[Clive McDonald]

I am one of a wave of new starters from about two years ago. Many of my co starters that have stayed with the forum and applied themselves now have better businesses than WC's of long standing.(gauging this by comments and acceptance of what's normal in terms of earnings etc)

It hasn't all been take ,take ,take from us, we've put a lot of ideas in too that everyone has benefited from and helped to continue to raise the overall standard.

But I don't think i'm alone now in being stuck on a certain level with no clear forum success stragegies to follow.

I would like to earn more money and do less work.I've been chasing this since I started and think I have rung every single technical advantage that i can and now believe the only way forward is to employ.

Let's say that a typical round has a george value of four, that the average price is £15 and a typical operator who does not have a compact round does 13 jobs daily. For this he needs 260 monthly customers or twice that for eight weekly.Many on here will have variations of this.

So, I was wondering would the next level up be to employ someone and try to do 20 jobs daily, with them possibly doing more physical work, with me writing slips out and route planning and knocking a few nearby doors. For this 400 monthly customers or 800 eight weekly would be needed.(or 600 six weekly).I am not at this level yet, but as I am always working seldom find time to chase customers.

I probably need a bigger van for the weight (I would like 1000l tank two 100 reels etc)

However, I believe I could dip my toe in the water with my scudo 650l by not filling and see how I get on. What do you think?

[bluez]

The first thing I think that anyone looking to make the step from a single van to a multiple set up is make sure your round is at capacity and if possible a little over capacity.

Then maximise the return from your present set up by working all day every day and saturdays if you are not allready. If you need help employ a part timer.

Make sure that breakdowns and running out of water etc are not eating into your work day by ensuring that your system and van and water volume are able for an increase in work.

Then if these things are in order,Change your mind set from self employed to business man and Invest in your business.

Find a worker, partner, franchisee whichever suits you and begin to develop the marketing systems that will bring in a contineuos stream of work or buy in some work.

If I was in the U.K. I would never canvass I would buy as often as I was able, even with all of the associated problems. I cant believe the prices some work changes hands for. I mean 2,3,4 times is nearly free.

There will be issues with growing your business of course but if you are the right man for it then you will persevere. Remember failure just can't handle perseverence.

Look forward to hearing others opinions on the subject, it's a good topic.

[Clive McDonald]

Good advice thanks. I try and do as much as possible and agree with you about getting to capacity and you stated it very well and clearly.The fact that you have stated it clearly means that I now have a specific goal instead of ambling along.(My first goal is therefore getting as close to capacity as I can).

Without making excuses I have commitments in the mornings and have to finish just after three. Very often I am physicaly exhausted anyway and am very glad that I have to stop. I had 20,000 colour leaflets done and was very proud of them, but they have misfired and produce little work. The B&W leaflets i printed at home were very successful.I class marketing as one of my stong points so it has been hard for me toaccept that I have f/ed up. Because I have a hot system I used this, and I believe this has been a mistake in marketing terms. (It's great for cleaning)

You are right as well about my mindset, I have always done well and persistence is one of my qualities, but only ever as lone operator.

Investing is not such a worry as it has always worked for me. I've been looking at the new scudo/expert with a load carry of 1200kg. 14.5k plus vat, and I'd probably think along the lines of Andrew Mcann putting a 900l in instead of my usual DIY efforts.Anyone know how much that is?

I hadn't thought about buying work, currently I get about 15 extra accounts a month, but there are some people in my area that I could try and tempt.And yes wc work is undervalued, good if you are buying bad if you're selling.

Look forward to other comments

[bluez]

dwc, I didnt mean to imply that you personally should work harder,in fact the sooner you start to think off yourself as the business manager the sooner you will get the growth that you are looking for. I like to think of each vehicle as a unit rather than the person who works it.

A vehicle with system is available 168 hours a week. Dark approx 84 hours that means the unit is available for work 84 hours a week I know that my units are not working 84 hours each but that has to be the aim. Instead of thinking about what you can do, think about the hours that the unit is not in operation and get it working as many of those hours as possible.

Sounds like your time constraints will mean that you have to employ at least part time, sooner rather than later to get the increases you want.

[Wayne Thomas]

If you have plenty of work and are considering employing someone think about part time workers and staying below the tax and NI levels first to see how it goes.

[Nathanael Jones]

Discount,... time to start a FRANCHISE!!!

[Moderator David@stives]

Discount

You have to seriously think what you want, are you happy on the tools, or do you want to nurse maid a bunch of staff.

My goal is to have a manager to run things, so i can travel, I have a guy lined up who has loads of potential.

Whichever way it takes a long time.

One thing I would say is to set goals, I try to increase my turnover 50 % year on year, Sounds a lot but if you put your mind to it you will do it.

[Dave Turley]

i've thought about employing but have decided to stay on my own for the forseeable future.

by always refining my work  and planning day by day picking all the cherries and using mediocre jobs to fill in the gaps, i've found I can really maximise my potential.

i don't do jobs just because they're the next one on the list anymore.

i've spoken to older w/c's who have employed for years and the general feedback is if you're happy on your own, and are doing well, you're probably best off staying that way (less hassle)

good luck if you go for it though!