[Londoner]

Lost a good customer today, bit suprised really. She was always very friendly, sent my wife a picture of her new baby a year or so back etc.
Suddenly now she wants to cancel, I know there have been people canvassing in that area because other customers have told me.
This customer and her husband are both very yuppie types and these are the ones that are being affected most at the moment in my experience.

Other people are posting "recession what recession?" but here in the London suburbs its really starting to be felt. One of the things I have noticed is the number if empty shops that are appearing. A local newsagent has gone this week.
Nearly all the customers I have lost have been people that run thier own businesses or people with good jobs.

[karygate]

i am getting a few need to leave it this month, but that is better than cancelling. weather is not helping either.

[SherwoodCleaningSe]

I've not lost any in the past month but I did have a bad day a month ago.  I think a few of those were to undercutting.  It makes me laugh when people say they have a £10 minimum charge as the ones that have been undercut have been under a tenner.  It's the yuppy London workers that I've lost as well.

I've seen loads of new wc's around recently as well.  And I've been asked by a few to price up when they already have a wc.

It's defiantly kicking in at the London suburbia.
Simon.

[dmlservices]

as long as how much , price per hour , earnings per day topics, appear on here,

it will make it easy for undercutters coming in to the trade,

any one can come on here , do a bit of searching, ask questions ect,

then armed with a good idea of prices , go out and undercut,

i agree some sharing of knowledge is good , but some of the braggers on here
take it to extremes.

daz

[trike]

not lost any gaining all the time 5pound 3bed semis,no wounder

[LSB]

i have only recently started to lose a few more than normal !
( i agree the new year could be harder for many people )
however i am also picking up more new customers than normal !!

[johns window kleen]

I totally agree with this Daz, but it's always puzzled me that this forum is for window cleaners/window cleaning companies, but there is no policing to check who on here is a bona fide WC!!!

TOO MUCH UNDERCUTTING GOING ON. TOO MANY NON WINDOW CLEANERS GETTING IDEAS.
 Thats why I give away very little on here, but do like the topics and the good and genuine advice given by some. Bragging is bull***t. I think you should have to prove you are infact a WC to be on here.[

[DASERVICES]

I totally agree with this Daz, but it's always puzzled me that this forum is for window cleaners/window cleaning companies, but there is no policing to check who on here is a bona fide WC!!!

There is one in Scotland - www.slwcn.org. This will list all bona fide window cleaners.

The SLWCN has just received an official letter, only licensed window cleaners will operate in the area. Target set 100%. We shall wait and see.

[Slash]

I totally agree with this Daz, but it's always puzzled me that this forum is for window cleaners/window cleaning companies, but there is no policing to check who on here is a bona fide WC!!!

TOO MUCH UNDERCUTTING GOING ON. TOO MANY NON WINDOW CLEANERS GETTING IDEAS.
 Thats why I give away very little on here, but do like the topics and the good and genuine advice given by some. Bragging is bull***t. I think you should have to prove you are infact a WC to be on here.[

I have a ladder and that,am I one

[sean.w.c.s]

i agree with the above. people think window cleaning a easy ride  that you earn  load aday  than they under cutter you because there used to earn £50 to 60 day so happy at earning that. they forget it rains alot and pack when  they get fedup which muck the pricing up. I wish  it was licensed in england   it might stop the fly by nights

[Jimmy1]

Ive not lost any so far to undercutting. But if I do, then I say good ridance, as I dont want these type of clients. Your best just replace them, not think any more about them and move onwards and upwards!

[Londoner]

Undercutters are usually people who just want quick money and don't really care about the long term effects of what they are doing.
According to the radio yesterday the TUC estimate that jobs are going at a rate of over 1000 a day and its increasing. Thats where all the new window cleaners are coming from.

Talking to one of my customers yesterday, her husband is a plumber but does a lot of kitchens and bathrooms type work. She said his work has dropped to nothing and things were getting really sticky, so much so they were talking about maybe having to sell the house. Now he's gone to work for the council on the maintainance side, its rubbish money but its regular.

There must be loads of people in this position. Ignore the big house and the flash car they mean nothing. What is really going on behind that front door? Often you will never know.

[cybersye]

as long as how much , price per hour , earnings per day topics, appear on here,

it will make it easy for undercutters coming in to the trade,

any one can come on here , do a bit of searching, ask questions ect,

then armed with a good idea of prices , go out and undercut,

i agree some sharing of knowledge is good , but some of the braggers on here
take it to extremes.

daz

this is all very true
and anyone can come on here, look how many leave their profiles blank ( not that you'd have to fill it with true info anyhow ). Its also great to see pics of peoples vans etc. but all that info can lead straight into the hands of your competition and you cant always be sure who that is.  This forum is very friendly and helpful in the norm so maybe I am being over paranoid, but food for thought.

