[Handyman Window Cleaning Services]

If you cant pay holiday pay or find them work when it is raining then you havent got a viable business model.

I think you will find even on zero hour, employees still have rights no matter how you employ

Yes exactly
I don't take any rights away either, if they won't time off then they can have
Time off ( not paid though as it is zero hour) they have the right to mutually agree days worked. 

Staff choose to work under these terms and its how my business works better and staff are happy with it.

[Handyman Window Cleaning Services]

on a 0 hour contract,  if the employee works regualt hours then he can claim that this is his shift

Think you find that a usual week is weather permitted there for there are no regular hours.  My  staff may work 7hours one week 20 next week then maybe.30 or as low as 10. 

I do know the regs but as there is no average weekly hours I see no sense paying out on a fuLl time contract .

If staff did work 30 hours average then it would be wrong in every way to put them on a zero hour as they are being treated like a full timer but without the rights.

I wouldn't do that

But as I say my staff never have a average week, so zero hour fits the bill. There happy I'm happy

[pristine window cl]

     IF i did take someone on i would not employ them direct. It would be on a self employed basis.
     So, i would supply van etc  give them list of work for that day wk and pay them by the hour say £10 £15 per hr.
     

why do i want to pay someone to have a baby etc. this is what happens in construction , i used to be a
bricklayer, why should a wc be any different     thoughts please
 
      Alan       

[Pope vader]

if you give them van, gear, and work, then they aint self employed

[pristine window cl]

hi santa , trust me,  they can be ,we had this row in construction all the time there is certain criteria
and the goverment are going to make it even easier with newregulations.

[Pope vader]

if they have a cis card, but you still need to take 18% for tax

[pristine window cl]

you would have to see the tax man who would give you info but no they pay thier own tax
u declare the gross payment that u have made to them.

[Pope vader]

i have seen the tax man, as have been on a inland revenue tax course (run by HMRC) when i use to have an other business,  as when used cis cards  had to keep 18 % and issue vouchers and they sorted out there own NI,  but  they can be completely self emplyed if they have there own work or work for someone else as well

[Handyman Window Cleaning Services]

     IF i did take someone on i would not employ them direct. It would be on a self employed basis.
     So, i would supply van etc  give them list of work for that day wk and pay them by the hour say £10 £15 per hr.
     

why do i want to pay someone to have a baby etc. this is what happens in construction , i used to be a
bricklayer, why should a wc be any different     thoughts please
 
      Alan       

LIDL employ the same way (so i heard) they are not window cleaners, but still its an idea that can be used in employing window cleaners, aslongs they have their own public liability insurance and you have yours plus employers insurance then whats the problem.  if at the start of their work for you, you agree to pay £10 p/h then at the end of each week they invoice you for what they worked.


theres all the pros like

no sick pay
no holiday pay
no Perternaty or maternaty Pay
Hungry for the hours (rain stops play so need to get the hours in)

the cons

other job contracts more attractive
if employee has drive/ambition he/she will go and start own business (could take customers)

[Ste M]

on a 0 hour contract,  if the employee works regualt hours then he can claim that this is his shift

Think you find that a usual week is weather permitted there for there are no regular hours.  My  staff may work 7hours one week 20 next week then maybe.30 or as low as 10. 

I do know the regs but as there is no average weekly hours I see no sense paying out on a fuLl time contract .

If staff did work 30 hours average then it would be wrong in every way to put them on a zero hour as they are being treated like a full timer but without the rights.

I wouldn't do that

But as I say my staff never have a average week, so zero hour fits the bill. There happy I'm happy

I dont know if your trying to make yourself out to be some sort of big time window cleaning company or something but if you are then your not reading your posts before you press the 'post' button, what your saying here is that you have your staff on a zero hour contract yet your above post mentions that they could work 4 weeks of differing hours, those hours add up to 57, then you divide that by the amount of weeks, 4, and hey presto you have 14.25 hours average hours a week, not zero.

Glad to be off assistance to you

[H S and Son]

But as I say my staff never have a average week, so zero hour fits the bill. There happy I'm happy

Your staff are happy taking home earnings on a 7, 20 or 30 hour week? How do they get by?

[Handyman Window Cleaning Services]

on a 0 hour contract,  if the employee works regualt hours then he can claim that this is his shift

Think you find that a usual week is weather permitted there for there are no regular hours.  My  staff may work 7hours one week 20 next week then maybe.30 or as low as 10. 

I do know the regs but as there is no average weekly hours I see no sense paying out on a fuLl time contract .

If staff did work 30 hours average then it would be wrong in every way to put them on a zero hour as they are being treated like a full timer but without the rights.

I wouldn't do that

But as I say my staff never have a average week, so zero hour fits the bill. There happy I'm happy

I dont know if your trying to make yourself out to be some sort of big time window cleaning company or something but if you are then your not reading your posts before you press the 'post' button, what your saying here is that you have your staff on a zero hour contract yet your above post mentions that they could work 4 weeks of differing hours, those hours add up to 57, then you divide that by the amount of weeks, 4, and hey presto you have 14.25 hours average hours a week, not zero.

