[GlynE]

Just had our first shrinkage problem. Berber carpet on wooden floor, no underlay. One carpet started to shrink after about an hour & another carpet as soon as we started to use pre spray. Both carpets were fixed with grippa rods. Customer is really angry. We have obviously not taken payment & have offered to get re-stretched professionally as soon as carpets have dried out, although with the amount of shrinkage, that could be a problem. Would be grateful for thoughts /advice....
Many thanks
Glyn

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

Why is it fitted on gripper but not on underlay ?

[GlynE]

SORRY - typing error. that should read "With Underlay". the carpet was actually quite thin...

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

Are you sure it was a berber ? If it was quite thin then it may be a wool natural made by the likes of Crucial Trading or Kerstain Cobb, these have a high risk of shrinkage.

At the moment you can't do anything until it is fully dry, they sometimes relax back, but not by much.

[richie]

How much have the carpets shrunk?  As Steve has said, once completely dried out they may well relax slightly. Once completely dried out get a good carpet fitter to attempt a re-stretch.  Leave it at least 48 - 72 hours before attempting the re-stretch.
If the carpets will not go all the way back you will obviously then need to talk with the customer.  You state that she was very angry with you so it sounds like replacement will be the route rather than offering a cash settlement.  Depending on your insurance excess will determine if you pay for replacement yourself or go through your insurance company.

Richie.

[markpowell]

Does the customer know where you live??
Mark

[Matt Lindus]

Glyn,

Stick the customer under your patio.

[Nigel_W]

Try and find a carpet fitter who has a power stretcher. I bought one years ago for stretching flooded carpets. In the right hands you can perform miracles compared to a knee kicker.

Nigel
www.designcare.co.uk

[Doug Holloway]

Glyn,

Are you sure it was a Berber, it sounds very like a Belgian Wilton to me.

To shrink just with prespray is exceptional.

Cheers

Doug

[Buckland]

Lyn - Really sorry to hear about the shrinkage problem - it would be genuinely interesting to know what the carpet type and make was - it might be the infamous belgian wilton - does the custy know who supplied it - when you get a moment please share this info on the forum - the facts as you report them sound really strange - Ive been at this game for quite a few years now and use very hot tm (solution) systems on all sorts of carpets and we have never had a problem like that (touch wood and find the rabbit's foot!) - yes ripples will appear especially for instance with upstairs rooms in a well heated house etc but they always go back down - and we have certainly walked away from quotes where the fixing and seams are suspect - but usually you can tell by looking and feeling a carpet if its going to be problematic
its often the customers worst nightmare and a faq's you get asked by the older generation - the carpet shrinking with pre-spray only is really odd - not being funny or anything but are you sure its not string (i.e. sisal)! As Steve says Crucial Trading supply/make/import some pretty weird (and wonderful) stuff - the thin part got me thinking crucial trading and they do make some sisal carpet which can be fitted and looks like wool
what method/system do you use - hot tm, porty? you also say your first shrinkage problem - make sure its your last - I did a flood pump out of a large carpetted bathroom recently and we extracted then cleaned and dried it and replaced the underlay and it went back no problems and that was literally underwater when we got there! Good luck with your negotiations - its something we all worry about because it can bite you on the bum just when you least expect!

[peter maybury]

f it is seagrass or sisal it will be an expensive mistake, you need to be able to identify what you are working with.  It is that simple.  If you are insured for it then you will pay for it when you renew your insurance. Even with 20 years experience I still do an inspection and look for bad fitting etc if there is a risk of shrinkage I always warn the customer if they have been forewarned it is not as frightening for them and the reassurance that you know what you are doing also helps.
I would not like to be doing what I am doing without the knowledge and experience I have now. You cannot afford to be in business without it.
There are too many people looking for ways to claim something against somebody, it is only a matter of time before you meet one.
Peter
www.carpetleanercardiff.com

[kinder clean]

So other than jute backing and sisal carpets, are there other shrinkers ?

