[jonah]

I have been looking at a few different wfp systems , and was thinking of buying one and fitting it myself ( apart from tank . . . leave that to an engineer )   But I was talking to a wfp guy today , who said for insurance reasons the tank had to be fitted by a pro , and needed certification ! Is this right ?

[*Mr Tumble]

I wouldn't listen to 'an wfp guy' (loads on here btw), for info on insurance... I would talk to an insurer.

[NWH]

I`m with A-Plan and the small print does say that it must be fitted by an engineer or similar,i phoned them last week to re new policy and had a word with Nicky who works there.If you fit it yourself and have an accident forget claiming,im not saying go to ionic but i would get someone to do it who does it for a living.

[jonah]

I`m with A-Plan and the small print does say that it must be fitted by an engineer or similar,i phoned them last week to re new policy and had a word with Nicky who works there.If you fit it yourself and have an accident forget claiming,im not saying go to ionic but i would get someone to do it who does it for a living.

Does the person who fits the tank have to provide certificate for insurance purposes ?

[Alex Gardiner]

If you took it along to your local garage , I'm sure it would be sufficient for most insurance companies.

I had a custom-made tank restraint frame made recently by my local garage and the cost came in at under £200 for materials construction and fitting.

[jonah]

If you took it along to your local garage , I'm sure it would be sufficient for most insurance companies.

I had a custom-made tank restraint frame made recently by my local garage and the cost came in at under £200 for materials construction and fitting.

Just want to make sure that I am covered , because Insurance company dont need much of an excuse to not pay out 

[TennetClean]

If you took it along to your local garage , I'm sure it would be sufficient for most insurance companies.

I wouldnt be so sure.  I wanted a motor insurance quote last week from a company called alexander swan and they asked if the system had a fitting certificate.

When i asked what was that, they said to make sure it complied with FMV208.  I didn't have that, and they said , the insurer Zurich (not them as the broker) would not insure me because of it.  They said withut that they cant be sure its a safe modification to the vehicle, and something about insurance for limosines being a similar problem recently.

I will have to go elsewhere, but she said if you dont tell your insurer about the modification and it is actually on the policy doc as a mod, then you wont be insured.  If you then have an accident, you are not covered and also have been driving around without insurance and will get done for that on top of the accident.

I am a bit stuck now, I dont really dare tell another insurance comp about the system because they might ask for this certificate, and if i dont mention it i wont be covered anyway.  Its due next month, havent figured out what to do about it as yet.  I think this is a bigger probelm than people realise.   

[jonah]

If you took it along to your local garage , I'm sure it would be sufficient for most insurance companies.

I wouldnt be so sure.  I wanted a motor insurance quote last week from a company called alexander swan and they asked if the system had a fitting certificate.

When i asked what was that, they said to make sure it complied with FMV208.  I didn't have that, and they said , the insurer Zurich (not them as the broker) would not insure me because of it.  They said withut that they cant be sure its a safe modification to the vehicle, and something about insurance for limosines being a similar problem recently.

I will have to go elsewhere, but she said if you dont tell your insurer about the modification and it is actually on the policy doc as a mod, then you wont be insured.  If you then have an accident, you are not covered and also have been driving around without insurance and could get done.

I am a bit stuck now, I dont really dare tell another insurance comp about the system because they might ask for this certificate, and if i dont mention it i wont be covered anyway.  Its due next month, havent figured out what to do about it as yet.  I think this is a bigger issue than people realise. 

Why dont you show your softer side more often ?  You can help a lot of people on here ! 

[TennetClean]

Why dont you show your softer side more often ?  You can help a lot of people on here !

LOL, I may come across aggressive but I'm a pussycat really not a tiger.

[jonah]

Why dont you show your softer side more often ?  You can help a lot of people on here !

LOL, I may come across aggressive but I'm a pussycat really not a tiger.

seriously mate , you sometimes jump in with two feet , all guns blazing !  Like reporting ladder users . . . . . what was that about ?  You sound intelligent when issues arise about specifications with wfp , but you spoil it when answering posts !  Take a step back before you answer , and imagine you are talking to a prospective customer 

[jaykie]

I had quotes beginning of April as was having system installed, i ever got a no we cant insure you due to the tank, or they would but never got asked about a certificate.

Chris

[jonah]

check the small print !

[mark dew]

i was told last year that i would have to tell the insurance company about my tank in the back, but they told me they didn't view it as a modification and it would not affect my insurance.

TENNET IS AN ARSE
no one likes him

dunno about no-one. I do enjoy his posts, as varied as they are.  

[Wayne Thomas]

The Inter-Loc Tank Delivery System looks cool-ish, however whoever designed the unique locking system should have designed them with a dovetail fitting (a wedged joint) as this is one of the most simplistic joints with a very strong tension resistance instead of the push fit in system they came up with. Nice idea but could have been strengthened so much simpler.

[*foxman]

Sorry, if you answered my question i missed it.

WHo did you say the manufacturer was again?

Of the interloc i mean?

As for the manufacturer of the Inter-lock system, all you need to know its 100% not us! It's from a company in Europe.

[SherwoodCleaningSe]

When I set up my system, I chose to have the baffled tank supplied and installed by a pro, not ionics though.  The reason being that if I was involved in an accident it should hopefully hold. 

