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Supreme brushes?
« on: November 11, 2021, 03:31:35 pm »
Been using Xtreme brushes of various forms for some time now but struggling with the limited line-up of current 26cm offerings and I can't stand sill brushes. What I'm struggling with most is the ability to get any meaningful bristle force into corners- particularly within recessed and sash windows., there's just not enough side splay. The Xtremes just falter when it comes to spiders nests etc. They also really bang on frames too.
The supreme is the only Gardiner brush that I've never used but I'm now thinking it may be worth a try. Obviously it's the weight I'm concerned about after using Xtremes, so can anyone who's has or does use both offer any insight? I miss the Xtreme with the boars hair inner bristles!
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NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2021, 03:58:07 pm »
For the type of windows you are describing you would be better off with something like an streamline brush,the actual bristles are longer and push in to the corners like you mention.
Alex used to make a brush like this years ago I still have one and save it for windows like this,the medium extreme is good enough and is able to do an adequate job on maintenance cleans and gets in to the corners just about enough it’s the one with the row of orange bristles on it.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2021, 04:01:45 pm »
Manufacturers seem to have gotten away from the old style shaped brush that we all started off with,the good thing about the older shaped brushes was it was easier to flick out spiders webs etc due to the shape especially on like you mention boxed Sash type windows.

High-Tower

  • Posts: 249
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2021, 04:07:08 pm »
Yes, supreme brush is what You are looking for. Love my tapertec jobby. Not too heavy, great cleaning power, good brush life. 10/10

KS Cleaning

  • Posts: 3900
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2021, 04:07:27 pm »
Been using Xtreme brushes of various forms for some time now but struggling with the limited line-up of current 26cm offerings and I can't stand sill brushes. What I'm struggling with most is the ability to get any meaningful bristle force into corners- particularly within recessed and sash windows., there's just not enough side splay. The Xtremes just falter when it comes to spiders nests etc. They also really bang on frames too.
The supreme is the only Gardiner brush that I've never used but I'm now thinking it may be worth a try. Obviously it's the weight I'm concerned about after using Xtremes, so can anyone who's has or does use both offer any insight? I miss the Xtreme with the boars hair inner bristles!
I find the Ultimate the best all round brush and they come in a variety of bristle types. I don’t like the shape of the Supreme, any brush that is rounded at the end isn’t going to be the best for getting into corners IMO.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2021, 04:09:27 pm »
The Supreme DuPont is almost the worst brush I’ve ever used.

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  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2021, 05:18:16 pm »
Been using Xtreme brushes of various forms for some time now but struggling with the limited line-up of current 26cm offerings and I can't stand sill brushes. What I'm struggling with most is the ability to get any meaningful bristle force into corners- particularly within recessed and sash windows., there's just not enough side splay. The Xtremes just falter when it comes to spiders nests etc. They also really bang on frames too.
The supreme is the only Gardiner brush that I've never used but I'm now thinking it may be worth a try. Obviously it's the weight I'm concerned about after using Xtremes, so can anyone who's has or does use both offer any insight? I miss the Xtreme with the boars hair inner bristles!
I find the Ultimate the best all round brush and they come in a variety of bristle types. I don’t like the shape of the Supreme, any brush that is rounded at the end isn’t going to be the best for getting into corners IMO.

That's the very reason I've never tried one.
Got me thinking recently about those aerial brushes that some used to rave about (remember them?) They were the same shape as the supremes are now.
I'm not getting any younger either so trying to avoid brushes which require excess force all the time too.
It's the age old wfp quandary....brushes- weight Vs effectiveness. I've been at this game 17 years too!😁
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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2021, 05:23:16 pm »
The Supreme DuPont is almost the worst brush I’ve ever used.

That's the one I was going to buy.😬
See..... here's the thing. To me the Xtreme flocked sill is the words worst brush, utterly useless, but some on here love them. To me they are totally ineffective,  a bit like using a mop instead of a brush.
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richard connett

  • Posts: 293
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2021, 05:28:40 pm »
Supreme DuPont is my main brush of choice now. Perfect mix of weight, splay, durability and sill cleaning ability. The longer bristles will get out spiders webs and stop you knocking / scratching frames . Try one

High-Tower

  • Posts: 249
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2021, 05:49:48 pm »
The rounded shape of the stock makes it perfect for getting into the corners, it’s narrower and the bristles splay in and arch and hook all the crap out.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2021, 06:10:37 pm »
Yeah we all have our preferences if  someone said to me you can only have just 2 brushes 1 would be the extreme flocked sill and the 2nd would be the extreme medium tapertec,I could clean near on everything with those 2 brushes.

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2021, 07:14:01 pm »
Yeah we all have our preferences if  someone said to me you can only have just 2 brushes 1 would be the extreme flocked sill and the 2nd would be the extreme medium tapertec,I could clean near on everything with those 2 brushes.

I like the Xtreme medium tapertec, if it had some natural splay at the ends it would probably be the perfect brush but for some reason, even with wear the bristles seem to taper inwards rather than the usual outwards :-\ :-\ as you drag the brush horizontal across the glass, the bristles fold in on themselves. A slight modification would correct this but I'm not sure of the direction Gardiners are going these days. For every giant leap forward, they seem to step back with another.
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NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2021, 07:23:20 pm »
I think you can get too caught up on how big the brush needs to be to clean a window adequately I know I used to think like that,the flocked extreme deals very well with heavily soiled windows or even a first clean the medium will do the same with little effort especially with hot water.
I’ve trialed a super lite verses an extreme and the results are the same with less effort and weight needed,if you use an extreme day in day out any extra weight at the end of the pole you’ll easily notice if it does the job and it’s half the weight almost or at least it feels like that it’s a no brainer.

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2021, 07:32:23 pm »
I think you can get too caught up on how big the brush needs to be to clean a window adequately I know I used to think like that,the flocked extreme deals very well with heavily soiled windows or even a first clean the medium will do the same with little effort especially with hot water.
I’ve trialed a super lite verses an extreme and the results are the same with less effort and weight needed,if you use an extreme day in day out any extra weight at the end of the pole you’ll easily notice if it does the job and it’s half the weight almost or at least it feels like that it’s a no brainer.

