[steve123]

I have a heater element fitted to my tank which heats my water to about 60'c so thought i was "winter proof"

However I could not have been more wrong.

Sure I can clean the windows and rinse them so I have technicaly done my job, but when working in these very cold temperatures, before the window has had chance to dry it freezes. So the customer is often left with a window they can not see out of.
If I were the customer this would not be acceptable.

So my conclusion is having hot water is a total waste of time and money.

[Helen]

if water is freezing on the windows whether you use hot, cold or indifferent, you should not be window cleaning. It is too cold.

[Dave Willis]

Which is why I say there is a very small margin where hot comes into its own - probably somewhere between minus two and minus four I would guess.

[darren clarke]

like helen said, if the water is freezing on the glass then it is time to go home, or trad if your desperate

[darragh windows]

I have a heater element fitted to my tank which heats my water to about 60'c so thought i was "winter proof"

However I could not have been more wrong.





Hot water does freeze quicker than cold

Sure I can clean the windows and rinse them so I have technicaly done my job, but when working in these very cold temperatures, before the window has had chance to dry it freezes. So the customer is often left with a window they can not see out of.
If I were the customer this would not be acceptable.

So my conclusion is having hot water is a total waste of time and money.

[steve123]

I have a heater element fitted to my tank which heats my water to about 60'c so thought i was "winter proof"

However I could not have been more wrong.





Hot water does freeze quicker than cold
Sure I can clean the windows and rinse them so I have technicaly done my job, but when working in these very cold temperatures, before the window has had chance to dry it freezes. So the customer is often left with a window they can not see out of.
If I were the customer this would not be acceptable.

So my conclusion is having hot water is a total waste of time and money.

Yes I had heard that, but surley that is not the point. Whether it freezes quickly or slowly, if the end result is a pane of glass coverd in ice, (even if its clean) then this is not acceptable to the customer.
All hot water does is allow us to say we did the job and grab the money. Oh and sorry about not being able to see out of your windows for a few days. 

[Nathanael Jones]

Have a little faith,.. when the window defrosts it'll be clean,...

[steve123]

Have a little faith,.. when the window defrosts it'll be clean,...

Yes I am sure it will be, the water that is freezing is pure and clean and therefore will still be when it thaws.
My worry is leaving them in that state, If the temp does not rise for a week the window will be frozen for the entire time.

[Matthew Bateman]

All hot water does is allow us to say we did the job and grab the money. Oh and sorry about not being able to see out of your windows for a few days. 

That is a very naive view of using hot water for window cleaning.

Yesterday me and the chap that works with me were out working. I have an L5 running for myself, he doesnt. Guess which system froze and the water wasnt freezing on the glass.

Because we have been able to work this week I have had the best week window cleaning in 13 years of being self-employed.

[steve123]

All hot water does is allow us to say we did the job and grab the money. Oh and sorry about not being able to see out of your windows for a few days. 

That is a very naive view of using hot water for window cleaning.

Yesterday me and the chap that works with me were out working. I have an L5 running for myself, he doesnt. Guess which system froze and the water wasnt freezing on the glass.

Because we have been able to work this week I have had the best week window cleaning in 13 years of being self-employed.

Matt I understand what you are saying, I guess it depends on temp difference, perhaps where you are the temps were not as low as I have in my area this week.
It does not alter the fact that I had hot water, I cleaned the glass. and 10 minutes later the water that was left behind froze.
If that was happeining to your jobs what would you do?

[Perfect Windows]

Hot water does freeze quicker than cold

Bored of saying this, but this is only true under VERY specific cicrumstances - in tall, narrow cylinders, typically - that don't apply to the way you use hot water in WFP.

Keep repeating it though and it might come true just for you.

Vin

[Nathanael Jones]

If the water is freezing in one big sheet on the windows I would prob pack in for the day,.. personally this has only ever happened to me once though,.. normally the worst I get is a few frozen droplets that don't look any worse than a wet window.

But I think there's a good few degrees of temp between when a cold system freezes & when hot water freezes on the glass,.. if it keeps you working until the weather is genuinely extreme then surely its a good thing?

[lee_dewing]

perfect windows, excuse my ignorance.

So your saying this hot water freezing quicker than cold only applies in test tubes?

Nat, i know you have hot water system, you posted last year i think, what was the temp the water has to be in relation to outside temp to prevnt cracking glass?

thanks lee

[Smudger]

Sorry vin i have to disagree - hot water spread thinly over glass seems to freeze pretty instanly when i have used cold and
it has not. i think there is a temprature band where you can hot wfp over cold BUT as you finish and the water rinses down
it will freeze leaving the windows frosted over ( and i know from reli's that have just had theirs done - they are not happy )

I dont use hot WFP but i have used hot (50 deg) water to trad, and before you get the blade on its frozen. so wfp will be the same good while applying then freeze - i'm sure the windows will be good - logic dictates this but customers sometimes have
enough problrms wfp never mind frozen windows that will then thaw clean.

i'm still looking into hot for next year, but not decided on other factors like the freezing after i've finished and the ice that will form on paths etc...

Darran

[Matthew Bateman]

All hot water does is allow us to say we did the job and grab the money. Oh and sorry about not being able to see out of your windows for a few days. 

That is a very naive view of using hot water for window cleaning.

Yesterday me and the chap that works with me were out working. I have an L5 running for myself, he doesnt. Guess which system froze and the water wasnt freezing on the glass.

Because we have been able to work this week I have had the best week window cleaning in 13 years of being self-employed.

It does not alter the fact that I had hot water, I cleaned the glass. and 10 minutes later the water that was left behind froze.
If that was happeining to your jobs what would you do?

IF that was happening to me I would go home too. But the impression of what you were saying was that hot is pointless, end of! And it isnt that simple. 90% of the time hot enables me to work when otherwise I owuldn't have been able to.

Hot water does freeze quicker than cold

Bored of saying this, but this is only true under VERY specific cicrumstances - in tall, narrow cylinders, typically - that don't apply to the way you use hot water in WFP.

Keep repeating it though and it might come true just for you.

Vin

Correct, which is a novelty 

[Nathanael Jones]

perfect windows, excuse my ignorance.

So your saying this hot water freezing quicker than cold only applies in test tubes?

Nat, i know you have hot water system, you posted last year i think, what was the temp the water has to be in relation to outside temp to prevnt cracking glass?

thanks lee

I try to keep the hot water about 20C above ambient in this weather,.. hardly even lukewarm to be honest, but its enough to stop the hoses & jets freezing & let me keep working. In summer I'd happily use it at 50C,.. but in winter I'm very cautious. I've never cracked a window yet.

[landy2]

having a hot system is pointless i have been using cold and i dont see a advantage to change and pay more money for more to go wrong for no advantage

in winter hot systems have no advantage over cold
1 water will still freeze on glass
2 water will still freeze on the floor
3 hot water freezes faster than cold water

so any one with a hot system no better off than anyone with a cold system

[lee_dewing]

thanks very much for the ino Nat, what's it like in your part of the world, weather wise?

thanks lee
Ps. merry xmas

[Alex Allen]

hot nots pointless
but it is pointless using it all the time
in the summer cold water systems water
will be warmer than those using hot in the winter   :

[Perfect Windows]

perfect windows, excuse my ignorance.

So your saying this hot water freezing quicker than cold only applies in test tubes?

Not just test tubes; tall buckets of water will do the job.

Vin