[daniel worgan]

I know my customers fairly well and I often will tailor a clean to suit their personalities; if they're fussy - I'm a little more fussy with my cleaning.  If they're not fussy, I'm fast!  If they're too fussy they'd be dumped; but this hasn't happened I don't think.

This is a business at the end of the day, we're here to make money, not to hang around waiting for windows to dry so we can check them, nor are we here to provide 'perfectly clean' windows; acceptable is good enough for me, and it must be good enough for my customers too.  I haven't lost one in ages and I've never lost a load in one go due to how I/we work (or for any other reason for that matter).

Other window cleaners may clean windows to a higher standard than I, but I don't give a fat WRACs pump; I'm happy with the way we work!

I to know my customers and each and everyone of them gets equal treatment,that is a job well done,no half measures to suit their personalities.Imo that is not a very professional attitude to take.
Wfp customers need to be told about possible spotting on the initial clean,after that if they are spotting then you are not cleaning them properly.Of course this is only my opinion and i expect to get shot down in flames over them... :

[Tosh]

I know my customers fairly well and I often will tailor a clean to suit their personalities; if they're fussy - I'm a little more fussy with my cleaning.  If they're not fussy, I'm fast!  If they're too fussy they'd be dumped; but this hasn't happened I don't think.

This is a business at the end of the day, we're here to make money, not to hang around waiting for windows to dry so we can check them, nor are we here to provide 'perfectly clean' windows; acceptable is good enough for me, and it must be good enough for my customers too.  I haven't lost one in ages and I've never lost a load in one go due to how I/we work (or for any other reason for that matter).

Other window cleaners may clean windows to a higher standard than I, but I don't give a fat WRACs pump; I'm happy with the way we work!

I to know my customers and each and everyone of them gets equal treatment,that is a job well done,no half measures to suit their personalities.Imo that is not a very professional attitude to take.
Wfp customers need to be told about possible spotting on the initial clean,after that if they are spotting then you are not cleaning them properly.Of course this is only my opinion and i expect to get shot down in flames over them... :

That all sounds very honourable of you, Daniel, my good man, but I like to apply a little common sense to how I work.  Now read the last line of my quoted post!

 

[daniel worgan]

Yes i read your post from beginning to end,but i still felt that i wanted to put my point of view across.Of course i take it that is ok with you tosh and with other forum members 

[Tosh]

Yeh, that's okay, Daniel, I don't mind.

[stephen s]

firstly steven, what do you drive around with, an hgv  tanker  : to spend all that time, and guarantee spottless clean windows and frames  first time round,  you must be using tons of water, if it was glass only  i would agree, the 3 clean con, as you call it is not a con, it is there for several reasons, the main reason is, surprising  not for making sure they are clean, but for w/c who have a  very large customer base changing over to wfp, now can you imagine what that would be like having 300 or more customers, and converting over from trad  to wfp? it would take far to long  if they had to spend 30mins or more on each house, the 3 cleans helps them to slowly but gradualy convert over from trad  to wfp,
steven, you may know this, or not, trad w/c are now being advice before changing over, to clean and wipe all frames, sills,air vents by hand, and by doing it that way, almost certainly cuts out the 3 cleans. also it is a protection for newbies to give them the chance to perfect there skills at wfp, and at the same time given them some protection from complaints. there are many reasons for the 3 clean con  

yes Joe.

I do use lots of water on 1st cleans and yes I do spend more time because as I stated earlier,  spend the time and get it right and it makes all the future cleans easier

[stephen s]

I've just done one for the third time today and it's still very poor - painted windows with deep frames - absolute nightmare.
Mind you it would be perfect if I didn't look at it when I'd finished.  :

I do a couple were the frames bleed on every clean,  solution  wash em rinse em  and then do a 2nd rinse

[stephen s]

I certainly dont think telling a customer "it may take 3 cleans to get them perfect" is a con. As this seem to be the norm advise you get when you purchase a system from the companies that sell the systems





I do cos it is a con,  its utter drivel   hence the reason the 2nd customer today was happy to pay the extra £3 to have the windows cleaned PROPERLY      maybe its because some people are just too lazy to put the effort in so they come out with that tripe.

as for the norm advice you say ?  don't know what company you got your system from Bob but I'm afraid theve told you a bare faced pack of lies

will say it again HOW HARD IS IT TO CLEAN A PIECE OF GLASS ?    answers over the next 3 months  

The issue with that is that if the other cleaner came back and did a second clean, his work would probably have been fine too.  He did the first clean for you and you reaped the reward.  You crafty git   

honest mate if you seen the windows which he cleaned 2/3 days beore me you would not have paid him.     and Ive now had a call for another quote when I came home today 6 doors down from the 2nd customer

[stephen s]

i have personally have never told a customer it can take three cleans
to get your windows cleaned correctly,i do tell the customer when
ihave cleaned their windows for the first time that there is a small
chance that there could be some spotting and to feel free to call me
if there is a problem so i can correct it.

in last three years i have only been called back twice

i clean windows to my customers satisfaction
if they are satisfied im happy.

and I tell them exactly the same

[stephen s]

well i must say that this for turned into a very good debate.

now this is what the forums are really about,
not just asking them same old silly questions which have been posted 1000 times before,cause you cant be assed to do a search

keep it up lads.

steven have you got pictures of yourself dressed up plz,

well said Richard.