It's not it's general cleaning ability I'm questioning. It's the ability to do specific things. You can spend a lot of unnecessary time trying to hook one or more spiders nests out of a window- even though the rest of the glass is perfect. Any brush will clean a pane of glass perfectly but there's no point having the ability to clean that pane in three seconds if then it takes you over a minute to hook a tiny spiders nest out the corner. This is where it get's annoying because you can see where the problem lies and the designer and manufacturer should have had this nailed years ago! ;D ;D
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Splash & dash

  • Posts: 4364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2021, 07:44:44 pm »
The supreme still is our go to brush , we have tried them all but much prefer the supreme it’s splay is excellent scrubbing power good and best brush with hot water by far , the bristles are a bit longer to which is good for getting under gutters

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #15 on: November 11, 2021, 08:12:50 pm »
I have said years ago that the brushes need stiff bristles at each end about 3 rows in stiff only for this purpose,I believe this makes things complicated or more difficult when making them or it would have been done although it looks similar to this on that horrible banana 🍌 shaped brush some manufacturers make lol.

richard connett

  • Posts: 293
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #16 on: November 11, 2021, 08:35:43 pm »
I think you need a brush which stays in shape for longer. Most of them are good at spiders nests at first. It’s how they look after 8 weeks
That’s what’s impressed me about the supreme tapertec

windowswashed

  • Posts: 2531
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2021, 09:55:59 pm »
Can't beat a radial lite for windows with spiders nests in the corners, brilliant for first cleans and the most stubborn spiders nest. Challenge any Gardiner brush to remove spiders nest as easily as a radial lite, hands down much easier using a rolling motion into the corners.

Splash & dash

  • Posts: 4364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #18 on: November 11, 2021, 10:15:55 pm »
Can't beat a radial lite for windows with spiders nests in the corners, brilliant for first cleans and the most stubborn spiders nest. Challenge any Gardiner brush to remove spiders nest as easily as a radial lite, hands down much easier using a rolling motion into the corners.


Ime always happy to try new things but £150 for a brush  that looks like it’s hardly got any bristles seams a bit steep to me , I haven’t used one though it would be interesting tk hear from ones that do use them

Jonny 87

  • Posts: 3483
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2021, 07:25:55 am »
Supremes are all we use now. They are our brush of choice.

Great for cleaning sills because of the splay, and great for getting into corners. The longer bristles and splay means you can flick out spiders no problem.

The bristle type is then all just preference. We use the stiff supreme because we use hot water and it’s perfect.

We found the DuPont supreme great for cold water use too.
Vision Technician / Visual Engineer /  Vision Enhancement Operative /...........................................................OnlyUseMeWFP AkA Jonny the Windy Wesher

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2021, 07:29:33 am »
The Supreme DuPont is almost the worst brush I’ve ever used.

For what reasons NWH?
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֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2021, 11:39:34 am »
Well, I've ordered the supreme dupont.
£66 for a brush with no socket, another set of jets I Don't need and a plastic gooseneck!
If this turns out to be as crap as the Xtreme flocked them I'm going to have to look at alternative suppliers- something I thought I would never have to say. When you can't even get jet placement 100%, it raises concerns.
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JandS

  • Posts: 4238
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2021, 11:48:52 am »
Ultimate medium with rinse bar all day long......good for FSG cleaning when they get older with fan jets to spray the cleaning solution on.
Impossible done straight away, miracles can take a little longer.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2021, 04:13:56 pm »
66 notes for 1 supreme DuPont brush lol if you use hot water with that particular brush you’ll kill it within hours

֍Winp®oClean֍

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #24 on: November 12, 2021, 08:10:03 pm »
66 notes for 1 supreme DuPont brush lol if you use hot water with that particular brush you’ll kill it within hours

That did include a new plastic neck too.😁
No hot water for me, just the immersion on the very coldest of winter days.
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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #25 on: November 12, 2021, 08:17:17 pm »
I was considering a 35cm Xtreme until I realised that the jet positioning compels you to use all Four jets! There's not the option to use a 35cm brush with just Two jets as the jets are either extreme center or extreme edge. I have to say, I'm a little bewildered with Gardiners recent direction- particularly with brushes!
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NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #26 on: November 12, 2021, 08:23:32 pm »
That wide DuPont type brush is very good also and it will last with warm water I’ve used it with hot and it’s stood up well although I’m not constantly using it in the pole day in day out,well worth buying that one how much is that one now 200 quid lol blimey 60 quid is a lot of money for a supreme if that’s what they want these days.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2021, 08:26:32 pm »
I did a con roof with a DuPont supreme with hot water when I finished it the brush was so badly deformed it was beyond saving even with hot and colding it trying to get it back in to shape,I can see why people may like them on  glass with no obstacles like bars or lead  but I can’t see it beyond that.

֍Winp®oClean֍

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #28 on: November 12, 2021, 08:36:09 pm »
Well, we'll have to wait and see. I don't mind the cost if it does what it's supposed to do. Although, I do have 10 spare sets of jet capsules now, which defeats one of their fundamental purposes.
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DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #29 on: November 12, 2021, 08:44:54 pm »
In my opinion……..
The Supreme is not good. It’s splayed too wide, rams the bristle tips into leaded windows and is too heavy.
My favourite is Winpros useless mop, the flocked Extreme. I love it, holds it’s shape well but wears before your eyes! It’s the only brush I’ve worn out ever! Gone through four now in probably a year. Useless in corners and sash windows too and the stock hammers the frames.
The worst Gardiners brush I have ever bought has to be the radial sill brush, what a joke! Designed all wrong. However …… trim the stupid outer bristles back level with the stiff under bristles and it’s pretty good for cleaning the runners on sash windows.

DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #30 on: November 12, 2021, 08:49:39 pm »
Gardiners scraper attachment is pretty good for Spiders nests …… if there is enough room.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #31 on: November 12, 2021, 09:12:52 pm »
If it’s spiders webs in corners that is the main problem forget the brush just use a swivel, the top section of the pole stops you being able to get in to the corner,a twist of the wrist will push the corner of the brush under the sash without being obstructed.

֍Winp®oClean֍

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #32 on: November 12, 2021, 09:45:02 pm »
It's not all about spiders nests.😁
I've used a swivel since Gaz first brought them to the black market. I designed Gardiners first production swivel (I still have the drawings, and possibly the prototype). I have been WFP for over 17 years. I have tested and consulted on countless brushes and and equipment in the past- experience isn't the issue.😁
I'm just surprised (trying to be polite) that we are where we are today with WFP brushes in general but I'd expect much better from Gardiners, I'm struggling to to find justification for the current offerings. Can't help but wonder if we're going backwards rather than progressing. Gardiners have produced better brushes in the past than what is on offer currently. Some very fundamental aspects are wrong.
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KS Cleaning

  • Posts: 3900
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #33 on: November 12, 2021, 10:21:02 pm »
I was considering a 35cm Xtreme until I realised that the jet positioning compels you to use all Four jets! There's not the option to use a 35cm brush with just Two jets as the jets are either extreme center or extreme edge. I have to say, I'm a little bewildered with Gardiners recent direction- particularly with brushes!
I got the 1.2mm capsules on my latest 35cm ultimate brush, I find them a big improvement compared to using 4 of the 2mm capsules. I actually find the jet positioning good when using 4 jets, less side to side movement is required when rinsing as the 4 jet locations cover a wider area.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2021, 10:28:39 pm »
I have told Alex I have brushes which are years old that are better than a lot of the current ones they have longer more flexible bristles that don’t lose shape,I’ve kept a couple for certain windows one being these boxed sash windows they are able to solve this problem by getting right in to the corners by pushing the brush flatter on the glass.

