[ftp]

Where do the fishing pole guys stand regarding insurance cover?
Diy gutter suckers
Diy Heater installers
Ladders that aren't trade quality etc.

What I mean is if the tool isn't designed for the job in hand or manufactured by a supplier will it affect our public liability insurance in the event of an accident?
What is the limit on pole height for guttervac and cleaning windows.
Are there any limits?

[david watts]

i wouldnt go the fishing route with poles;
but the heater i would hook up in the garage heat water up then go out.
in other words when out doing my job would take all precautions to make life easy and safe
from where theres blame theres a claim brigade.

[ftp]

So..... do you think this trade will become regulated like having kite-marks on poles etc?

I did wonder what would happen if your pole snapped and came down on a member of public. Most of us would use a pole until it broke anyway. Then you know it's worn out and needs replacing.

[Moderator David@stives]

What constitutes a manufacturer ?

And what about kit Cars ?

[gewindows]

A manufacturer will have insurance specifically to cover against manufacturing defects, you as a business operating primarily in the business of cleaning wont have that.

[matt]

tools fit for purpose

i have used my fishing pole for 2 and 1/2 years so far, its given that its fit for purpose

now wear and tear will come into play and that could be with anything, DIY or off-the-shelf

[matt]

Not questioning if it fit for purpose matt, I’m sure when you make a DIY pole it very good, but in the event someone other than you got injured with your wfp pole you will have to pay out yourself if they make a claim or worse the authorities, if you don’t have that insurance, worse case scenario you could lose everything, not likely to happen but it could and that’s why this insurance is there.

isnt that the point of my 5 mill PL insurance though

this discussion from dave is would we stand

my point is that the insurance company would need all the details and then question if the tool was fit for purpose and after 2 and 1/2 years it is

[jonnyald]

id think any modified tool would be a get out clause for an insurance firm. 


 out of interest has anybody heard of any windowcleaning insurance claim stories?

[macmac]

Had a talk with someone from HSE today. NO names, locations or ANY other information was given to him. Just the scenario from the original post yesterday.

UNLESS the manufacturer or supplier of the said "bespoke" pole had engineered & tested it & supplied/recommended it's use to that height I was right in what I suggested.

OR, the said "bespoke" pole could be independantly tested & recommended ONLY by a person qualyfied in that field to do so. NOT the user (unless ofcourse he does indeed posess such qualifications).

There is a legal & moral obligation by the user & employer.

Even worse, a civil claim by the employee arising from injury by using an unsuitable "bespoke" tool could cost the employer very dearly!

If an accident did occur with the said pole, an investigation would look streight into the manufactureres/suppliers instructions & recommendations for use.

Also, just because the pole hasn't broke in use so far does not mean it's fit for purpose, it just means it hasn't broken YET!

He told me a lot more too but can only absorb so much. The main point being, if nothing happens then fine, but if something does it could have serious consequences

Food for thought hey?

[wizard]

I thought we were window cleaners. What’s all this solicitor speak I wonder. Insurance companies must love it. What are the chance of all this happening and IF If IF.the sky fell in.

[Gav Camm lammy 283]

here here wizard al ,mac ,macs done is rile dave gud luck to him
n i mean that dave gud luck i think jealousy n a bit ov the old green ,monster
creeping in 

[mark dew]

macmac might be blunt in his assessments but he's no fool and unlikely to be doing it out of jealousy. It is a valid point he is making.
Especially as gardiners do not recommend extending the sl2 above 60ft.
Nothing has gone wrong and nothing has been done wrong.
But i wonder if a pole snapping at above  recommended height would introduce a criminal element to what would ordinarily be an accident and no more than a civil case if it ever went to court?

[macmac]

macmac might be blunt in his assessments but he's no fool and unlikely to be doing it out of jealousy. It is a valid point he is making.
Especially as gardiners do not recommend extending the sl2 above 60ft.
Nothing has gone wrong and nothing has been done wrong.
But i wonder if a pole snapping at above  recommended height would introduce a criminal element to what would ordinarily be an accident and no more than a civil case if it ever went to court?

At last, someone who can see exactly what I'm trying to put forward.

Might be unlikely yes, but wouldn't you rather know just incase wizard/Lammy?

[ftp]

Bullying? It's a discussion that's all 

[macmac]

Where is the balance drawn between making a point that few of us seem to grasp, even if we are too thick, and harassing a poster on here by following him from thread to thread and even starting new ones to restate your argument.

At some point this becomes forum bullying.

Can you see our point?

I suggest you grow up & stop looking for some sort of pathetic sympathetic support.

[macmac]

People are scared to post openly on here, about work, tax, and equipment. Thats not good.

What & that's my fault because I pointed out that a health & safety expert could possibly be doing something wrong?

He won't post the original pics back up, why do you think that is? shouldn't be a problem should it?

I'm not a hipocrit, just honest & to the piont!

[♠Winp®oClean♠]

A guy said he was running a multi van (ten i think) operation, with a mix of domestic and commercial work.It was vague whether he actually owned the vans other than the one he used, but the window cleaners were employed on a sub contract basis according to the giste of the thread. The great thing about this business was that he managed to both stay under the limit and avoid many of the complications of employing people.

What a great thread this was, and then all of a sudden the guy clammed up.

He may have been joking, he may have found a great loop hole, who knows.Live and let live.

And maybe he just didn't want to give his business savvy away to his competition?

But what has this post got to do with what macmac was trying to put forward?

Can a debate not take place just because a popular moderator dropped a clanger?

I see the person in question has tried to ammend his clanger with a nice set of new improved photos

[Moderator David@stives]

Winpoclean

Nasty rumours can harm a business.

remember the old saying throw enough mud and some of it will stick.

the person involved only wanted to show photos, not to get into an arguement about them