I don't mind what people think or say to me on here,  thats their choice but I have my opinion and I stand by that,      think of me what you like  just don't GET PERSONAL   





yes it is a good topic and yes it beats the how much does everyone earn type topcs  yawn yawn

[stephen s]

here is a pic of stephen dressed up,

no mate I wear white fishnet stockings 

[stephen s]

and here he is drive in to work,

nice one big ears 

[Clive McDonald]

Calling people con artists who warn first clean results might not be perfect is a bit personal, so to ask that replies aren't of a personal nature when you put your point over in such a bombastic and dogmatic way is a bit hypocritical.

And this thread is very far from being a good debate.

Reading some of your posts you do seem to know what you are talking about and also have a reasonably well thought out approach to this business.The problem comes when you try to impose dogmatic views on others.

[Clive McDonald]

Dogmatic is when you refuse to see any view point but your own and keep restating it. I don't say anything either about three cleans, but i wouldn't denigrate people who do, and i have had a few nasty surprises when what i thought was a brilliant job wasn't.

I can and have made mistakes so when i see others trying to avoid this i do not damn them as incompetent or con men.

[stephen s]

Calling people con artists who warn first clean results might not be perfect is a bit personal, so to ask that replies aren't of a personal nature when you put your point over in such a bombastic and dogmatic way is a bit hypocritical.

And this thread is very far from being a good debate.

Reading some of your posts you do seem to know what you are talking about and also have a reasonably well thought out approach to this business.The problem comes when you try to impose dogmatic views on others.

I'm not dogmatic my friend as I'm not trying to impose my opinions on people I'm mearly giving my honest opinion based on my experiences,   thats not being agressive or trying to force it on other people.



when people say its gonna open a can of worms as in a few replies to this post then surely that means a topic for debate ?    where not a dictatorship just yet are we



as for your comments about whats personal,  well let me you right.    by saying people who use the 3 clean con trick is not personal my friend as its a collective,   to make it personal it when you SINGLE someone out  thats PERSOANL

[stephen s]

Calling people con artists who warn first clean results might not be perfect is a bit personal, so to ask that replies aren't of a personal nature when you put your point over in such a bombastic and dogmatic way is a bit hypocritical.

And this thread is very far from being a good debate.

Reading some of your posts you do seem to know what you are talking about and also have a reasonably well thought out approach to this business.The problem comes when you try to impose dogmatic views on others.

but thank you for some positive comments as well

[stephen s]

Dogmatic is when you refuse to see any view point but your own and keep restating it. I don't say anything either about three cleans, but i wouldn't denigrate people who do, and i have had a few nasty surprises when what i thought was a brilliant job wasn't.

I can and have made mistakes so when i see others trying to avoid this i do not damn them as incompetent or con men.

no your wrong again my friend,  Ive made my case and listetened to everyones views and beacuse I don't share them all that doesn't mean I'm dogmatic  it means Ive based my case on my experiences.


and I'Ve not been convinced I'm wrong,   but hey if thats dogmatic to you then thats your affair.

now if you could justify why it can take 3 cleans then the forum is yours  CONVINCE ME    give me the facts

[stephen s]

Dogmatic is when you refuse to see any view point but your own and keep restating it. I don't say anything either about three cleans, but i wouldn't denigrate people who do, and i have had a few nasty surprises when what i thought was a brilliant job wasn't.

I can and have made mistakes so when i see others trying to avoid this i do not damn them as incompetent or con men.

great reply my friend and full respect to you because after reading my thread I can understand how it may seem aggressive but I certainly wss't in anagressive mood when I wrote it nor have any of the replies caussed me agression as I'm not that type of person,  yes I am a big 6ft-6 giant who weighs 20 stone but I'm a BFG and proud of that fact,    but if I have something to say I will say it




Is the 3 clean rule every individuals own original view? Or have they been told that. You could quite easily say, stay at the job up to 3 times as long on initial cleans to get the windows up to standard. Which in my opinion should be the norm and not the 3 visits & cleans?

I agree though his thread is aggressive, but his point about the 3 clean rule is very valid, he could have challenged the rule more diplomatically when he started this thread, but that’s CIU   

[stephen s]

[

I can and have made mistakes so when i see others trying to avoid this i do not damn them as incompetent or con men.













yes we all make mistakes ( said the darlek climbing off dustbin  )          but surely telling a customer it mat take 3 cleans to bring it up right when if you put the effort in and gave the job the time it deserves  then thats not making a mistake my friend,     

[stephen s]

over 120 posts for this topic       

[Frankybadboy]

over 120 posts for this topic       

thats  cause 110 of them are yours my friend,


trying to get your post count up or what.