If it turns out to be belgian wilton how much pre-spray did you put down ??  I cleaned a B/W yesterday with caution, no problem.

Paul

 

[Paul Redden Countryfresh]

I Think I know what this......Yes it is flat and looks like a berber but on closer inspection I'm sure you'll see some face yarns ie horizontal fine string like threads woven in and out. This will shrink in cold water so can only be done with host or similar. A liberable pre-spray could also cause shrinkage.

As mentioned this is a bitch to stretch so I would wait at least a week to settle and again as mentioned get a fitter who has a power strecther who is fully experienced.

I would'nt mention the insurance route at this stage.

It might be worth asking for fitting help on here.

Good Luck
Paul

[james roffey]

I Think I know what this......Yes it is flat and looks like a berber but on closer inspection I'm sure you'll see some face yarns ie horizontal fine string like threads woven in and out. This will shrink in cold water so can only be done with host or similar. A liberable pre-spray could also cause shrinkage.

As mentioned this is a bitch to stretch so I would wait at least a week to settle and again as mentioned get a fitter who has a power strecther who is fully experienced.

I would'nt mention the insurance route at this stage.

It might be worth asking for fitting help on here.

I am intrigued what is this carpet any pics so i can avoid, did a carpet today i was sure it was  a polyprop was going to do with ultrapac renovate prespray and rinse with crystal green which i had all prepared , at the last minute i did a float test, it sank i still went ahead as i was sure it was a synthetic turned out a good result but i had my fingers crossed i like to be certain, about what im doing so this story scares the crap out of me and i suspect a lot of others


Good Luck
Paul

[GlynE]

Thank you for all your very kind & very helpful replies.
The carpets shrank within 5 minutes of light prespray being applied, although the client assured us that it had been cleaned before with HWE method, with no problems. They had informed us that their receipt for the carpet when they purchased it stated it was "Berber".
Have attached photos...

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

Yep - it's a Crucial Trading carpet !

By the way Glyn, the term "berber" is not a type of carpet. It simply suggests, or certainly did 20 odd years ago, that it is a looped carpet usually made of wool and is named after a North African tribe. This became somewhat blurred over the years and started to include anything that was looped or ribbed as long as it was natural wool - then along came synthetic berbers and everyone became confused. In fact the trade has started to drop the term berber in favour of wool naturals.

Unfortunately, sometimes only experience will ring alarm bells when you see a carpet like this - so if someone tells you they have a berber carpet, don't take their word for it !

Steve

[GlynE]

Thank you Steve - Am I right in thinking that it is probably not going to be possible to re-stretch it & replacement is only option
Glynis

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

As a few of us have mentioned above, it will relax a little, but you won't get much of a stretch on this type of carpet.

Has it only shrink in the doorway ?

If so, you may be able to overcome the problem by uplifting the double naplock bar that is currently fitted and replace it with a wide cover strip.


Steve

[GlynE]

Thanks again Steve
In the doorway & about 6" down one wall.....
Thanks everyone for your kind help - very much appreciated
Glyn x

[peter maybury]

CRUCIAL TRADING ARE JUST ONE OF THE IMPORTERS DISTRIBUTORS OF THIS TYPE OF PRODUCT. IF THE CARPET HAS SHRUNK ALONG THE LENTH OF THE CARPET IT WILL HAVE MORE GIVE AND IS MORE LIKELY TO GO BACK OF IT OWN ACCORD OR RESTRETCH.  A BETTER ALTERNATIVE TO THE 1 1/2 " COVER STRIP WOULD BE A CLIP TOP TRIM WHICH IS FAR EASIER TO FIT AND MORE ATTRACTIVE. YOU NEED TO CONTACT A FLOORING DISTRIBUTOR TO SEE THE RANGE AVAILABLE (NOT A CARPET SHOP).  YOU SHOULD BE OK IF THE GRIPPET HAS RETAINED THE CARPET EITHER SIDE OF THE DOOR.


PETER