Undercutters may not always know thats what they're doing and £10 per hour could seem very attractive to those previously in low paid employment. (it was to me when I started on my own )
There is no loyalty in business and customers are not always honest when asking for quotes.
Sadly this is the way things are these days, but cheaper should not always mean inferior.
How many times have you seen a post on here asking wheres the cheapest place to by resin, hose, poles etc......... ?
"money makes the world go round" unfortunately and its something we are all play a part in.

[alanwilson]

well said!

There was a thread a while ago about how much money people on the forum make - it makes me laugh when people post £40 an hr, what does this mean?  Does it mean you make £1400 a week?

I don't look at what we make in an hr or a day - its what we make in the month thats important - assume 144 work hrs per month, now assume £25 an hr = £3600 a month, I doubt many on here make as much as that, otherwise we wouldn't see so many where's the cheapest place to buy resin topics.

funny thing is most guys on here will claim to make more than £25 an hr.

[Paul Coleman]

well said!

There was a thread a while ago about how much money people on the forum make - it makes me laugh when people post £40 an hr, what does this mean?  Does it mean you make £1400 a week?

I don't look at what we make in an hr or a day - its what we make in the month thats important - assume 144 work hrs per month, now assume £25 an hr = £3600 a month, I doubt many on here make as much as that, otherwise we wouldn't see so many where's the cheapest place to buy resin topics.

funny thing is most guys on here will claim to make more than £25 an hr.

Yes there is a very big difference from what can be made in an individual hour and the overall turnover.

[ftp]

Funny to see some of the biggest earners/boasters buying cheap heaters and diy'ing them into their vans. Others who claim to have the best paying rounds in the country were posting how to use a decorators pole not long back. Makes you wonder just what real earnings are sometimes.

[sageorgeta]

It allways makes me laugh the amount of times that "BIG EARNERS" who like to boast about it are fake.
Why would a wc who is apparently earning a small fortune drive round in a battered old car with ladders bungy strapped to a roof rack?
Why would they look like they have been dragged through a hedge backwards when they turn up to a customers house?
Why when you go around to their houses do they live like pigs?
Why do they spend more time in the pub than working.
By the way this is not specifically about any on this forum as i dont know them,this is about a few wc's in my area that pretend they have it all.
The world is full of dreamers and liars,and there are plenty on here as well.
Undercutting is a problem in this business mainly caused by easy access into it.If a licensing scheme that was legally implemented was available that may help,but it certainly would not cure the problem.
We have a couple of gangs,polish/croats/serbs...i dont know they all sound the same to me...going round at the moment trying to muscle their way into the areas.Now the majority of customers will tell them where to go but there will be a few who drop their old wc for these fly by nights,and it doesn't matter how good a round you have,if you lose any customers to undercutting in these uncertain times it will send alarm bells ringing.
I let all my customers know that these undercutters are going around,and i even tell them that they should be carefull as they may be looking to rip them off (even though it may not be true) and then the word spreads very quickly,especially amongst the old.I dont care,i have took a long time to build an income for me and my family and i will pull all the underhanded tatics that i can to not lose it. 

[alanwilson]

and why not?

undercutting when they know/don't care if someone is already doing the windows, is underhanded.  we've been undercut on houses, apartment blocks, shops, factories, you name it - customer loyalty is getting scarce so why not pull out the stops to ensure you have a secure customer base.

[Gordon Saunders]

 I do not see the problem with undercutting personally. We live in a "free country" operating a "free market" . Anyone can offer a W/C service for any price they like to whom ever they like.
  If i could undercut a competitor and still make my money out of a job then i would.  Like wise i would expect the reverse to be true .  Thats what competition is all about .
  It makes me laugh when people who have built successfully business complain when others try to do the same.

   Cat amongst the pigeons
   
  G

[Chris Galloway]

I do not see the problem with undercutting personally. We live in a "free country" operating a "free market" . Anyone can offer a W/C service for any price they like to whom ever they like.
  If i could undercut a competitor and still make my money out of a job then i would.  Like wise i would expect the reverse to be true .  Thats what competition is all about .
  It makes me laugh when people who have built successfully business complain when others try to do the same.

   Cat amongst the pigeons
   
  G

Very true, i always shop about for things i want BUT i also take into account after service and things like that. Cheap as chips is NOT always the best option!

That why i offer guarantees of service, polite and professional about my business. People know when they have a good thing or not.