[pylofm]

on one of my area's I have leaflet the neighbourhood 6 times in the last 50 weeks.... I still seem to pick up work...but slowly

[Clive McDonald]

I was joking Dave.Cheer up it's not a crime to be succesfull,

I've been wondering about this Paul. It's very important for me to get work in the areas I work. I would like to be the main or dominant window cleaner, but I am far from that at the moment.

[mark dew]

has anyone created a referal scheme....now I am thinking about this but obviously we need to be careful of the wording to avoid giving away too much....does nayone have any past experiance with this type of 'scheme' and and advice...?
Dave.

i would also be interested in how successful people have been with referrals.
I'm a bit dubious because when i pick up work through recommendations, the people who have referred me are just happy that they can provide their friend/colleague/ relative a window cleaner.
I suspect people don't try to refer us unless they already know someone who is wanting a wc anyway.

[matt]

has anyone created a referal scheme....now I am thinking about this but obviously we need to be careful of the wording to avoid giving away too much....does nayone have any past experiance with this type of 'scheme' and and advice...?
Dave.

i would also be interested in how successful people have been with referrals.
I'm a bit dubious because when i pick up work through recommendations, the people who have referred me are just happy that they can provide their friend/colleague/ relative a window cleaner.
I suspect people don't try to refer us unless they already know someone who is wanting a wc anyway.

just add on your " your windows have been cleaned today " slip

If your happy with my work, please recommend me to others

many dont think we need the work

[Londoner]

Thats a good idea. Every little bit counts and thats a free advert really.

I would endorse the idea of re-leafletting an area that you have already done. It does work there is no doubt about it. We get the same leaflet for carpet cleaning through our door every few months. They wouldn't do that if it wasn't worth thier while.

I did a bit of leafletting last week and immediatly picked up several new customers because a previous window cleaner has packed up. Thats just luck, other times you get nothing. My son and I leafletted a long road near us and several roads off it a few months back (about 450 leaflets) and never got a single reply. But thats how it goes, think of it as a constant process rather than a one off campaign.

Window Cleaning franchises, like all franchises, paint a very rosey picture because they want to attract people who know no better. They reel them in like a fish on a line.

The people who take up these franchises are almost certain to fail. If they had the personal qualities to succeed they wouldn't be going to look at franchises like this in the first place. Big franchises like McDonalds and Subway do well but some of the many small ones are almost laughable.

I went to a franchise show a few years ago at Wembley Conference Centre just out of interest. Its only a few miles from where I live and I got free tickets because I work on the rank there sometimes as a taxi driver.
 Total rubbish most of them, an absolute take on yet there were people there showing serious interest in schemes that were little more than scams. Like lambs to the slaughter.

[Clive McDonald]

Franchising does work, and technicaly  you too have a franchise Vince, as do we all.

How many amongst us start ups or established write a business plan?

A marketing plan would include some disscused above.

[Londoner]

Yes but I didn't pay anyone a five figure sum to become a window cleaner and I'm not giving them 20% of my turnover for the rest of my life because I once attended a training course and have thier headed notepaper.

A few of us on here could get togeather and run a training course for would be window cleaners and at the end of the day give out a factsheet with a list of recommended suppliers. Thats virtually all the franchise outfits do except its all packaged up to look like a real deal.

When you franchise you franchise the name, nothing else, if the name is well known its worth paying for. If its not you buy nothing. Franchises are not "schemes" or "plans" to help you start up. Help and guidance should come as part of the deal not be all you get. 

[KarlJones]

The people who take up these franchises are almost certain to fail. If they had the personal qualities to succeed they wouldn't be going to look at franchises like this in the first place. Big franchises like McDonalds and Subway do well but some of the many small ones are almost laughable.

Thats the problem with the general population and the word "franchise".  They seem to think it has something to do with being part of a bigger business and some of the work done for you.  In reality you are part of a small business and working for it.

The word franchise in investment circles means something completely different.  We use the word to describe something that makes company different from everyone else, the thing that gives it the edge, the part that makes it difficult for someone to replicate and as a result improves the profit margins as it can usually charge a premium for the fact it has this edge.  PC World would probably be a good example, big outlets selling computers, TV advertising and online prices. There are lots of shops selling computers but they are the only one doing it this way and it would be hard for someone to catch up, so we call that its "franchise".  Dell on the other hand do not sell in shops and you have to order online.  That is easy to replicate really so you could not call it franchise, yes it would require a lot of advertising but it could be done quite easily.