Spruce

  • Posts: 8364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2021, 02:01:13 pm »
It's not all about spiders nests.😁
I've used a swivel since Gaz first brought them to the black market. I designed Gardiners first production swivel (I still have the drawings, and possibly the prototype). I have been WFP for over 17 years. I have tested and consulted on countless brushes and and equipment in the past- experience isn't the issue.😁
I'm just surprised (trying to be polite) that we are where we are today with WFP brushes in general but I'd expect much better from Gardiners, I'm struggling to to find justification for the current offerings. Can't help but wonder if we're going backwards rather than progressing. Gardiners have produced better brushes in the past than what is on offer currently. Some very fundamental aspects are wrong.

Ah, Gaz.
That reminds me! He came back on the forums hoping no one would recognise him. When we did, he quickly disappeared. If he is still on under a totally different name, you still owe me 2 swivel brushes that I paid for that you never sent.
Success is 1% inspiration, 98% perspiration and 2% attention to detail!

The older I get, the better I was ;)

dd

  • Posts: 2527
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #36 on: November 14, 2021, 02:13:54 pm »
It's not all about spiders nests.😁
I've used a swivel since Gaz first brought them to the black market. I designed Gardiners first production swivel (I still have the drawings, and possibly the prototype). I have been WFP for over 17 years. I have tested and consulted on countless brushes and and equipment in the past- experience isn't the issue.😁
I'm just surprised (trying to be polite) that we are where we are today with WFP brushes in general but I'd expect much better from Gardiners, I'm struggling to to find justification for the current offerings. Can't help but wonder if we're going backwards rather than progressing. Gardiners have produced better brushes in the past than what is on offer currently. Some very fundamental aspects are wrong.
The newer supreme dupont splays more than the older one. IMO the older supreme dupont one is a better brush.

I only ordered a second one recently as occasionally I use fan jets, and prefer to swap the brush rather than the jets.

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #37 on: November 14, 2021, 02:50:35 pm »
It's not all about spiders nests.😁
I've used a swivel since Gaz first brought them to the black market. I designed Gardiners first production swivel (I still have the drawings, and possibly the prototype). I have been WFP for over 17 years. I have tested and consulted on countless brushes and and equipment in the past- experience isn't the issue.😁
I'm just surprised (trying to be polite) that we are where we are today with WFP brushes in general but I'd expect much better from Gardiners, I'm struggling to to find justification for the current offerings. Can't help but wonder if we're going backwards rather than progressing. Gardiners have produced better brushes in the past than what is on offer currently. Some very fundamental aspects are wrong.
The newer supreme dupont splays more than the older one. IMO the older supreme dupont one is a better brush.

I only ordered a second one recently as occasionally I use fan jets, and prefer to swap the brush rather than the jets.

There's nothing more frustrating than a supplier changing a product for one that is worse than the one it's replacing. Unfortunately, this has been seen to happen to often IMO. If it ain't broken don't fix it until you can improve upon it.
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richard connett

  • Posts: 293
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #38 on: November 14, 2021, 03:37:31 pm »
Will be in interesting to hear your thoughts after a few days using it.  Strange the things us window cleaners find interesting

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #39 on: November 14, 2021, 03:56:15 pm »
The supreme brush is hopeless on Georgian windows with bars and lead also unless you spend all day cleaning UPVC I wouldn’t bother getting one.

SB Cleaning

  • Posts: 4231
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #40 on: November 14, 2021, 04:00:10 pm »
I'm not a fan of Gardiner brushes these days they seem like they are a lot more money but a lower quality.

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #41 on: November 14, 2021, 05:38:12 pm »
I'm not a fan of Gardiner brushes these days they seem like they are a lot more money but a lower quality.

Something along those lines!
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DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #42 on: November 14, 2021, 11:08:04 pm »
Dupont bristles are nothing special either. Look and feel nice when new but still go out of shape.

dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #43 on: November 15, 2021, 06:50:43 pm »
I've got a stiff supreme brush and I like it,I don't use it all the time but it has its uses(I find it great for spiders nests in the corners of frames)...... the xtreme brushes  however are my number 1 brushes because they are  just so damn light and make for an easier working day...
price higher/work harder!

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #44 on: November 16, 2021, 05:16:16 pm »
Well, as I said, this is the only Gardiner brush that I've never tried. I can now confirm I'm satisfied that I've been missing absolutely nothing!😁 Just another brush with major fundamental flaws.
The bristles are too long, I've reduced them by approx 8mm and this significantly improves it's standard form.
Dupont bristles are definitely the wrong choice for this brush IMO. They hold water like a shammy leather which really increases it's weight in use. It would be much better suited to the medium orange as featured on the Ultimate.
Another issue, now common across the Gardiner range is the huge gap in bristle area to accommodate the new jet capsules- exacerbated with narrow stocks like this and the Xtreme. There's a good 1" gap on either side which is only covered by Two bristle clumps, in a single row both top and bottom. There is room for more but none are there. It's also annoying to have to pay for jets that you don't need. I don't mind contributing to tooling costs if the end product is worth it!😁
The cut ends ofcthe bristles are terrible. The tips look like they've been subjected to heat, like little bobbles on the very ends. The brush is also triple trim rather than dual. I'm not sure whether this is designed in or a fault.
It's just another shame, this brush could be made much better but there again, I'm struggling to see an actual requirement for it. It's near enough the same weight as the Ultimate but The Ultimate is Ten times better! It was nice however not to be banging into frames and to whip spiders nests out almost instantly! I have made some more minor modifications to it tonight so we'll see what tomorrow brings but I'm not hopeful as I think its fundamentally too wrong, we'll see.
Think it'll be back to the Ultimate while I see what else the rest of the market has to offer.👍

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DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #45 on: November 16, 2021, 06:43:45 pm »
 ;D
I’ve got two in the van I never use, flocked and mono.
I must stick them on ebay.
Also have a brand new Ultimate with Dupont bristles I’ll probably never use (it’s better than the Supreme).

 

DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #46 on: November 16, 2021, 06:49:43 pm »
  Betyou haven’t tried one of these  ;D

SB Cleaning

  • Posts: 4231
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #47 on: November 16, 2021, 06:57:24 pm »
I've just ordered another Dupont X line, I had nearly 12 months out of the one im using and it will still be good for conny roofs/ fascias for a while yet...
They are heavy but the longevity and scrubbing power is excellent.


֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #48 on: November 16, 2021, 07:07:51 pm »
  Betyou haven’t tried one of these  ;D

Yeah, like I said, the direction Gardiners are going in regarding brushes is..... perplexing! ;D

Are you still going from frames to panes?? ;)
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DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #49 on: November 16, 2021, 07:17:28 pm »
I do  ;)

֍Winp®oClean֍

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #50 on: November 16, 2021, 07:19:16 pm »
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NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #51 on: November 16, 2021, 09:29:49 pm »
If you use hot water you have even less choice.

