[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

Dave,

You're absolutely amazing. I don't think I have ever come across someone so short sighted in my life. You're talking about investing in a machine about which you clearly know nothing. You can't even accept that any machine, let a lone a sophisticated piece of kit like a TM will at some point or other require repairs, not because as you state, 'But if you need this backup so much then quite simply the build quality is not superb. Considering the amount that they cost depending on the model. Many of you keep saying we require backup. If a product is so good you dont require backup. Not so often anyways. You are down grading the product yourselves,' but because all machines will not run for ever without breaking down and that is why you need excellent service and backup from a dealer. That dealer backup is something that comes with your machine, free of charge and with JK you are getting the very best backup in the industry but you see that as an irrelevance which is quite frankly astonishing.

You say, 'And I have researched this and why we want this. Its simply more practical for us. Plus it also can be portable if required. We have buildings that we clean that will not have doors windows open end of! Its ok for people to say Access is only a problem if you let it be. Well for us Access would be overcome by having a Prowler as it could be Portable.'
If you had done your research you would have realised, perhaps in the first few seconds that the Prowler runs on petrol and while it may be portable that doesn't mean you can take it into buildings like you can a portable, doh!!! You know fumes, fire alarms going off, health and safety regulations things like that, obviously you will have researched those things as thoroughly as everything else.

You seem to have asked a perfectly reasonable question, to which you got a lot of very helpful and honest answers, the most frequent and heartfelt of them being that if you are going to buy a TM you need really good service and technical back up, to which you reply, 'Well, if they need that much backup they mustn't be very good in the first place!' which to me shows an astonishing level of incompetence on your part. All you're saving is a measly thousand quid and for that you are prepared to forgo having someone at the end of a phone line who understands your machine, can diagnose any problems and supply you with the parts that will get you back to work and save you thousands in lost sales due to downtime. Most people in your position ask, 'Yes, but what happens if my machine breaks down?' and then come on a forum like this and research the service reputation of the various suppliers and thereby put yourself at ease that you would be in safe hands in that regards, but not you.
If you were on Britain's Got Business Talent you would have got three XXX's long ago and shown the door.

Had to be said

[derek west]

dave
sorry, i didn't realise cracking the odd joke here and there was unprofessional.
note to self,
must be serious in future so my business prospers.

yeah right

......

[Shaun_Ashmore]

I'm all in for saving money (it's my middle name, people just think I'm frivolous because I'm from Yorkshire) but look at the bigger picture, I used to have 2 vans and 2 machines and then I got a TM and did the work of 2 people BUT getting the best TM for my money meant getting a TM that worked (which you 'd expect) but when it went down the back up to get it going again QUICKLY! a TM will clean twice as fast as a porty but if a part takes a week to come from the states then you are stuck and once you've gone TM's you won't want to go back because a porty is hard on your back in comparison.

I believe that if you are going to import you have to justify a big enough saving,  don't know what the saving would be but unless it is nearer to 50%  or thousands of ££ I wouldn't be bothered as it wouldn't make bisiness sense to save a thousand pounds and get 7 days lost work because of parts coming through the post from the US and basing it on experience TM's do you wrong but with a UK supplier the part is there next day.

We spend all of our time trying to get customers to call and book then to get there and find the bloody machine won't work is frustrating and then to say I'll do you the job but not with the machine I sold you the quality clean with (yes we sell TM cleaning as being better faster and drier) then having to work longer hours with a porty for another 7 days.

Unless there is a bigger benefit I would urge you to reconsider as there isn't a big enough benefit to buying from the US at this moment in time plus the £ to $ is crap ATM may be last year but not now, JK would have been making a killing then, now I feel a little teeny weeny bit sorry for him (not too much though)

Shaun

  

[derek west]

dave
your obviously not getting our point so lets try a different approach. no jokes i promise, i'm all professional now.

are you a gambler or a shrewd business man who likes a bargain?

if your a gambler then import, you may get lucky and save some money, and allthough you won't get prompt advice on using the machine and minor faults and servicing help, you'll be able to find the advice on the internet somewhere, thats if you haven't destroyed all your bridges.

if your a shrewd business man, then you need to get to know the british supplier you wanna do business with, then see if you can work out a good deal and purchase from him.

thats my last advice on this subject but no doubt you'll just try and pull it apart,
and for that reason, armoot.
derek

[Pristine Clean]

Major,

You are correct I totally missed this totally. Thanks for pointing it out.

