

[trippyboy]

I take it you don't do many shop fronts or inside jobs then?

I Trad insides   WFP shop fronts,if I cant manage wfp on shop fronts then I don't take em on,i hate the thought of squeegee work,done 14 years of that

[rosskesava]

I had to get my pvc-u window frames rebolted back into the wall and re-weather sealed inside and out many moons ago because of a trad guy resting his ladders on the frames simular to that. Was fitted properly by a very well know company but the window cleaners was established to have coursed them to fail and he had to pay out of his own pocket get it sorted.

So my advice is don't rest pointy ladders on plastic frames

I wonder just how it was 'established' that the window cleaner caused the securing bolts to fail? Must be a bit of a hard thing to prove but having said that, I'm sure the window cleaner just held his hands up and coughed up the money easily enough as after all, it had been established he was to blame. I'm surprised the brick work didn't suffer the same type of failure due to the window cleaner. Lucky bloke, he could have been paying for the house to have been re built.

If the weight of a window cleaning ladder caused the bolts to fail then they could have been put in right to start with.

It was a good job your house wasn't subjected to any strong winds before hand.

[trippyboy]

trippy trading insides last week  

[Jonny 87]

I had to get my pvc-u window frames rebolted back into the wall and re-weather sealed inside and out many moons ago because of a trad guy resting his ladders on the frames simular to that. Was fitted properly by a very well know company but the window cleaners was established to have coursed them to fail and he had to pay out of his own pocket get it sorted.

So my advice is don't rest pointy ladders on plastic frames

I wonder just how it was 'established' that the window cleaner caused the securing bolts to fail? Must be a bit of a hard thing to prove but having said that, I'm sure the window cleaner just held his hands up and coughed up the money easily enough as after all, it had been established he was to blame. I'm surprised the brick work didn't suffer the same type of failure due to the window cleaner. Lucky bloke, he could have been paying for the house to have been re built.

If the weight of a window cleaning ladder caused the bolts to fail then they could have been put in right to start with.

It was a good job your house wasn't subjected to any strong winds before hand.

It's not just "the weight of the ladder".

If your at quite a high window and your at the top of the ladder, you've got alot your weight pushing onto the A as well.

Still can't believe your arguing it's ok to put a ladder up against the weakest point of a UPVC frame. It's common sense to put it on the brick work.

[MATT BATEMAN (OWC)]

I take it you don't do many shop fronts or inside jobs then?

We do a grand total of three shops. Two are done WFP the other is done trad. There's no rhyme nor reason why they're done that way. Although I seem to remember when we took one of them on I just said it'll be done with the pole system.

No ones said anything since and we've been doing them with the pole.

[Smurf]

Yep it seems some just lack common sence for sure but hey it would be a dull world without them.

I had to get my pvc-u window frames rebolted back into the wall and re-weather sealed inside and out many moons ago because of a trad guy resting his ladders on the frames simular to that. Was fitted properly by a very well know company but the window cleaners was established to have coursed them to fail and he had to pay out of his own pocket get it sorted.

So my advice is don't rest pointy ladders on plastic frames

I wonder just how it was 'established' that the window cleaner caused the securing bolts to fail? Must be a bit of a hard thing to prove but having said that, I'm sure the window cleaner just held his hands up and coughed up the money easily enough as after all, it had been established he was to blame. I'm surprised the brick work didn't suffer the same type of failure due to the window cleaner. Lucky bloke, he could have been paying for the house to have been re built.

If the weight of a window cleaning ladder caused the bolts to fail then they could have been put in right to start with.

It was a good job your house wasn't subjected to any strong winds before hand.

It's not just "the weight of the ladder".

If your at quite a high window and your at the top of the ladder, you've got alot your weight pushing onto the A as well.

Still can't believe your arguing it's ok to put a ladder up against the weakest point of a UPVC frame. It's common sense to put it on the brick work.

[Smurf]

If you can get away with it then why not bud

I take it you don't do many shop fronts or inside jobs then?

We do a grand total of three shops. Two are done WFP the other is done trad. There's no rhyme nor reason why they're done that way. Although I seem to remember when we took one of them on I just said it'll be done with the pole system.

No ones said anything since and we've been doing them with the pole.