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #52 on: November 16, 2021, 09:50:44 pm »
If you use hot water you have even less choice.

I'm glad I don't, hating sill brushes limits my choice enough as it is!!
A normal brush with a swivel cleans sills better and easier than a sill brush on a fixed neck. There was never a substantial requirement for sill brushes to begin with IMO. Buy a swivel, learn how to use it, you'll soon wonder how you ever managed without it is my advice!👍
Let's get back to some proper brush development instead of these toys.
We're now paying boutique prices for barely mediocre products!
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Granny

  • Posts: 822
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #53 on: November 17, 2021, 10:13:32 am »
That sill brush with the bristles sticking out of the side would be a disaster for us on the Victorian sandstone houses in this area (Yorkshire).
Catch that on the reveal and sand will be everywhere and on the brush too.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #54 on: November 17, 2021, 10:18:47 am »
The extreme sill brushes are good for keeping  everything clean  the bottom row also acts as a protector against scratching them,each to their own but I can’t see why people choose a much heavier brush over them even if they don’t last them as long.

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #55 on: November 17, 2021, 12:24:39 pm »
The extreme sill brushes are good for keeping  everything clean  the bottom row also acts as a protector against scratching them,each to their own but I can’t see why people choose a much heavier brush over them even if they don’t last them as long.

Read my first post, it gives you a full explanation. They're light, the good ends there!🙂
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NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #56 on: November 17, 2021, 01:57:47 pm »
Yeah I find them adequate for my work tbh I’ve used just about every brush and most shapes and sizes,a brush can feel it’s doing a better job but in reality it’s no better than one that’s bigger and heavier.
You can say what you like about the Gardiner’s brushes but I can almost guarantee Alex wouldn’t sell a brush unless it did a job,it would be nice if they lasted a bit longer but the overall clean with them is good.

richard connett

  • Posts: 293
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #57 on: November 17, 2021, 04:04:06 pm »
You didn’t say about the ultimate just about extremes . What you’ve done is turned your supreme into an ultimate ! I would have used the supreme a bit longer before getting the scissors out . I get what you mean about brushes though. It seems there’s loads more developments to be made and there never seems to be the perfect brush

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #58 on: November 17, 2021, 04:22:35 pm »
You didn’t say about the ultimate just about extremes . What you’ve done is turned your supreme into an ultimate ! I would have used the supreme a bit longer before getting the scissors out . I get what you mean about brushes though. It seems there’s loads more developments to be made and there never seems to be the perfect brush

You are almost right Richard. I've finished the tweaks and created a very good brush. If I had bought this brush, as it is now, I would have been very pleased as it's now more usable, more effective, more efficient and lighter in use. I will post some pictures later.

NWH ... it's about constructive criticism, honest opinion, feedback and suggestions for improvement. Without this, progress and direction can be hindered. You stated yourself that Gardiners produced better brushes in the past- so you must conclude that some current offerings are inferior to what came before them? I know brushes are subjective and personal but we are talking about some pretty fundamental aspects here, that at this level shouldn't be getting to the end user IMO.🙂👍
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DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #59 on: November 17, 2021, 06:07:20 pm »
Gardiners have a massive range of brushes and have used all types of bristles in the past so can’t knock them for trying. Ultimates probably deserve the name (superlights didn’t). Extremes are exactly that - bare minimum. My biggest bugbear are bristles that curl out of shape. The Extreme sill takes some getting used to especially on a swivel and the bottom row obstructs your vision.
With prices going through the roof I want something that lasts longer. I can actually measure the wear on my Extreme flocked. The one I’m using now is nearly a centimetre down.
I changed to X- lines a couple of years back but they really didn’t suit an Extreme pole.

dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #60 on: November 17, 2021, 07:58:34 pm »
I'm using a taper tec xtreme brush at the moment for most work...works ok on leaded too....

There is absolutely no need for anything heavier for most of my regular work at all....
price higher/work harder!

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #61 on: November 17, 2021, 08:20:30 pm »
Here's the pictures. I've placed it next to a standard Xtreme (worn) for perspective. It wasn't difficult to trim the brush with scissors but does require patience. For me, it's now a very usable brush, still retains it's 'softness' and splay and requires very little effort. I like the stock, it's lovely and slim with no brutal edges and even with the reduced bristle length, it still doesn't abuse the window frames like the Xtremes do. It's considerably more effective and efficient over the Xtreme in return for a little weight and it 'should' last considerably longer too. In standard form, other than possibly gutter cleaning,  I just can't understand how it could seriously be considered as a window cleaning brush. It may have the odd specific use but in general terms, it's a misfit IMO.
And again, just my opinion.
Comfortably Numb!

dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #62 on: November 18, 2021, 10:54:25 pm »
Winpro I think you need a different hobby other than fannying about with brushes.... ;D

All Gardiner brushes are usable as they are...no need to start cutting bristles down!
price higher/work harder!

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  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #63 on: November 18, 2021, 11:46:01 pm »
Winpro I think you need a different hobby other than fannying about with brushes.... ;D

All Gardiner brushes are usable as they are...no need to start cutting bristles down!

Depends what you consider usable. You could use it yes, but it can very easily be made Ten times better. You should have the option not to have to keep buying jets that you don't need- just like you do with brush sockets. Gardiners, IMO are going backwards with their brushes, you've just got used to using poor brushes. I can show you an Xtreme that was made probably 7/8 years ago and it knocks spots off the very latest versions! They also lasted considerably longer too. While ever you accept this uncritically, you'll continue to receive it. The Ultimate is the only current brush that could genuinely be classed as a every day brush. The current Xtremes are terrible and the supremes unnecessarily so- as shown above. I've always been a fan of Gardiners from day one, the new 'water through' neck is genius for uni-valve users but..... I'm perplexed at their brush development/direction and I'm not alone.
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dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #64 on: November 19, 2021, 02:51:18 pm »
What is wrong with the xtreme brushes then mate?
I virtually use them all the time,currently I'm using taper tec standard size xtreme brushes....they are fine for regular work but for a very dirty first clean I'd use a supreme or ultimate brush
price higher/work harder!

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #65 on: November 19, 2021, 04:23:09 pm »
I only use extreme brushes these days I would say a slightly heavier brush would be better above 3 floors as it would give better pressure on the glass.

robbo333

  • Posts: 2407
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #66 on: November 19, 2021, 05:17:04 pm »
I use the Xtreme sill brush, great brush.  I also didn't like the orange bristles, which obscured my view, so I pulled them out. On my new, brush i've left them on and I have to say it is far more efficient with them left on.

The old Supreme with the black inner bristles is a lovely brush, the best brush for leaded by far and great for fsg cleans. The latest one, with the white inner bristles, is lighter, but feels more like a damp cloth and doesn't glide over square lead quite so smoothly.

