[absolutecleaning]

 Hello

 Had a call from a mate last night who has recently started ccing alongside his other cleaning work.  I told him a while ago to get some training but he hasnt and this is what has happened because of it :

1 : He has no idea what the carpet is but "the lady thinks there maybe some wool in it"

2 : There are what the customer has described as "brown scorch marks" on the surface of the carpet

3 : He normally just uses extraction pro but as there was a stain (unidentified) he used multi pro as a pre spray.

I said I would go and have a look with him this morning. 

First need to work out what fibre is - am I right in thinking only wool can suffer from cellulosic browning?

Was then going to ph test a "good" area and then a "bad" area and see what results were as I imagine he left the ph too high.

He says he didnt leave it too wet but I imagine that is a part of the problem.

Is it worth just trying to rinse with acid rinse first before trying browning prescrption?

Do we need to treat the whole carpet or just the affected areas?

Neither of us have air movers and drying will be a big part of this I think - should we do whatever is necessary to get one before we even go over there.

The job was done 2 days ago - not sure if that makes any odds.

Cheers to anyone with advice here and sorry about long winded post

Si

[Jim_77]

sorry about long winded post

You obviously haven't read some of my novels!

Cellulosic browning can happen to any material that contains cells, i.e. any natural fibre.

pH may be an issue, but regardless of whether it is, testing for pH will help a little bit to reassure the customer.  Doing something "technical looking" is better than just frowning and drawing sharp breaths.

Ask how soon after cleaning the carpet felt dry, and how soon after cleaning the marks became apparent.  Remember that if she says "3 hours" it might not be 3 hours - many of my customers feel a carpet and say "oh it's dry" and I know damn well it's not!

Ask her if she did anything to try to correct it.

As for correcting it yourself... god knows, I've never trashed a carpet like this so I've never had to fix it.  Someone else will have to help out with that!


P.S. maybe this thread should be stuck to the top of the forum?  Hopefully it will help convince the untrained warriors to go and do some courses!

[garry22]

We are dealing with second / third hand info here.

The only time it has happened to me is when a valve leaked on a portable.

One patch of the carpet got wet without anyone noticing. About three days later the client had a brown / orange stain about eighteen inches across. Does this sound like the "scorched" area?

Following advice from Prochem, we treated the area with their Browning Prescription.

This was diluted according to directions and then MISTED on with a sprayer. A rotary machine with a bonnet also sprayed was run over the area.

The trick was to keep the moisture levels to a minimum. All of the stain came out.

Best of luck. if in any doubt try the advice line, they were really helpful.

Garry

[markpowell]

Celluosic browning happens when a carpet has been cleaned. The brown discolouration is generally caused by the presence of a celluosic fibre such as cotton, jute or flax.
The 2 factors that create the risk for the browning to occur are
1.Moisture  ( especially alkaline)
2.slow drying

You need to identify the reason forthe  browning to be able to rectify the problem.
Take some ph paper, wet the affected area with a little water, press the ph paper down in the fibres.
If the reading is ph 6-8 then the browning is caused by over wetting, if the ph is 8+ then the problem is caused by using too high ph.

You will need some acid rinse, browning prescription maybe oxidising bleach and an airmover to reverse the problem.
Good luck Mark

[Mike Osbourne]

Mark

If it's caused by overwetting how is the treatment different to using an acid rinse?

[derek west]

correct me if i'm wrong, and i probably am, but i dont care cos, well!! cos, that'll do. but browning is caused by the backing, usually jute and maybe hessian, if these get to wet they bleed browning which wickis up to the fibres, wool or man made, its caused by overwetting or by to much alcali in the overwetting. the jute gets wett, it bleeds and then when people walk on it it blots up into the fibres.
acid rinse is supposed to nutralise the alkali and stop the browning process, once brownong has occurred the your forked, all though i dont know this cos ive never had to correct browning cos i know how to avoid it.
hope this help
long live newcastlke cbrown ale.
roll on my chinese, think its being delivered from china.
derek

[Mike Osbourne]

Derek

I sort of get the jist of what you mean.

Well done on the £1k by the way, make sure you treat yourself.

[derek west]

had a semi cancellation this morning mike, and thats nothing sexual by the way.
was 150 but ended up 65 quid, gutted, so the 1k will have to wait.
i'll get there eventually.
but cheers for the heds up
derek

[Mike Osbourne]

Derek,

The more you get booked in the more cancellations you get I suppose.

This is my first year I've had a healthy crop of pre Christmas bookings, mainly from existing Clients - but had 2 cancels and one keeps changing and sure will end up not going ahead. All booked before global financial meltdown.

Did you say you get most your stuff from YP at the moment?

[derek west]

no no noooooooooooo
yell pages she hite, and thats not meant in a fundamentalist type way.
yell dotty dot dot com, gooooooooooood
yell pages bad
yell dot comb, smooth silky hair good
anywway you catch my drift, and no ive not dropped one.
derek
all tanked up and ready for bed. or pub, what ever comes first.

[Mike Osbourne]

Sorry i meant yell.com

Lucky if I get 2 calls a month directly from that.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Derek how you going on with your paper ads?

Shaun

[derek west]

i do buy sell and the northwich winsford and knutsford guardian, getting a call a week off each ishhhh.
so well worth it.
got to colour mag adds going out this and next week. flingers clossed, (sorry just had a chinese)
derek

[Shaun_Ashmore]

hope you don't get the pig tails stuck!

Shaun

[derek west]

got me spankin rx today, gorgeous, nearly had a wank over it, good job the misses walked in.
derek

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Derek you have a way with words I just don't want to think about what you get up to when customers book in £200+ jobs in!

Shaun

[cleaningmaster]

Si
you could try misting over the bad stains with Acetic Acid from Chemspec
and mist over rest with a acid rinse.
If you are lucky it may dissappear in front of your eyes.
But do a test first.
Good luck

Derek
Dont take this the wrong way. but dont be so cocky. You may know
how to avoid it but it doesnt mean that it will never happen to you.

Regards

Daryl
 

[Mike Osbourne]

Si
you could try misting over the bad stains with Acetic Acid from Chemspec

 

I'm sure acetic acid from Sarsons is cheaper

Distilled of course.

[Jim_77]

flingers clossed, (sorry just had a chinese)

I'm sorry but I LOL'd at that very much

[absolutecleaning]

Cheers for advice

Misted prochem browning prescription on and allowed to dwell for 10 mins. 
Then misted over with water using hand tool. 
Then extracted with water and several vac strokes.
Then used portable mini airmover (hairdryer to you and me ) and problem appears to be solved.

My mate hasnt had a call back yet so must have worked and hopefully he may have at least had a look online for training of some sort!