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Joe H

Re: drying
« Reply #20 on: September 18, 2008, 10:25:13 pm »
Martin uses an Envirodri with their sponges, but he will pre spray when neccesary.
As he says he does EOT which as we all know can be really bad.

Doug Holloway

  • Posts: 3917
Re: drying
« Reply #21 on: September 18, 2008, 10:38:18 pm »
Hi Guys

It's worth bearing in mind that dry systems such as Host and Enviridry used sawdust which is wet, probably containing 15 - 20 % moisture.

It would be impossible to have a completely dry material ( unless in a dessicator).

Cheers

Doug

The Great One

  • Posts: 12722
Re: drying
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2008, 06:53:14 am »
Dryasabone,
These are the facts:
1.Dry cleaning will not remove water based stains.
2.Dry cleaning will not give the same result as HWE.
3.Dry cleaning will not clean as deep as HWE.
4.Dry cleaning is only good for cleaning Sissal, seagrass, saying that the results are not that good even in these cases.

It really is as simple as that!!! ;)
Mark

Sorry Mark, you post is mistaken, maybe you are confusing FibreDri (Prochem,solvent based system) with Host or EnviroDri.

I have been a sole Dry Cleaner for 5 years now, lost count of the number of water based stains that have shot out, even before I have put the sponges down (just pre spray)

With the dry I have done
Soot salvage
Pet Salvage
Student EOT
Pubs
Hotels
Resturants

Dry Cleaning is good for all carpets (I don't touch Sisal or Seagrass) it is not 'just a maintenance clean' it gives a good deep clean, smells great and is dry in about 1/2 an hour.

Although your comments are the general view in our world.

Regards

Martin 8)

Martin,
Is the system you use Dry or low moisture, Dry cleaning will not remove water based stains!!
Mark

Hi Mark

Yes I use LM system, as Joe says. Of course it is not 100% dry as the sponges are moist and I do pre-spray.

Point taken though.

Regards

Martin 8)

Ian Gourlay

  • Posts: 5746
Re: drying
« Reply #23 on: September 19, 2008, 07:19:09 am »
Jim,
How can "Dry " be classed as gullible marketing when it is sold in over 60 countries ?
Would you honestly allow somebody to soak your woolen carpet ?
I refer to the shiners section and their posts are always inovative and forward thinking ,
All I am saying is 10yrs ago the internet was a silly idea.

I would be interested  to kow how the host etc get on cleaning carpets when the water that comes out is black.

markpowell

  • Posts: 2279
Re: drying
« Reply #24 on: September 19, 2008, 08:30:31 am »
Jim,
How can "Dry " be classed as gullible marketing when it is sold in over 60 countries ?
Would you honestly allow somebody to soak your woolen carpet ?
I refer to the shiners section and their posts are always inovative and forward thinking ,
All I am saying is 10yrs ago the internet was a silly idea.

I would be interested  to kow how the host etc get on cleaning carpets when the water that comes out is black.

Ian,
My thoughts exactly. I have used LM in the past. IMO they just spread the soiling about thinning it over a larger area, the results can look good but to be no comparison to HWE in most cases. The guys on here that harp on about Dry / LM carpet cleaning, have you ever used HWE and if so what did you think?
Mark

garry22

Re: drying
« Reply #25 on: September 19, 2008, 12:23:25 pm »
Intersting discussion.

I've run a small indepent company (not tied to a franchise, so we can use what we like) for nineteen years. We use the following...

CARPETS.
1/ Hot water extraction (3 portables including CFR. I never thought I'd be in business long enough to justify a truck mount!)
2/ Low moisture (Dry Fusion & micro splitters with microfibre pads)
3/ Dry compound (HOST. I have used enviro dry but can't really say if one is better than the other).

UPHOLSTERY.
1/ HWE (CFR).
2/ Von Shrader.

The fact is that they are all the best to use IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS.

I've had times where I've used one system only eg HOST. The fact is that sooner or later you will come across a situation where a different approach works better. Here's a few examples.

1/ In the early nineties, I cleaned a really greasy pub carpet with HOST, just the way Geoff Greeley from HOST showed me. It came up great. The problem was that an area about the size of two through lounges cost about £70 in HOST compound and several hours of my time! Nowadays, I do them with HWE.