I've adapted brushes too. I cut the ends of an old ultimate to about 5mm before the pencil jets. Then I trimmed the bristles to about 6mm long . It's like a giant tooth brush and is brilliant for anything 'stubborn'!

I can clean efficiently, quickly, and to a good standard, with a lightweight sill brush. Job done for me.


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Splash & dash

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Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #67 on: November 19, 2021, 05:19:48 pm »
I only use extreme brushes these days I would say a slightly heavier brush would be better above 3 floors as it would give better pressure on the glass.



I find hot water kills the extream brush in less than 3 weeks ?? How do you manage with them ???

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #68 on: November 19, 2021, 05:55:41 pm »
Firstly, it's a struggle to get into corners with them and if you do manage, then they're not very effective at removing spiders nests etc.. The over extended stock makes this even worse, I have a complex of barn conversions with approx 2" deep frames and the Xtreme can't even get into these corners at all, the stock prevents it happening.
Then, you have jet placement. On the sill version it's correct but the none sill, for whatever reason, the jets are too close to the center. A minor fault you might think but it shouldn't be happening at this cost and from such a experienced company IMO.
Then you have the wear rate. This I suppose is the trade off for weight but these things literally wear out in weeks. My medium tapertec was past it's sell by date after 3/4 weeks. It started off ok but the bristles began to bend inwards, rather than the usual outwards, which renders it useless even quicker than normal as it exacerbates the inability to get into corners even more.
They also really bang into the frames, which isn't good. The sill version IMO is just a joke, it completely ruins the brush and seriously hinders your view of the rest of the brush. Two skinny rows of skinny bristles aren't really going to clean a sill effectively anyway, you're just kidding yourself ;D But unfortunately, this seems to be where the focus is being directed- a swivel is far more effective and you can use a normal, better brush to boot.
Then there's the jet capsules, great in theory but how many people really change jets in the same brush? I don't and I don't know of anyone else personally who does. most people tend to pick one favorite, either fans or pencil. In order to accommodate the capsules far more bristles have to be removed- something that an Xtreme can little afford, if at all.  You look through the brush in use to a light background like a skylight and you'll see considerable gaps where there's barely anything touching the glass. This makes the brush less efficient, it's lighter but less efficient. It's less efficient with harder cleaning too, like bird poo etc. and even worse on cobwebs that have hit the glass (take a closer, second look and you'll see)- sometimes taking some considerable time and effort to move on. All this begins to eat into the benefits of it's lighter weight and the balance, or trade off becomes narrower. Add to that, the fact that you have to buy a new set for every brush purchase so end up with a van full of them that you'll never use.
This might sound like a real moan, and you'd have a point but..... I think a lot of these issues could be put right or shouldn't have happened to begin with as the tooling will have to be paid for so could be stuck with them for some time. ;D
The current form of Xtreme isn't IMO as good as the early versions that had a stock more akin to the supreme and had thicker bristle clumps. There have been glimmers of hope like the natural/boars? hair inner Xtreme and the tapertec but the latter faltered too soon. It's kind of frustrating because I think a far better Xtreme could be made that would be more universally suitable, usable and have a longer 'usable' service life- instead the lure of the weight saving over the other options seems to compel us to accept what's on offer. You just can't beat a good, proper brush that has most of the desired qualities instead of heaps of brushes that do one or two things effectively and miss out on the rest.
Comfortably Numb!

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #69 on: November 19, 2021, 06:04:19 pm »
I only use extreme brushes these days I would say a slightly heavier brush would be better above 3 floors as it would give better pressure on the glass.



I find hot water kills the extream brush in less than 3 weeks ?? How do you manage with them ???

The flocked extreme I find copes very well with hot water as does the extreme medium with the row of orange bristles,like I said before Splash I alternate them if you use any brush day after day job after job with hot water you’ll kill em quicker than you will with cold,saying that the 2 I mention do stand up well to hot water.
The stiff extreme gets mullered a lot quicker with hot water although great when new it doesn’t hold its shape long enough.

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #70 on: November 19, 2021, 06:06:47 pm »
The stiff extreme is the best for getting spiders nests out of the corners,that’s the only time I’m keen to put that on the pole if I can see those dreaded yellow round balls under a sash or in the corners of multiple windows.

DJW

  • Posts: 933
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #71 on: November 19, 2021, 06:18:30 pm »
Why do you alternate them? Do they miraculously repair themselves overnight?


dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #72 on: November 19, 2021, 06:27:22 pm »
Surely you don't throw a brush away after 3 weeks just cos it's gone out of shape!

The answer is (ironically)boiling hot water...just pour it over the bristles and leave it in a bowl for 5 mins,they come out brand new again...

I use a supreme brush on a 10in carbon gooseneck for sash windows with deep ledges,works a treat on spider eggs in the corner of frames....👍
price higher/work harder!

dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #73 on: November 19, 2021, 06:35:23 pm »
Firstly, it's a struggle to get into corners with them and if you do manage, then they're not very effective at removing spiders nests etc.. The over extended stock makes this even worse, I have a complex of barn conversions with approx 2" deep frames and the Xtreme can't even get into these corners at all, the stock prevents it happening.
Then, you have jet placement. On the sill version it's correct but the none sill, for whatever reason, the jets are too close to the center. A minor fault you might think but it shouldn't be happening at this cost and from such a experienced company IMO.
Then you have the wear rate. This I suppose is the trade off for weight but these things literally wear out in weeks. My medium tapertec was past it's sell by date after 3/4 weeks. It started off ok but the bristles began to bend inwards, rather than the usual outwards, which renders it useless even quicker than normal as it exacerbates the inability to get into corners even more.
They also really bang into the frames, which isn't good. The sill version IMO is just a joke, it completely ruins the brush and seriously hinders your view of the rest of the brush. Two skinny rows of skinny bristles aren't really going to clean a sill effectively anyway, you're just kidding yourself ;D But unfortunately, this seems to be where the focus is being directed- a swivel is far more effective and you can use a normal, better brush to boot.
Then there's the jet capsules, great in theory but how many people really change jets in the same brush? I don't and I don't know of anyone else personally who does. most people tend to pick one favorite, either fans or pencil. In order to accommodate the capsules far more bristles have to be removed- something that an Xtreme can little afford, if at all.  You look through the brush in use to a light background like a skylight and you'll see considerable gaps where there's barely anything touching the glass. This makes the brush less efficient, it's lighter but less efficient. It's less efficient with harder cleaning too, like bird poo etc. and even worse on cobwebs that have hit the glass (take a closer, second look and you'll see)- sometimes taking some considerable time and effort to move on. All this begins to eat into the benefits of it's lighter weight and the balance, or trade off becomes narrower. Add to that, the fact that you have to buy a new set for every brush purchase so end up with a van full of them that you'll never use.
This might sound like a real moan, and you'd have a point but..... I think a lot of these issues could be put right or shouldn't have happened to begin with as the tooling will have to be paid for so could be stuck with them for some time. ;D
The current form of Xtreme isn't IMO as good as the early versions that had a stock more akin to the supreme and had thicker bristle clumps. There have been glimmers of hope like the natural/boars? hair inner Xtreme and the tapertec but the latter faltered too soon. It's kind of frustrating because I think a far better Xtreme could be made that would be more universally suitable, usable and have a longer 'usable' service life- instead the lure of the weight saving over the other options seems to compel us to accept what's on offer. You just can't beat a good, proper brush that has most of the desired qualities instead of heaps of brushes that do one or two things effectively and miss out on the rest.

