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Mike #1

  • Posts: 4668
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #20 on: May 24, 2013, 09:15:59 am »
Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel.  ??? ??? ??? ???

Best thing ever said on here LMAO  .Mike

Spruce

  • Posts: 8647
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #21 on: May 24, 2013, 11:59:47 am »
Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel.  ??? ??? ??? ???

But you didn't include vet bills into their running costs .............................  :)
Success is 1% inspiration, 98% perspiration and 2% attention to detail!

The older I get, the better I was ;)

Ian Lancaster

  • Posts: 2811
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #22 on: May 24, 2013, 12:15:36 pm »
Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel.  ??? ??? ??? ???

But you didn't include vet bills into their running costs .............................  :)

And while your diesel van isn't  running, the horse is still burning up fuel also doing nothing in its stable ;D

8weekly

Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #23 on: May 24, 2013, 12:24:11 pm »
Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel.  ??? ??? ??? ???

But you didn't include vet bills into their running costs .............................  :)
Or farrier costs of about £70 a month

robert mitchell

  • Posts: 2019
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #24 on: May 24, 2013, 12:33:16 pm »
Alex , do you have a lighter version of the sill brush in the pipeline ?
www.ishinewindowcleaning.co.uk

The man who never made a mistake never made anything.

Spruce

  • Posts: 8647
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #25 on: May 24, 2013, 12:36:26 pm »
Hi David,

The first bentley brush I converted lasted ages. The second wasn't as good. It appeared to me that the flocking at the bristle ends was knotting up and giving a poor cleaning result.
We had only used Vikan flocked brushes before that which worked fine but were too heavy.

The crunch came when I looked at a window I had cleaned that faces the seafront one winter's morning. After the window had dried, I saw cleaned lines down the window where the bristles had cleaned but left uncleaned lines next to them. I concluded from this that there was no splay on the bristles and it was only the tips of the bristles that were cleaning the glass.

I changed the brush and pole back to the original Vikan and Unger Teleplus pole did the whole job again without issue. I ordered a superlite flocked which Gardiners had just started to sell and never looked back.

Before the Gardiner brush arrived I took another new bentley and cut a couple of the inner rows of bristles a bit shorter to try to get the outer bristles to splay. The weather the following day was poor so I never when out, and as the Superlite arrived that day, fitted to my pole and went on to using it.

I still have the unused, untested cut bristle bentley brush somewhere. Now we have the extreme brush, I don't see the point of messing with making my own that didn't do a good job for me TBH.

Sometimes Smithie can be a bit course in his way of expressing himself  :). English isn't his first language, but I understand what he means as I come from the same culture. South Africans aren't great preservers of the past - we tend to knock down and replace with new. You won't see much of the last 100 - 150 years still in existence.

Years ago we modified carbon fibre Thompson modular fishing poles and the superlight was the best brush for the conversion due to it's lightness. If my memory serves me we did a complete conversion for around £25.00 - £30.00.

Why don't we still do it? I guess as Smithie says - we have moved on to carbon fibre SLX's and Superlight brushes. Yes they cost more, but they also work well, allowing us to focus on other things.

We also proudly use Aquadaptors on the end of our poles. Yes they add weight and cost more that a cheap on/off tap, but they save us water and reduce the amount of messing around switching water off and on.
Success is 1% inspiration, 98% perspiration and 2% attention to detail!

The older I get, the better I was ;)

windowswashed

  • Posts: 2626
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #26 on: May 25, 2013, 12:02:42 am »
The old Bentley brush was pants as the rough hard edges of the stock would scratch the sills something rotten and customers weren't impressed with scratched sills!!!! The bristles melted at the crushed ends when using hot water as well.

Some DIY brushes are okay-ish but in general they're meant for sweeping floors not cleaning cars or windows.

MATT BATEMAN (OWC)

  • Posts: 1821
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #27 on: May 25, 2013, 12:40:50 am »
Because their aint nothing better than a Gardiners Xtreme brush . Mike

There's plenty of brushes on the market better than an extreme. It's horses for courses, the extreme excels at height for me. I'd love to think they're good enough for everyday use but realistically they're not 'man' enough.

Stephen.C

  • Posts: 450
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #28 on: May 25, 2013, 11:23:37 am »
Because their aint nothing better than a Gardiners Xtreme brush . Mike

There's plenty of brushes on the market better than an extreme. It's horses for courses, the extreme excels at height for me. I'd love to think they're good enough for everyday use but realistically they're not 'man' enough.
+1 Matt you know what happens on that Basingstoke job, the brush is not good enough.
I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.

www.pureh2owindowcleaning.com

Lee GLS

  • Posts: 3844
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #29 on: May 25, 2013, 11:36:04 am »
Because their aint nothing better than a Gardiners Xtreme brush . Mike

There's plenty of brushes on the market better than an extreme. It's horses for courses, the extreme excels at height for me. I'd love to think they're good enough for everyday use but realistically they're not 'man' enough.


