[Moderator David@stives]

How much did Neil sell for in the end ?

[Sean Dyer]

wasnt it about 30 -40 k for a business at that sort of turnover?

[ronnie paton]

only neil knows the full amount but it was in that catorgory.

[bluez]

Size and scale of business really do determine selling price. If I had a business turning over £120, 000.00 pa it is very unlikely that I would have any interest in measuring its value based on a multiple of monthly turnovers, more likely that I will be looking at it based on a multiple of annaul profit.

However the potential purchaser is most likely to be basing their investment on the possible returns for their investment, many business people measure the value of an investment on the speed of return.

The business turning over £120k making 20% profit has a rate of return of 5 years at 1 years turnover.

One of the most important factors in buying a business for most is if they can bring improvements to how it operates and increase the profit margin and turnover, this is often more important than the turnover in determining price as it will improve margin.

I would rather a small highly profitable business than a big unprofitable one.
 

[1wayno]

30-40k sounds fair enuff for a BUISNESS that brings in 5k a month plus 2 vans with full wfp set ups,96k is waaaaayy over the top in my opinion

[ronnie paton]

i run my ROUNDS has a BUSINESS dont you Wayno

[1wayno]

yeh but if if i was guna sell A(1) round i wudnt sell my van and gear with it...would you?  : so therefore i wudnt be sellin my BUISNESS..id be selling A round  believe it or not,theys a BIG difference 

if youve got 3 round for example and u decide to sell ONE,you are not selling your buisness...if you sell all three with all your gear and van...then your selling your buisness...do you get it now or would you like a picture?? 

[Moderator David@stives]

Heres one off that site i put up early, goes along with what i was saying 10 months of net profit.
,
WINDOW CLEANING SERVICES
 
 
CENTRAL SCOTLAND WT £2,300 GP 88% NP £53k Strong retention Clientele Works from home Bus £45,000
 

[ronnie paton]

aaghh so if i sell a van with a round its a business???

a trad window cleaner could run a round /business from any vehicle.

Trust me its more than a van that makes it a business!!!!!

and more than i could taech you

[1wayno]

if you have one round and you sold it with your gear,your selling a buisness,if you have 3 rounds and you sell one,your NOT and i'll repeat it for you,your NOT selling a buisness,your just selling ONE of your rounds,simple to understand,but for sum reason your having dificulty,how much alcohol have you had over christmas??

[ronnie paton]

Heres one off that site i put up early, goes along with what i was saying 10 months of net profit.
,
WINDOW CLEANING SERVICES
 
 
CENTRAL SCOTLAND WT £2,300 GP 88% NP £53k Strong retention Clientele Works from home Bus £45,000
 

dave did i see something different, i thought i seen you say half of the turnover???



see to me that business is a bargain and i would be asking why is he selling???

[Moderator David@stives]

Ron

If you look it equates to about half the turnover too

[ronnie paton]

if you have one round and you sold it with your gear,your selling a buisness,if you have 3 rounds and you sell one,your NOT and i'll repeat it for you,your NOT selling a buisness,your just selling ONE of your rounds,simple to understand,but for sum reason for having dificulty,how much alcohol have you had over christmas??
[/quote/]
quote]

right  so if i sell my rounds with a some trad tools its a business?

your more foolish than i thought. saying that you do think someone is ripping a buyer off if they demand the most for there business/round

what did you say your buiness was called

[ronnie paton]

dave

but the two statements are miles apart, 10 x monthly profit and half the turnover could mean so much different if the profi is 20%???

if your trying to prove a point its wasted i could go and look up many business that sold for way more than 10 monthly profit but i dont need too.

[1wayno]

i jus think that selling a average round for 7-10x is out of order and alot of people agree with that,selling a buisness with a van and gear and everythin already set up and ready,then yeh u can ask for more coz it worth more,but individual average rounds are not worth more than 4x. that is what i and alot of other people think and agree with and it tends to be just the north west that dont agree with that,which is what i bin sayin all along,its not difficult to understand.

[ronnie paton]

so people are out of order if they want to sell there business for more than 4 x.......why???

its there round they put the hard work and they know the value for you or any one else to say there out of order is ridiculous, its not your round to value or dictate the price and that is  simple.

i think if you build a round and put the sweat and tears in you may understand why people sell for more.

Here is another scenario Ian Lancasters franchise, he gets 10k i think  plus 20 % of all work so many people will think thats mad but guess what, its been a success!!!!

shall i tell you why he knows how much hard work it tkes to build and maintain a round he can sell that to intrested parties, some say its stupid and they would never do it just like getting 1.5-2.5 gross profit for the business.

But with that mentallity it wouldnt be possible would it....................

[1wayno]

selling one of your rounds is NOT selling your buisness man! sweat and tears,i can understand the sweat from working,but tears?...do u fall of your ladders alot? 
its jus people in the north west...the rule of thumb for selling A round is no more than 4x,a buisness as a whole a little more,but in the north west they jus want more coz they greedy,simple.

[Moderator David@stives]

Ronnie
I am not trying to prove any point , i am just pointingout the obvious.

Most businesses I see are selling for half, the annual turnover, even though it means nothing, it is just a general observation, coincidently the business i have quoted is for sale for

1, it is for sale for roughly half its annual turnover
2, it is for sale for roughly 10 months net profit

It is not the be all and end all, it is just half the cleaning firms for sale could fit into one of those categorys, some even fit into both.
 
It doesnt mean that all business fall into that category.

It doesnt mean I am advocating any way.

I am just pointing out my observations

[Moderator David@stives]

Ronnie

He gets 10 %

and I dont think he gets £10k

[ronnie paton]

he doesnt get 10 percent its 20% :