Anyone who thinks WFP is a franchise is an idiot.  You get no premium from linking yourself to a name that the public have no connection with.  Window cleaning has no franchise in the true sense (there in an exception but I will come to this at the end) and anyone who tries to convince you that a company has something that can not be replicated is probably lying.  When considering buying into a franchise your only questions should be "is it profitable" and "can I replicate it without giving these people my money".

One window cleaning franchise offers such delights as... No Cash Flow Problems? No Advertising? No Competition? No Stress? No Bad Debts?
LOL!!!  But ignoring that, is it profitable and can I replicate it without giving these people my money

Now for the exceptions, insurance and the feds.  The federations do give you a certain element of franchise, it gives you something that the competition may not have (though they can get it so it isn't a true franchise). Likewise insurance will, in some cases, be needed to get the job. 

Everyone should steer clear of franchises that are easy to replicate, but at the same time try to create a franchise (in investment terms, something that makes them different). References, Feds and good Insurance would do a much better job than BIG-NO-NAME wrapped on the side of a van.
 

[Clive McDonald]

Good one karl, nothing like simplifying the issue!

I window clean in my area (as do others) and to that degree I have the franchise.(self appointed or not).

What I mean't about business plans was people questioning what they do and looking for ways to improve, as you are doing Vince by accepting some info and chipping in a little bit of you own.

What I find as a member of this site is that some people are very smart in some areas but blind in others. More so with those that are knowledgable technicaly but weak at business.

The bits on your course I would be interested in would be.
Not leaving spots on windows
dealing with complaints
Not pushing people to longer freqeuncys

Others would need other bits (like marketing). One of the problems is once people have made their mind up that they have the best and only approach they are very difficult to shift.

[KarlJones]

OK Rain Water, lets work on this...

It's very important for me to get work in the areas I work. I would like to be the main or dominant window cleaner, but I am far from that at the moment.

Understand at the moment you have no franchise, if you did then I would not be able to do the same job as you do for less money and still make a profit.  Basically you would have something that stopped me taking your customers from you if I went in at a cheaper rate.

Now, you have to create a franchise for yourself.  If you want to be the dominant window cleaner then you have to advertise more, provide more references, join the feds and boast about how big your insurance is.  Basically trying to create a business that is harder to replicate.  If you can find any angle that makes you different from the competition (time keeping? online payments? yellow pages? criminal records check?) then push it for all it is worth.   But understand that all of that is useless on its own unless you push it, ram it down peoples throats and basically advertise yourself as much as possible.  Advertising itself works on a sort of multiplier, you advertise and advertise some more and some more.  It is better to spend little and often on advertising than it is to spend lots on a one off campaign.  Canvass regular, leaflet regular (making sure you have all the "edge" stuff on it) and make sure that you are constantly on peoples minds when it comes to window cleaning in the areas you want.

out-dominate the dominator.

[Clive McDonald]

Thats basicaly it yes. That's what i do, although i'm a bit insidious and start slow.

We disagree on the word franchise and it's meaning. Some of what you saY i call low barrier to entry.

[Londoner]

What you say is very true Karl but it doesn't address the basic misconception that franchises are peddling.
We are all individuals and we all have strengths and weaknesses. By and large you can't change that.You can work on the weaknesses but you will never make a silk purse out of a sows ear.
No amount of training is going to make me an olympic runner or sing like Pavorotti.

To be able to start the sort of business that these franchises are suggesting its possible to run is just out of the question for a person with no experience.They seem to be suggesting that you don't have to get your own hands wet you are just the manager and your crew of blokes do all the work. Ha!

You crew of blokes will be running riot, doing jobs on the side for cash, skipping off to go to the cafe or the betting shop, going home early etc etc.

To run a crew of blokes you have got to be better than them and one jump ahead all the time. Handing over a bundle of money and having flash headed notepaper won't turn you into that person.

Its not about better ways to advert or get you image across. We could all benefit from that I'm sure. There is a definite need there that could be served by training courses. The carpet cleaning industry runs such courses for about £100 a day, why don't we?

But that is still a whole quantum leap away from what these franchise companies would have you believe is possible if you go with them.  