Jet placement doesn't bother me one bit....I don't even notice

Spider eggs don't either as the supreme is excellent for flicking them out and the extremes will even if it takes a bit longer...

Stock banging on frames...again not a problem unless your rushing....

My stiff supreme is 10 months old and will last at least another 10 months....

Xtreme brushes last around 3 or 4 months....I can live with that.... ;D
price higher/work harder!

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #74 on: November 19, 2021, 07:03:42 pm »
Why do you alternate them? Do they miraculously repair themselves overnight?

If you don’t alternate them you ruin them beyond repair if you just leave it on you bend the bristles so much so they just stay flat,I’ll put one on for the day and then change it the following morning.

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #75 on: November 19, 2021, 07:07:57 pm »
Why do you alternate them? Do they miraculously repair themselves overnight?

If you don’t alternate them you ruin them beyond repair if you just leave it on you bend the bristles so much so they just stay flat,I’ll put one on for the day and then change it the following morning.

Kind of proves my point!😁
Comfortably Numb!

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #76 on: November 19, 2021, 07:08:39 pm »
Your technique has a lot to do with how long a brush lasts no end.

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #77 on: November 19, 2021, 07:14:49 pm »
Your technique has a lot to do with how long a brush lasts no end.

It shouldn't have to though. Again, you are having to 'manage' a brush!
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NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #78 on: November 19, 2021, 07:49:42 pm »
Yeah I know what your saying they don’t last hence why I have to alternate or you just end up with a useless brush in no time,I see some people really squashing the brush in to the sides of the window on regular cleans and that’s one of the main reasons they don’t last 5 minutes.
I’m not saying you are wrong your right they should last longer I’m just giving my example of how I make them last a bit longer I have about 8-10 different brushes in the van and rotate them when I feel I’ve hammered 1 on a job.

Splash & dash

  • Posts: 4364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #79 on: November 19, 2021, 09:26:52 pm »
Surely you don't throw a brush away after 3 weeks just cos it's gone out of shape!

The answer is (ironically)boiling hot water...just pour it over the bristles and leave it in a bowl for 5 mins,they come out brand new again...

I use a supreme brush on a 10in carbon gooseneck for sash windows with deep ledges,works a treat on spider eggs in the corner of frames....👍



Tried that and yes it will straighten them to a degree but they go out of shape again after a couple of hours use .

Splash & dash

  • Posts: 4364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #80 on: November 19, 2021, 09:30:16 pm »
Yeah I know what your saying they don’t last hence why I have to alternate or you just end up with a useless brush in no time,I see some people really squashing the brush in to the sides of the window on regular cleans and that’s one of the main reasons they don’t last 5 minutes.
I’m not saying you are wrong your right they should last longer I’m just giving my example of how I make them last a bit longer I have about 8-10 different brushes in the van and rotate them when I feel I’ve hammered 1 on a job.





That’s floored reasoning if you stop using a brush of course it will last longer it’s not being used if you alternate brushes they won’t last any longer than using using one brush until it’s knackered if a brush lasts for 100 hours use wether it’s 100 hours over a week or year it’s still 100 hours use

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #81 on: November 19, 2021, 09:48:02 pm »
Not really if you use a brush nearly all day long with hot water as you know the heat will deform the brush quicker,some brushes especially the tapertec ones once out of shape they’ve had it.
I’ll take a brush to the brink but I won’t flatten it out and deform the edges I’ll swap it over rinse that brush through and give it a break,it’s worked for me what you are saying makes sense in hours used overall etc but using a single brush consistently day in day out with “Hot Water” will kill it quicker in my experience.
The answer is make a brush that lasts and works well with hot water as well as cold water,a few rows of stiffer bristles round the outside would go a long way to helping.
It’s not that this isn’t known it’s  the machining of it which is the hurdle.

Lee GLS

  • Posts: 3843
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #82 on: November 21, 2021, 10:49:46 am »
I love the 35cm tapertec xtreme sill.  I find the sill bristles good for cleaning, easier and quicker than trying to clean the sills with a standard brush and swivel,  the last quote a while too 3/4 months, and love using 4 jets makes rinsing so much quicker. They aren’t perfect, the do band the frames if not careful, but no brush is perfect and I don’t think any brush will ever be perfect.

dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #83 on: November 21, 2021, 12:55:27 pm »
Not really if you use a brush nearly all day long with hot water as you know the heat will deform the brush quicker,some brushes especially the tapertec ones once out of shape they’ve had it.
I’ll take a brush to the brink but I won’t flatten it out and deform the edges I’ll swap it over rinse that brush through and give it a break,it’s worked for me what you are saying makes sense in hours used overall etc but using a single brush consistently day in day out with “Hot Water” will kill it quicker in my experience.
The answer is make a brush that lasts and works well with hot water as well as cold water,a few rows of stiffer bristles round the outside would go a long way to helping.
It’s not that this isn’t known it’s  the machining of it which is the hurdle.

the taper tec brushes are fine....their just like any other brushes that go out of shape....pour boiling water on them and they are good to go again....
price higher/work harder!

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #84 on: November 22, 2021, 04:28:58 pm »
After a little more tweaking the brush is even better now.  Might try and capture a couple of photos of it in use. It's now more like a rectangular brush with round ends rather than an entirely oval affair.  It's kept a lovely soft feel, is very effective, efficient and has a considerably lighter wet weight. Corners are no longer an issue whether sash, recessed or not. It's actually quite a bit of an animal now without the weight! Works great with a swivel too.💪😁💪
I would recommend anyone who has a worn one, or one they don't use to try the same, it's a totally different beast.👍
Comfortably Numb!

Ched

  • Posts: 425
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #85 on: November 22, 2021, 04:34:26 pm »
After a little more tweaking the brush is even better now.  Might try and capture a couple of photos of it in use. It's now more like a rectangular brush with round ends rather than an entirely oval affair.  It's kept a lovely soft feel, is very effective, efficient and has a considerably lighter wet weight. Corners are no longer an issue whether sash, recessed or not. It's actually quite a bit of an animal now without the weight! Works great with a swivel too.💪😁💪
I would recommend anyone who has a worn one, or one they don't use to try the same, it's a totally different beast.👍
Any picys of the finished brush?