If you had done your research you would have realised, perhaps in the first few seconds that the Prowler runs on petrol and while it may be portable that doesn't mean you can take it into buildings like you can a portable, doh!!! You know fumes, fire alarms going off, health and safety regulations things like that, obviously you will have researched those things as thoroughly as everything else.

But, there are still building you could take this machine to that you cant get as close to! So I am still intersted in The Prowler at a later date.

Derek,

I consider myself both a gambler- Risk taker and shrewd business man looking for a great product that is cheaply priced (A bargain)

I have made decisions that were risky indeed. And Yes if the risk went wrong I could have lost alot. But luckily for me the risks I have taken have paid off. I have taken some risks that have failed - Its a choice isnt it! If you take the risk you have to be prepared to lose.

As for destroying my bridges, Maybe so. Which is a shame on my part and the supplier. Considering it was just a post on a forum about saving money. I wont be able to make a purchase and they will lose a sale and possibly repeat business Lets think I have not tried to tarnish anyone, just simply tried to save some money Possibly. Again a risk which I may choose to take.

I have not pulled your reply apart, infact the all the posts were great, (apart from a few) and I have taken the advice on board.

The machines CC machines are extremely new to me, Most of my employees do the repairs if required. I normally get involved with other stuff not the machines themselves. I have not claimed to be an expert on the CC machines. Infact I will probably post many more questions seeking advice. If people wish not to answer them, well so be it.

My next lot will soon be on the Envirodri System - Totally new to me but I believe I got a good deal. I think you lot will be please I purchased it in the UK.

As for JK, like I said before I was unaware of who he was. But yes he may not want to do business with me. And as you all seem to favour him so high, which is good and nice to see yes that in itself will definately be a downfall on my part.

I am sure when the time comes to purchase, I will find someone. At a bargain price.

Shaun,

Thanks for that, thats what I was trying to work out wether it would be worth while, a £1000 is alot of money. even if you have money to burn. - that what interested me was it looks like a big saving if there was not much hassle. And yes every engine, tool at somepoint requires repairs. I know, My jag is costly. Most I have found to be out of warranty period so I still had to fork out for the part and labour. So the £1000 i save possibly could cover that. But I have not made my decision yet.

And so it is clear the post was just about saving money - not to upset anyone. You have given me alot to think about.

Thanks

Dave

[Doctor Carpet (Ret'd)]

I think the expression we are looking for is:

"A person who knows the price of everything but the value of nothing."

[Simon Gerrard]

The expression, 'A fool and his money are easily part,' seems to ring to true here!

[Shaun_Ashmore]

I think after the original desaccord I think we are getting somewhere, perhaps another way of looking at it would be to ask are you doing mainly domestic carpet cleaning?

I have a Boxxer 427 water cooled TM and it does exactly what I want it to do but it is over and above what I need realistically I should have had a Prowler 315 as I don't use over 100ft of vac pipe.

Shaun

[Joe H]

Shaun

Didnt know you like the 315 so much!

Do you wanna buy mine - bargain at £10k     Free delivery.

[Pristine Clean]

I think after the original desaccord I think we are getting somewhere, perhaps another way of looking at it would be to ask are you doing mainly domestic carpet cleaning?

I have a Boxxer 427 water cooled TM and it does exactly what I want it to do but it is over and above what I need realistically I should have had a Prowler 315 as I don't use over 100ft of vac pipe.

Shaun

Hi Shaun,

Well to try and give you an honest there after looking at the data I would say its a very fine line both domestic & commercial. The commercial side are mainly offices situated in office blocks. (Not a whole office block) But we have had to work on as high as the the 12th floor possibly higher up. Many are communal areas in flats. You could class that as domestic but we actually class it as commercial.