2/ We have been doing a large office block twice a year for several years (low profile loop tiles, with lots of drinks spillages).
HOST did not touch them (even with black brushes), HWE led to stains wicking back, but Dry Fusion has got them looking like the day the were laid. The client loves it.

3/ We've got people with floatex carpets that cannot be cleaned with DF and are a pig to dry with HWE. HOST brings them up beautifully. We also do server rooms that have to be cleaned with HOST. I've even got domestic customers who insist that they have carpets cleaned "with those cornflakes" (even when they've got navy blue long piled carpets - You try vacuuming dry compound off those!).

UPHOLSTERY.
I've had problems with VS with re-soiling due to the amount of foam left in the fabric. I've also found there is a point when HWE produces a much better result, particularly on greasy or grimed in dirt. This is especially true on folds on the arms of suites. With a CFR machine (HWE), being able to use a fine mist at up to 350 psi, in an enclosed tool gets fantastic results.

VS, however is great on quick turnaround jobs such as coach upholstery where having dry seats is the overiding priority.

With regard to drying we always use turbo dryers with HWE and DF.

The quicker, the better. Heck we even tried to speed up the drying of HOST sponges once by trying to move tha air around up high in a room. We got a mini tornado travel through the house and dump a load of HOST compound on the guy's snooker table!

Most of these methods are years old.

LM was around years ago and as for HOST...
I was at a seminar many years ago with a chap in his seventies. He said his granny used to clean her carpets with old tea leaves and a stiff broom!

I can understand someone's frustration when the invest a load of money and then find the stuff on general sale at half the price. The fact is that it's horses for courses. Go look for the work that suites your equipment

I'll sit back now and wait for the storm to erupt.

Garry

Paul Redden Countryfresh

  • Posts: 773
Re: drying
« Reply #26 on: September 19, 2008, 02:16:02 pm »
Excellent post Garry  ;) You hit the nail on the head.

Paul
"So basically its a big vax!"

Joe H

Re: drying
« Reply #27 on: September 19, 2008, 02:29:44 pm »
Gary summed it up well - horses for courses.

Just glad I got a TM, a Scorpion, Dry Fusion (and a 15" rotary), and Envirodri.
In the last 3 weeks I have used 4 of those 5 - the odd one out on this occassion was the DF.
All this week I have used the Scorpion and I gotta say that is some mean portable machine.

Back to the likes of Martin_606 - he only uses Envirodri across all his c/c jobs.
Got to give him respect for keeping at it and apparanlt making it work.
Just wish he wasnt 300 miles away cause I would love to have a day with him on the Envirodri jobs.

clinton

Re: drying
« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2008, 04:45:37 pm »
Goodpost gary :)

Joe doesnt look like you will be parting with your scorpion just yet ;)

Jim_77

Re: drying
« Reply #29 on: September 19, 2008, 06:10:45 pm »
Garry, I take my hat off to you, that was one of the best posts I've read on here for ages! :)

The Great One

  • Posts: 12722
Re: drying
« Reply #30 on: September 19, 2008, 07:58:59 pm »
Hi

Gary, that is an excellent post.

I totally agree with it and I have to be honest, if we as CC want to give the best service to our customers then we should both wet & dry systems available. no one system is the cure all, they all have pro's and cons.

I have been thinking about adding a wet system myself, otherwise how can I be totally professional.

I have been dry for 5 years, I cannot do upholstery unless I invest about £4,000 for a von Schrader, I can't justify the cost.

So If I want to grow and offer the best for customers then at some point I will have to add a wet system also.

Good post, well written.

Regards

Martin 8)

Joe H

Re: drying
« Reply #31 on: September 20, 2008, 07:55:02 am »
Joe doesnt look like you will be parting with your scorpion just yet ;)

Its good to have a back up machine even when one has a TM.
Sometimes inaccesability is an issue, sometimes a fault (like now) may stop you using the TM.
So why not use what I already have -  arguably the best porty.
I have external twin chamber heat exchanger as well so if I want to use high heat then I can, and if I want "half" heat I can do that as well..

murky

  • Posts: 627
Re: drying
« Reply #32 on: September 20, 2008, 12:48:33 pm »
To Martin 606,

So the carpet will be dry in 'about 1/2 an hour' so its wet then!!!!!!!!!!!
Its not dry is it.