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #86 on: November 22, 2021, 04:46:55 pm »
After a little more tweaking the brush is even better now.  Might try and capture a couple of photos of it in use. It's now more like a rectangular brush with round ends rather than an entirely oval affair.  It's kept a lovely soft feel, is very effective, efficient and has a considerably lighter wet weight. Corners are no longer an issue whether sash, recessed or not. It's actually quite a bit of an animal now without the weight! Works great with a swivel too.💪😁💪
I would recommend anyone who has a worn one, or one they don't use to try the same, it's a totally different beast.👍
Any picys of the finished brush?

I'll have a go in the next day or Two. Wonder if you can upload videos here?
Comfortably Numb!

Spruce

  • Posts: 8364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #87 on: November 23, 2021, 07:12:59 am »
After a little more tweaking the brush is even better now.  Might try and capture a couple of photos of it in use. It's now more like a rectangular brush with round ends rather than an entirely oval affair.  It's kept a lovely soft feel, is very effective, efficient and has a considerably lighter wet weight. Corners are no longer an issue whether sash, recessed or not. It's actually quite a bit of an animal now without the weight! Works great with a swivel too.💪😁💪
I would recommend anyone who has a worn one, or one they don't use to try the same, it's a totally different beast.👍
Any picys of the finished brush?

I'll have a go in the next day or Two. Wonder if you can upload videos here?

I think you have to upload it to Youtube (for example) and then put a link to it on here.
Success is 1% inspiration, 98% perspiration and 2% attention to detail!

The older I get, the better I was ;)

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #88 on: November 25, 2021, 06:15:28 pm »
A few pics from yesterday. A couple of these show the brush flattened on the glass so you can see it's maximum splay. Bear in mind,  these bristles clumps in original form were actually bending under their own weight they were so long!

Comfortably Numb!

Splash & dash

  • Posts: 4364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #89 on: November 25, 2021, 06:35:38 pm »
A few pics from yesterday. A couple of these show the brush flattened on the glass so you can see it's maximum splay. Bear in mind,  these bristles clumps in original form were actually bending under their own weight they were so long!






If you don’t like a brush that’s fine but why go to all this it modify it ??? Just buy one that you do like , we use nothing but the supreame brushes and love them I prefer the longer bristles get into the corners better than anything else , the splay is very good and useful, but I know we are all different and like different things from a brush .

dazmond

  • Posts: 23598
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #90 on: November 25, 2021, 06:41:10 pm »
I like using my supreme brush for certain jobs....I don't understand winpros need to start cutting bristles down... ::)roll

Whatever brush I use the windows still get cleaned and I get paid...that's all that matters to me....
price higher/work harder!

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #91 on: November 25, 2021, 07:01:19 pm »
A few pics from yesterday. A couple of these show the brush flattened on the glass so you can see it's maximum splay. Bear in mind,  these bristles clumps in original form were actually bending under their own weight they were so long!






If you don’t like a brush that’s fine but why go to all this it modify it ??? Just buy one that you do like , we use nothing but the supreame brushes and love them I prefer the longer bristles get into the corners better than anything else , the splay is very good and useful, but I know we are all different and like different things from a brush .

There isn't one I completely like, that's why!😁

There's a lot of brushes that do certain things well but there's no one brush that does lots of things well... the closest being the Ultimate- which is probably the most balanced brush in the Gardiner range. My point is that both the Xtremes and Supremes could be better, and by some margin! Cut the bristles down and see. I've now used BOTH so can speak from experience. Try it, you might just end up realising how bad it was to begin with, but unless you do, you'll never know.👍
I'll end up back on the Ultimate unless I find a none Gardiner that hits the spot.  I've got one of the original Xtremes that blows the pants off the current ones. Progress?
The idea was to make a £50 brush usable, I have achieved that. In standard form it's a yard broom at best. A very expensive one.👍
Comfortably Numb!

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #92 on: November 25, 2021, 07:43:00 pm »
Now going and use that with hot water and tell us what it’s like it’ll fold flatter than a fish 🐟

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #93 on: November 25, 2021, 08:11:50 pm »
Now going and use that with hot water and tell us what it’s like it’ll fold flatter than a fish 🐟

I don't use hot water, just like the majority of UK window cleaners.
Comfortably Numb!

NWH

  • Posts: 16952
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #94 on: November 25, 2021, 08:22:55 pm »
Ah right I see bit like working for NPower at the moment then reeling in all that wire.

Splash & dash

  • Posts: 4364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #95 on: November 25, 2021, 09:52:54 pm »
A few pics from yesterday. A couple of these show the brush flattened on the glass so you can see it's maximum splay. Bear in mind,  these bristles clumps in original form were actually bending under their own weight they were so long!






If you don’t like a brush that’s fine but why go to all this it modify it ??? Just buy one that you do like , we use nothing but the supreame brushes and love them I prefer the longer bristles get into the corners better than anything else , the splay is very good and useful, but I know we are all different and like different things from a brush .

There isn't one I completely like, that's why!😁

There's a lot of brushes that do certain things well but there's no one brush that does lots of things well... the closest being the Ultimate- which is probably the most balanced brush in the Gardiner range. My point is that both the Xtremes and Supremes could be better, and by some margin! Cut the bristles down and see. I've now used BOTH so can speak from experience. Try it, you might just end up realising how bad it was to begin with, but unless you do, you'll never know.👍
I'll end up back on the Ultimate unless I find a none Gardiner that hits the spot.  I've got one of the original Xtremes that blows the pants off the current ones. Progress?
The idea was to make a £50 brush usable, I have achieved that. In standard form it's a yard broom at best. A very expensive one.👍





We use hot water so that dramatically reduces the brush range due to heat damage , we find the supreame stiff are the brush we use 99% of the time , the longer bristles splay nicely on the glass getting into all the corners easily , they are excellent at getting under gutters , and nice and lite . I did try the ultimate but found the bristles to short and the stock hit any raised parts on the framework and as the bristles were so short they wouldn’t reach down the side of raised openers so that area could not be cleaned ,I feel that the supreame covers all bases and we have tried most brushes on the market , weight has discounted so many , the extream brushes I find last around 2 weeks and the rectangular stock hits frame work and walls . I think brushes are a very personal thing one man’s meat another man’s poison

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #96 on: November 30, 2021, 05:14:48 pm »
Put a Ultimate brush on yesterday and removed it after only 10 minutes, didn’t expect that. Much prefer this Xtreme-Supreme now! It's like an Xtreme on steroids!💪
Comfortably Numb!