I don't see why you think it's ok for working at height, but not everyday use?
Surly you would want a more substantial brush to scrub better as you cannot get the pressure the higher you go.


Also why is an extreme not any good for everyday use? There is virtually no dirt on regular cleans, and it only needs a tickle to loosen what's on there.

Richard iSparkle

  • Posts: 2491
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #30 on: May 25, 2013, 02:12:57 pm »

I see your point lads but I have 2 reasons why I will still DIY mine.......

1. Cost - £30 will get me 10 brushes from Asda (OK then there's the tube, T peice and jets)
2. Light as a feather - I borrowed a Superlight of a mate.........soon as I picked it up I gave it straight back....much heavier.

The one reason why I was asking and looking for a Proper brush was because, like most of you, I don't want to spend time making brushes.

Thanks
David

sounds like you're on to something here.  you should go into production and sell them  8)
iSparkle Window Cleaning

www.isparklewindowcleaning.uk

Peter Fogwill

  • Posts: 1415
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #31 on: May 25, 2013, 04:23:50 pm »
I am a great believer in people doing things themselves as long as they have a bit of spare time on their hands.  You just got to weigh up the time spent doing so, and how much you could earn in the same time cleaning windows.  Different story if you can't buy something off the shelf that you can make yourself.  I have used the Bentley brushes myself and don't rate them for window cleaning.  Bristles are too soft and hold on to the dirt, they do clean windows though.  Even at 15 minutes a brush, and if you use 4 brushes compared to a ready made brush, then that's an hour you have spent making your brushes up. How much can you earn in that hour cleaning windows? More than enough to buy a brush, and you also have the cost of the Bentley, jets, etc.  like I said its a different story if its better than, or something you can't buy off the shelf and get delivered to your door all ready to use.

Ian101

  • Posts: 7889
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2013, 09:12:33 am »
I buy gardiners brushes cos they fit my gardiner poles and for the money spent makes me many times more back plus they come in black so match my poles and my black uniform  ;D ( if gardiners made uniforms I would buy them as well )

plus who wants to go to asda amongst all them shopping trolleys argh do me head in  >:(

Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2013, 12:37:57 pm »
For some time I used a Harris pole and Bentley brush but found my cost of keeping a home produced pole and brush cost more to maintain than purpose make tools.

MATT BATEMAN (OWC)

  • Posts: 1821
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2013, 02:38:03 pm »

I don't see why you think it's ok for working at height, but not everyday use?
Surly you would want a more substantial brush to scrub better as you cannot get the pressure the higher you go.


Also why is an extreme not any good for everyday use? There is virtually no dirt on regular cleans, and it only needs a tickle to loosen what's on there.


I do nth think the extreme is man enough at any height. If there's bird strikes or mess on the glass you just as well go home if you're trying to use an extreme. At height I consider an extreme as its the height issue (my own well being) that is my primary concern on a job 30' +

I love using an extreme, they feel great, looks good the way the two rows of bristles span out, but there are always jobs, everyday, where they're not up to it.

dd

  • Posts: 2623
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #35 on: May 26, 2013, 02:47:07 pm »
I never understand why so many use the extreme. Surely the standard sl will scrub better and so do a better job. Our job is to actually clean the window, not use the lightest possible brush.

Lee GLS

  • Posts: 3844
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2013, 03:04:38 pm »
I never understand why so many use the extreme. Surely the standard sl will scrub better and so do a better job. Our job is to actually clean the window, not use the lightest possible brush.


They average window does not need a good scrub, it just needs something the agitate the layer of dust/dirt, which is all it needs. If you think about traditional cleaning, how much scrubbing is involved with that? Virtually nothing, yet the windows get cleaned.

Obviously there are windows that will have bird poo on, but soak it when you see it then come back too it.

I don't see the point of having a heavier brush on the pole for what might only be needed for a couple of windows, anything more that an extreme is an over kill for 99% of the glass you clean in a day, so having a heavier brush for 1% of glass is an unnecessary use of energy.

The extreme is the fastest lightest brush available, so you can work faster and longer, so the little bit of extra time spent getting rid of a bit of bird poo can easily be made up by being quicker throughout the day.

dd

  • Posts: 2623
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #37 on: May 26, 2013, 03:20:28 pm »
If the majority of your work is monthly then maybe. Most of mine is every 2 months and the only Gardiners brush I find that works well is the sl flocked. Tried the sl medium mixed on Alex's suggestion, but found this did not work nearly as well as the flocked.

Spruce

  • Posts: 8647
Re: Why do you spend £30ish on a brush
« Reply #38 on: May 26, 2013, 03:58:01 pm »
I found the scrapper along the front of the brush is ok although I usually tend to use the side edge of the brush for those hard bits.
Success is 1% inspiration, 98% perspiration and 2% attention to detail!

The older I get, the better I was ;)