I tell my TM customers the carpets will  'be dry 'in about 2hrs' thats what I tell them, even quicker on a nice day like today.

Also I wouldnt put some powder on my jeans, scrub them with a scrubbing brush and vac the powder off would I to get them clean.

No I would put them in a washing machine with hot water and a phisical action to get them clean.

Feel the force.

Murky

Joe H

Re: drying
« Reply #33 on: September 20, 2008, 04:57:20 pm »
Splitting hairs here.

Those who have an Envirodri or a Host know how good they are for agitating deep into the carpet.

That means then the "sponges", which are slightly damp, will get deep into the carpet also.

Add a bit of pre spray, if the job needs it, and it gets a bit amper, but so long as you dont over prespray and get the carpet wet, then the prepray, aaprt from doing its job, will also be soaked up by the "sponges".

Therefore the carpet will be dry within 30 minutes.

In reality, you only vac the sponges up when they are dry. This means when you leave the job the carpets are dry.

Martin has done this for many years, if he was not getting the right response fromn the client he would have stopped a long time ago. Well done Martin for "perfecting" a system to an acceptable level.

from edge2edge

  • Posts: 1507
Re: drying
« Reply #34 on: September 20, 2008, 05:35:53 pm »
Spot on Joe  If the system works well over years and the clients  pay you good money then something must be right.Earlier this year i spoke to Martin for quite some time and he truly does seem to have nailed this system . I also mix n match when required and find both dry and wet do the job required for the clients at the time      Regards Alan (swindon)

clinton

Re: drying
« Reply #35 on: September 20, 2008, 05:47:06 pm »
Me also

I use h w e    and sometimes l/m cleaning if and when its needed :)

Also in most cases i always go over the carpet when its been extracted with the buffer to help dring times :)

The Great One

  • Posts: 12722
Re: drying
« Reply #36 on: September 20, 2008, 05:58:45 pm »
Dryasabone,
These are the facts:
1.Dry cleaning will not remove water based stains.
2.Dry cleaning will not give the same result as HWE.
3.Dry cleaning will not clean as deep as HWE.
4.Dry cleaning is only good for cleaning Sissal, seagrass, saying that the results are not that good even in these cases.

It really is as simple as that!!! ;)
Mark

Sorry Mark, you post is mistaken, maybe you are confusing FibreDri (Prochem,solvent based system) with Host or EnviroDri.

I have been a sole Dry Cleaner for 5 years now, lost count of the number of water based stains that have shot out, even before I have put the sponges down (just pre spray)

With the dry I have done
Soot salvage
Pet Salvage
Student EOT
Pubs
Hotels
Resturants

Dry Cleaning is good for all carpets (I don't touch Sisal or Seagrass) it is not 'just a maintenance clean' it gives a good deep clean, smells great and is dry in about 1/2 an hour.

Although your comments are the general view in our world.

Regards

Martin 8)

Martin,
Is the system you use Dry or low moisture, Dry cleaning will not remove water based stains!!
Mark

Hi Mark

Yes I use LM system, as Joe says. Of course it is not 100% dry as the sponges are moist and I do pre-spray.

Point taken though.

Regards

Martin 8)

Hi Murky

Which part of '' Of course it's not 100% dry'' did you not understand?

Also read my other post where is does says even I am thinking of adding a wet system. Best to read what is actually written, rather than reading what's not there ;)

There is only 1 true 'DRY' system, I think it's called a Vacuum Cleaner?

Hi Joe

Thanks for the support, appreciated  ;)

Regards

Martin 8)


garry22

Re: drying
« Reply #37 on: September 22, 2008, 11:04:13 am »
Hi Guys,

Thanks for the nice comments and positive response. Sorry for the typing / spelling errors.

Alticry,

Re; Drying times....

I forgot to mention that all pre-vacuuming (commercial and many domestics) is carried out with a Holloway pilelifter.

In many cases the carpet looks almost clean before we've started "proper" cleaning. This affects drying times because we don't have to use half as much pre-spray for HWE or DF. You do not need so many passes with a wand - so less wetting.

It also cuts down dramatically on the amount of dry compound needed so cuts the cost of a job. In most cases it (as the name implies) raises the pile up, which is one of the things thar clients always seem to comment on.

Garry