I have my insurance with A plan who asked who installed it but didn't ask for a certificate and still gave me insurance.

I'm not anti ionic, but I reckon there are some other home made and manufactured systems that are just as good if not better, and if a pro fits one then it has to be insurable otherwise it is not fit for purpose. 

I wonder though if there are any old ionics systems that aren't bolted through the chassis with these new fandangoled bolts, that are still driving around and if ionics will refit them free of charge.  I know that tuckerpole started by fitting smallish tanks down with ratchet straps.

Simon.

[Ian_Giles]

A page full of arguments removed. Foxman defended himself admirably, but he should not have had to do so.
Lets stay on topic please.

And on the topic; If your van tank is bolted on, insurance companies can claim it is a modification and can of course ask for safety certificates and the like.
But if it is just strapped down then surely the tank is now considered cargo and that also has to change the perspective of the insurer.

Just about anyone who has a van can carry cargo up to its weight limit can't it? From builders to furniture removers.
A ton pallet of bricks on the back of a flat bed truck will cause just as much carnage as a ton of water in an IBC tank in the back of a van.


Ian
We all know of course that a tank that is caged and bolted to the floor of the van is much safer than one that is just strapped down, but wouldn't it be ironic (as against Ionic ) if the only way to get insured would be to just bung your tank in the back of the van and have it held down by a couple of straps!

[JSMC]

all of this is scaremainering from insurance companies finding another way to cover there backs. they take the money form you but will shaft you if they can.

why is everything so complicated now

[Ian Lancaster]

A page full of arguments removed. Foxman defended himself admirably, but he should not have had to do so.
Lets stay on topic please.

And on the topic; If your van tank is bolted on, insurance companies can claim it is a modification and can of course ask for safety certificates and the like.
But if it is just strapped down then surely the tank is now considered cargo and that also has to change the perspective of the insurer.

Just about anyone who has a van can carry cargo up to its weight limit can't it? From builders to furniture removers.
A ton pallet of bricks on the back of a flat bed truck will cause just as much carnage as a ton of water in an IBC tank in the back of a van.


Ian
We all know of course that a tank that is caged and bolted to the floor of the van is much safer than one that is just strapped down, but wouldn't it be ironic (as against Ionic ) if the only way to get insured would be to just bung your tank in the back of the van and have it held down by a couple of straps!

Exactly

I contacted my insurance company and they told me if the tank was removeable then it wasn't a modification, and didn't affect my insurance.  If it was permanently fitted to the van, then it was a modification and needed to be declared, and the insurance company would decide if they were prepared to insure me.

So:

On my latest van, I've got a couple of lengths of angle iron (2 1/2" x 2 1/2" x 1/4" thick) and bolted them down through the chassis with 15mm high tensile bolts (very thick ones!!)  They fit across the van and the tank fits between them.  Then I've drilled through in four places so I can use a pair of 5ton ratchet straps to secure the tank. 

Now I know there will be plenty of people telling me it isn't strong enough, for whatever reasons, but ask yourself this:  How thick is the metal of the van chassis?  A quarter inch thick angle iron, held in place by 5/8" thick high tensile bolts will not bend/break or otherwise fail, nor will two 5 ton straps snap before the entire structure of the van folds up in the middle.  The installation is only as strong as the thing it's attached to, in this case, the van chassis.

[jewelcleaning]

A page full of arguments removed. Foxman defended himself admirably, but he should not have had to do so.
Lets stay on topic please.

And on the topic; If your van tank is bolted on, insurance companies can claim it is a modification and can of course ask for safety certificates and the like.
But if it is just strapped down then surely the tank is now considered cargo and that also has to change the perspective of the insurer.

Just about anyone who has a van can carry cargo up to its weight limit can't it? From builders to furniture removers.
A ton pallet of bricks on the back of a flat bed truck will cause just as much carnage as a ton of water in an IBC tank in the back of a van.


Ian
We all know of course that a tank that is caged and bolted to the floor of the van is much safer than one that is just strapped down, but wouldn't it be ironic (as against Ionic ) if the only way to get insured would be to just bung your tank in the back of the van and have it held down by a couple of straps!

Exactly

I contacted my insurance company and they told me if the tank was removeable then it wasn't a modification, and didn't affect my insurance.  If it was permanently fitted to the van, then it was a modification and needed to be declared, and the insurance company would decide if they were prepared to insure me.

So:

On my latest van, I've got a couple of lengths of angle iron (2 1/2" x 2 1/2" x 1/4" thick) and bolted them down through the chassis with 15mm high tensile bolts (very thick ones!!)  They fit across the van and the tank fits between them.  Then I've drilled through in four places so I can use a pair of 5ton ratchet straps to secure the tank. 

Now I know there will be plenty of people telling me it isn't strong enough, for whatever reasons, but ask yourself this:  How thick is the metal of the van chassis?  A quarter inch thick angle iron, held in place by 5/8" thick high tensile bolts will not bend/break or otherwise fail, nor will two 5 ton straps snap before the entire structure of the van folds up in the middle.  The installation is only as strong as the thing it's attached to, in this case, the van chassis.

So have you drilled through the chassis rails?  Or just through thin floor?    Either way you will have problems:

Weakening chassis rails by drilling great holes through them, 

or the bolts will tear through the thin flooring no matter how thick or string the bolts are.