Glad to be off assistance to you

nice to see that you been to school and know what an average is and i do know what an aveage is but in my situation zero hour is fine. and that average you came up with is only over a 4 week period the next 4 week period will have  different average.  yes you could add up all the hours worked in a year then divide by 52, but im not going to do that.

and no im not a big time window cleaning company i employ one person as i only need one person.

[Handyman Window Cleaning Services]

But as I say my staff never have a average week, so zero hour fits the bill. There happy I'm happy

Your staff are happy taking home earnings on a 7, 20 or 30 hour week? How do they get by?

he has a girlfriend and kids = benifits i suppose.

but if zero hour wasnt viable any more then i would go down the self employed route like pristine window cl mentioned.  or i would rather not employ, i dont see why someone should be paid for not working

[H S and Son]

Maybe I have this wrong but I personally believe that you dont allow your staff's personal circumstances to influence what you pay them, this can encourage employers to pay as little as they can get away with, but you pay them what they are worth; fair days wage for a fair days work. If the minimum wage didnt exist you'd see loads of guys on here probably paying something in the region of £4.00 an hour. Not that they'd admit it of course.

[Ste M]

on a 0 hour contract,  if the employee works regualt hours then he can claim that this is his shift

Think you find that a usual week is weather permitted there for there are no regular hours.  My  staff may work 7hours one week 20 next week then maybe.30 or as low as 10. 

I do know the regs but as there is no average weekly hours I see no sense paying out on a fuLl time contract .

If staff did work 30 hours average then it would be wrong in every way to put them on a zero hour as they are being treated like a full timer but without the rights.

I wouldn't do that

But as I say my staff never have a average week, so zero hour fits the bill. There happy I'm happy

I dont know if your trying to make yourself out to be some sort of big time window cleaning company or something but if you are then your not reading your posts before you press the 'post' button, what your saying here is that you have your staff on a zero hour contract yet your above post mentions that they could work 4 weeks of differing hours, those hours add up to 57, then you divide that by the amount of weeks, 4, and hey presto you have 14.25 hours average hours a week, not zero.

Glad to be off assistance to you

nice to see that you been to school and know what an average is and i do know what an aveage is but in my situation zero hour is fine. and that average you came up with is only over a 4 week period the next 4 week period will have  different average.  yes you could add up all the hours worked in a year then divide by 52, but im not going to do that.

and no im not a big time window cleaning company i employ one person as i only need one person.

Your still not making any sense. Your not paying them an acerage wage your basically paying them what you work. A zero hour contract is that yet your saying totally different. Why not just say your paying your one member of staff what he works an he's happy with that. The reason he is probably happy is its cash in hand so can still sign on. The reason I say this is that NO other type of person would agree to what your offering as it simply wouldn't work.

Imagine your ONE staff member going the bank for a loan or mortgage an sayin he has a job but isn't sure what he will earn this year as his boss chops an changes his hours!! The bank would laugh him out the door. You should either pay him a set wage or an hourly average wage simple as that. If you can't afford to do it then something is wrong with your business plan

[William McCafferty]

It amazes me the amount of people who claim to be professional companies, employing so and so, and building all the time.

Yet they haven't a clue.

I am only small, at the moment 2 staff, but before I even started them I sought out the advice and services of a HR Company.

I have all the paper work in place as well as updates on how the law is changing, for instance from 2012 employees and employers have to pay into a pension fund, at the moment this will only effect the big companies like OCS, but in a couple of years it will effect everyone who takes on staff and it doesn't matter if they are full/part or casual.

As for trying to get around the rules reguarding self employment, well the taxman will let you put anything on your tax returns, but when they do an investigation, you have to show that they are really self employed, if you fail then the taxman will treat them as staff and will want all the taxes, fees and penalties straightaway.

I when you think it cannot get any worse, these self employed workers will be wanting their back holiday pay plus interest.

If you are going to do something, at least do it right and legal, and when it comes to anything that I am not too sure about or an expert in, then I get backup from the experts.

[pristine window cl]

 everyone chill its xmas, we have already lost stocker,?. i was approached by, and joined
the fsb, federation of small business last yr and they told me that there where ways to employ on a self employed basis but there are rules etc , you must be a member to gain their  information about £120  a year. IT CAN BE DONE. I worked in construction as a bricky
for years NEVER did I recieve holiday pay sick or for any reason if i did not work. I am only speaking for myself here as i could only use one other.

[Pope vader]

do u mean a CIS card, we aint in the construction industry,  but could be worth a try

[Handyman Window Cleaning Services]

you run it your way i run mine my way, i'm happy not sure if you are though.  if my staff wasnt happy he would go, zero hour suits him, i havnt mentioned hes a qualified plasterer he takes some days off to do plastering jobs (he dont like plastering tho  that why he dont hve a full time job doing it)

to summerise

he takes days off when it rains and when he has other work

i suppose the self employed route would suit better.

[bobby p]

everyone chill its xmas, we have already lost stocker,?. i was approached by, and joined
the fsb, federation of small business last yr and they told me that there where ways to employ on a self employed basis but there are rules etc , you must be a member to gain their  information about £120  a year. IT CAN BE DONE. I worked in construction as a bricky
for years NEVER did I recieve holiday pay sick or for any reason if i did not work. I am only speaking for myself here as i could only use one other.

how does the FED work- do you go to suppers etc? how much is the ongoing costs ? what sort of work has been funnelled your way?