But not all the work is done via HWE, some is done via bonett, and now on some I will be marketing Envirodri System as I have purchased the E30. (Not yet taken delivery hopefully wednesday) 

With the purchase of the Rhino 500psi we have had many domestic calls recently hence the reason for the purchase new employees. We have the work lined up and ready to go. And I must say the phone has not stopped ringing. So in a few weeks Yes Domestic side could overtake commercial. But I am marketing both pretty heavey at the moment.

Now I agree that you may have a peice of equipment that may be more tan fits your requirements. If I had a machine that could do more, then I would have the option to market a further service. (Not yet looked into) But possibly could market Presure washing. No point marketing something you dont have the equipment to use. But now we are going a step beyond.


I am open to your suggestions shaun,

Joe
Are you sure thats cheap? 
Even with delivery which I am sure you have included - Nothing is free when running a business. The word Free is just Marketing. But it plays on the mind and works very well.

Dave

[Joe H]

Dave
Shaun is one of the most succesful carpet cleaners on here - he's super rich so can afford an inflated price.
But hes also a Yorkshire man so I have no chance.

Nor would I want to sell it anyway - too good.
and I have a good relationship with the supplier 

[Mike Osbourne]

Is it just me or is there something not quite right going on here?

[Pristine Clean]

Is it just me or is there something not quite right going on here?

Hi Mike,

Could kindly explain as I do not understand the comment.

Thanks

Dave

[robert meldrum]

Where's your usual perception Mike ? Or is this it kicking in ?

This guy from all accounts doesn't know his AR*E from his ELBOW and is contradicting himself. What his angle is, is anybody's guess but it's been entertaining apart from his insulting comments about one of the most respected people on here.

If some one says black as sure as hell he will say white whether there's a motive or not I have'nt fathomed and am giving up on this one. At least on here !

[Glynn]

When I first looked at buying a Truckmount I posted it on the boards that I had actually ordered a Prochem Blazer. I got an email from Simon Gerrard reading something like'
Congratulations on your Truckmount purchase ! ( he at this point didn't even know I hadn't had it fitted )
he went on to say " it's all well and good buying an entry level machine but if you can buy as big as you can afford " because as your business grows you will out grow the capabilities of the machine.
I thought about this and ended up cancelling my order with Prochem for a new machine and bought a second hand larger machine. Now, having used that larger machine from day 1 of owning a TM I knew no better untill I got chance to use a smaller one. The difference was unbelievable.
Soon after I bought another even larger TM, this time brand new. This was the best money I ever spent on any type of machinery. Since then I have bought another two brand new TM's .

There is no use buying truckmounts on a budget, get the best you possibly can and even spending upwards of £16,000 just for the machine itself is peanuts when you consider the earning potential of them.

Buying from the states is not potentially a good move I don't think as you WILL end up needing backup sooner or later and the likes of John Kelly or HM etc would look after you as would indeed most UK TM suppliers, it's a no brainer really.

[Simon Gerrard]

Dave,
Mike is far too much of a gentlemen to say so, but I'm just a heathen peasant from up north so I don't give a F--k and I think you're taking the p.

You clearly know zilch about business and what you know about carpet cleaning you could write on the back of a stamp and even that might be being overly generous.

Simon

[elliott cleaning]

Interesting little (or maybe not so little) thread.
Can't see why so many appear to be getting knotted up about it.

Let Pristine acquire his Prowler from the States to save the so called +/- grand. He will see that it will work out on the minus side of that figure plus all the subsequent downside of it.  If that sort of initial saving on a piece of capital equipment, which can be written off, is crucial to his business then so be it.  Hardly an earth shattering amount, in fact small beer.  Had he spent the time posting on this issue constructively on his business, that theoretical saving would have already been recouped

[Jim_77]

Good to have you back Simon

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

And now Pristine Clean has gone - another wind up merchant bites the dust !

[Stu.Clem]

To conclude with a MUST watch....

is this the measure of the man?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vL1wRicYgwE

enough said