Lee GLS

  • Posts: 3843
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #97 on: December 05, 2021, 09:36:55 am »
After a little more tweaking the brush is even better now.  Might try and capture a couple of photos of it in use. It's now more like a rectangular brush with round ends rather than an entirely oval affair.  It's kept a lovely soft feel, is very effective, efficient and has a considerably lighter wet weight. Corners are no longer an issue whether sash, recessed or not. It's actually quite a bit of an animal now without the weight! Works great with a swivel too.💪😁💪
I would recommend anyone who has a worn one, or one they don't use to try the same, it's a totally different beast.👍

How much have you trimmed off? I’ve got an old one I might try modifying, I agree the bristles standard are slightly too long.

Simon Trapani

  • Posts: 1482
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #98 on: December 05, 2021, 10:58:16 am »
I love the longer bristles on the Supreme. It's my new favourite brush. Only just switched my 25 slx pole to one. We were still using superlites. Everybody's different I guess. ;D

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  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #99 on: December 05, 2021, 02:05:36 pm »
I love the longer bristles on the Supreme. It's my new favourite brush. Only just switched my 25 slx pole to one. We were still using superlites. Everybody's different I guess. ;D

If you were using superlites before then you aren't going to notice much difference in wet weight I suspect. However, when you come backwards from Ultimate and Xtreme brushes then the standard supreme is equivalent to a yard broom!😁
The problem is, you haven't tried a shorter bristle, modified supreme. If you had, you might just now be agreeing with everything I've posted. I thought our car was fine before I had it remapped, only then did I realise just how poor it actually  was in standard form!
Comfortably Numb!

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #100 on: December 05, 2021, 02:18:08 pm »
After a little more tweaking the brush is even better now.  Might try and capture a couple of photos of it in use. It's now more like a rectangular brush with round ends rather than an entirely oval affair.  It's kept a lovely soft feel, is very effective, efficient and has a considerably lighter wet weight. Corners are no longer an issue whether sash, recessed or not. It's actually quite a bit of an animal now without the weight! Works great with a swivel too.💪😁💪
I would recommend anyone who has a worn one, or one they don't use to try the same, it's a totally different beast.👍

How much have you trimmed off? I’ve got an old one I might try modifying, I agree the bristles standard are slightly too long.

I'm not sure Lee as I didn't measure them before cutting.😬
If you look back at the photos you will see it side by side with a partially worn Xtreme. This will give you some guidance.
Just be patient, I cut mine down about four times, each time testing it then re-trimming to get it just right. You can always remove but not replace just bear in mind. Also, after a trim, press the brush against a flat surface to see where you might wish to trim to your own liking. When mine is pressed against the glass the top and bottom rows of bristles are parallel to the brush stock, they don't form an oval shape like in standard trim. The brush is now more like a rectangular brush but with rounded ends- which really get into every corner and whip spiders nests out for fun!
Use good, sharp scissors and take your time. Good luck and hope you like the outcome as much as I do.👍
Comfortably Numb!

Lee GLS

  • Posts: 3843
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #101 on: December 05, 2021, 02:38:16 pm »
I love the longer bristles on the Supreme. It's my new favourite brush. Only just switched my 25 slx pole to one. We were still using superlites. Everybody's different I guess. ;D

If you were using superlites before then you aren't going to notice much difference in wet weight I suspect. However, when you come backwards from Ultimate and Xtreme brushes then the standard supreme is equivalent to a yard broom!😁
The problem is, you haven't tried a shorter bristle, modified supreme. If you had, you might just now be agreeing with everything I've posted. I thought our car was fine before I had it remapped, only then did I realise just how poor it actually  was in standard form!
How much did you trim off the bristles?

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #102 on: December 05, 2021, 05:30:36 pm »
I love the longer bristles on the Supreme. It's my new favourite brush. Only just switched my 25 slx pole to one. We were still using superlites. Everybody's different I guess. ;D

If you were using superlites before then you aren't going to notice much difference in wet weight I suspect. However, when you come backwards from Ultimate and Xtreme brushes then the standard supreme is equivalent to a yard broom!😁
The problem is, you haven't tried a shorter bristle, modified supreme. If you had, you might just now be agreeing with everything I've posted. I thought our car was fine before I had it remapped, only then did I realise just how poor it actually  was in standard form!
How much did you trim off the bristles?

See post above.
Comfortably Numb!

Lee GLS

  • Posts: 3843
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #103 on: December 05, 2021, 08:27:01 pm »
I love the longer bristles on the Supreme. It's my new favourite brush. Only just switched my 25 slx pole to one. We were still using superlites. Everybody's different I guess. ;D

If you were using superlites before then you aren't going to notice much difference in wet weight I suspect. However, when you come backwards from Ultimate and Xtreme brushes then the standard supreme is equivalent to a yard broom!😁
The problem is, you haven't tried a shorter bristle, modified supreme. If you had, you might just now be agreeing with everything I've posted. I thought our car was fine before I had it remapped, only then did I realise just how poor it actually  was in standard form!
How much did you trim off the bristles?

See post above.

😬 not sure how I missed that 🤣. Will get the scissors out

Splash & dash

  • Posts: 4364
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #104 on: December 05, 2021, 08:40:38 pm »
I love the longer bristles on the Supreme. It's my new favourite brush. Only just switched my 25 slx pole to one. We were still using superlites. Everybody's different I guess. ;D

If you were using superlites before then you aren't going to notice much difference in wet weight I suspect. However, when you come backwards from Ultimate and Xtreme brushes then the standard supreme is equivalent to a yard broom!😁
The problem is, you haven't tried a shorter bristle, modified supreme. If you had, you might just now be agreeing with everything I've posted. I thought our car was fine before I had it remapped, only then did I realise just how poor it actually  was in standard form!
How much did you trim off the bristles?

See post above.

😬 not sure how I missed that 🤣. Will get the scissors out



Don’t ruin a good brush 😂😂😂

Simon Trapani

  • Posts: 1482
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #105 on: December 05, 2021, 10:10:23 pm »
I have used ultimate & extreme. Didn’t like them in my slx. I find the shorter bristles make me catch the brush stock on vents & hinges etc. Still use an extreme on the 47 super max though just because it’s so light. And I do notice the lesser weight of the supreme up to the superlight. Just my personal preference. I couldn’t be doing with modifying equipment to the extent you have though. I like it off the shelf.

֍Winp®oClean֍

  • Posts: 1616
Re: Supreme brushes?
« Reply #106 on: December 05, 2021, 10:42:11 pm »
I have used ultimate & extreme. Didn’t like them in my slx. I find the shorter bristles make me catch the brush stock on vents & hinges etc. Still use an extreme on the 47 super max though just because it’s so light. And I do notice the lesser weight of the supreme up to the superlight. Just my personal preference. I couldn’t be doing with modifying equipment to the extent you have though. I like it off the shelf.

I get where you're coming from. It's embarrassing at times, if the customer's in and the Xtreme stock is rattling the frames!😁
What I will say is that this barely happens with the shorter supreme, a combination of stock dimensions and bristle density help it behave better. As for the 'extent' It's  30 minutes of time for something that will be used every working day for 'hopefully' around 3/4 months.👍
Comfortably Numb!