[Jonny 87]

I take it you've never seen a PVC frame crack under the pressure? Trust me it can happen. It's daft putting the pointer there. I use pointers and would put it above the windows onto the wall.

Actually hang on, I'd WFP it. Lol

Nope. Never seen one crack. Ever.

Never heard of one cracking either.

The ladder isn't on the glass, it's on the frame that's made to an industry standard in terms of strength, etc. It's made to withstand, I think, 150mph winds.

And yes, I'd wfp it as well but if that lot want to do the job trad, then that's up to them and if they want to promote themselves by stating that trad is better, then more power to their elbow.

As a side note;

Wind speeds of 150mph exert a pressure of 85 kilos per square foot.

The point of a a frame has a lot less surface area than a square foot, (probably a third of that) so that pressure will actually increase. 85 kilos is about average weight. So if your to put your A frame ladder onto a PVC frame like that, it's the same as it getting battered with 100 mph plus wind. That can't be good having that done every month for getting the windows cleaned.

When was the last time you experienced 100mph winds? (Don't say after you had hot curry.)

But yeah basically, resting a pointer like that is a big no no.

[Smurf]

I love listening to this guy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZBoOo2gvtw

[rosskesava]

It's not just "the weight of the ladder".

If your at quite a high window and your at the top of the ladder, you've got alot your weight pushing onto the A as well.

Still can't believe your arguing it's ok to put a ladder up against the weakest point of a UPVC frame. It's common sense to put it on the brick work.

I know it's not just the weight of the ladder. The weight of a ladder with someone cleaning windows must obviously include the weight of the person cleaning the winders minus the effects of the angle. Der........

Of course it's common sense etc, etc, etc.

I suggest you write to all the window replacement companies to put warning stickers on the frames to warn of the dangers and at the same time, inform the H & S because they've obviously never looked into the problem and while you're at it, just pray the wind never blows hard other wise you'll be having to replace replace those window bolts.

Or to put it bluntly, and sorry if this sounds rude, I know BS when I smell it.

[SeanK]

Trad is superior and if any of you old biddys disagree with me you will
feel the weight of my handbag across the back of your neck.

[dazmond]

it just goes to show some window cleaning companies are a bit strange.

i know a company with a few vans on the road and they mainly use trad on domestics.ive seen employees climbing on sloping roofs to clean windows when they have wfp in the van.

2 of em cleaning 2 houses i used to do (but they were messers so i dropped them).

i clean 90+ houses on this estate ALL wfp.them? 2 houses trad.

ive met the boss a few times and he said that his domestic customers wouldnt accept wfp so they trad them!

[richard groves]

I think when your start using words like "Superior" then just might annoy others  

Sorry but i can't see what the problem is and why anyone should get so annoyed.
If they prefer to work trad only then that is there usp and why not plug that aspect ?
How many times have you seen wfp websites plugging its plus sides, privacy , no marks on the lawn, streak free, no broken roof tiles etc. - its just the same thing.

well, I am a window cleaner who uses wfp and I am not annoyed, so why should anyone else be ?

[sherco]

He could of put the ladders like that to get the photo for the web site. He may not clean the window with the ladders resting on them!

[Smurf]

Very true

He could of put the ladders like that to get the photo for the web site. He may not clean the window with the ladders resting on them!

[Smurf]

PVC-U window frames can and in my case did become loose after a period of time because of a window cleaner resting ladders on them. That's all I have to say on this matter bud....

It's not just "the weight of the ladder".

If your at quite a high window and your at the top of the ladder, you've got alot your weight pushing onto the A as well.

Still can't believe your arguing it's ok to put a ladder up against the weakest point of a UPVC frame. It's common sense to put it on the brick work.

I know it's not just the weight of the ladder. The weight of a ladder with someone cleaning windows must obviously include the weight of the person cleaning the winders minus the effects of the angle. Der........

Of course it's common sense etc, etc, etc.

I suggest you write to all the window replacement companies to put warning stickers on the frames to warn of the dangers and at the same time, inform the H & S because they've obviously never looked into the problem and while you're at it, just pray the wind never blows hard other wise you'll be having to replace replace those window bolts.

Or to put it bluntly, and sorry if this sounds rude, I know BS when I smell it.