[Ian_Giles]

Well I've found that the single best form of advertising is to get your van smartly signed, it's brought in no end of work for me, ok, I'm an established window cleaner of over 23 years, but at one point I'd run my business down to the point where I only had about two and a half days worth of work per week.

Along came WFP into my eager hands and I'd re-discovered me enthusiasm for the job, suddenly I needed an awful lot more work.

It slowly trickled in, I didn't bother canvassing in any shape or form, I merely followed up on people asking for quotes...wasn't bothered if I had to drive a few miles between accounts...
got the van and got it signed (£250) The rate at which work came in - and is still coming in- really increased, so much so I'm now full to the gills to be honest.

I get people come up to me in the van while I'm sat in Tesco's car park, I've had one person follow me home to ask for my services, the other day I had a phone call from a woman cos my van was parked outside her flat while i toddled off to do some shopping in the town.

Smart signing makes you appear professional, as does a uniform with your logo and so on embroidered on.
It makes you visible, it helps you to stand out from the crowd.

It works.

Window cleaning isn't a get rich quick job, it takes time to build up your round, years in fact, and it takes effort....

Leafleting, knocking doors, yellow pages, local pages, parish magazines, anywhere in fact you can get your name is good.
Depending on the depth of your pocket of course!

Loads may start up in window cleaning because of the potential lure of earning good money, but as many find out, you can't wave a magic wand and hey presto! Go out and earn £200 a day....
Ian

[Alex Gardiner]

Davew,

One of the best ways to build new custom is to get a job in a local village that is right on the main street, perhaps a house next to the Post Office or local shop. If people see you doing this job on a regular basis they will ask you to do theirs. Perhaps choose a suitable house and offer them a very cheap deal (free or £1 and explain why you are doing it )for a once a week clean, make sure you do it when every one is in the village, perhaps about 10.00 in the morning.

We have been running a WC business in our area for 26 years and we have a handful of shops and cottages in the middle of a prosperous sea-side village. During the season we have nearly one new client a week come up to us and ask if we could fit them in. One lady said that she had seen us doing the estate agents for the last 5 years and had been meaning to ask us all that time!

Remember the best work comes to you not the other way around.

[macmac]

Another thing to remember dave, is that, depending on the kind of areas that you work in, a new "flashy" sign written van with "fancy" wfp system in the back could actualy work against you. Never underestimate the mentality of many people who would dread the thought that their window cleaner earns more than them & would rather give their money to the cheaper, poorer-looking w/c. It's the social status thing, i have nearly all great customers, many of them are like friends, BUT, i would never in a million years let them know my earnings & how much free time i get.
For this reason i'm more than happy to let them think i'm working 40 hours a week to make ends meet, ( & even encourage this thought sometimes ).

The BMW owners without 2 pennies to rub together are the worst for this kind of thinking. ( ten-bob millionaires)

tony

[Davew]

All good tips thanks guys I'll take them on board. Good point there too Tony, when you hear people are timing their cleaner it's pretty obvious what they think. I've also had a couple of people comment on my van, not realising the money to pay for it never came from windowcleaning. One thing this trade does is open your eyes to all walks of life and makes you realise how materialistic and shallow some people are like the ones who have asked me to clean then by the time the third clean comes round they have no money and can't afford it any longer - usually the man of the house with the exec. car on the drive. It also introduces you to the minority of decent people (although not many).

[dai]

Dave, I built my round up very quickly, In fact 6 months after I started I had to take a guy on. I soon found that this wasn't working for me, I sold a big chunk of work off, and went back on my own.
I started off looking for new build estates, I didn't care if I had to travel 20 miles to one. That really paid off for me. If they have a show house offer to do it for free, providing they agree to inform you when new people are moving in.
I did most of my canvassing on Saturday and Sundays. If people haven't got a cleaner, it's a job they have to do themselves on a weekend, and  it's not a job most people like doing. If you give them a knock on a Saturday morning, odds on you'll get the job.
You have to canvass at a time when most people are at home, that's a simple but true fact.
If asked to quote I would give them a price, and tell them that the first clean was on me. {new estates only} This really got me loads of work.
If you go for new estates be careful when pricing. The houses are dead easy to do when you have totally unrestricted access, they can take a lot longer when they start erecting big fences and gates.
Canvassing gives much better results than leafleting, It give you a chance to sell yourself. Stick at it mate, you'll get there. Dai

[macmac]

Another point dave is that in this game we all have ups & downs, sounds like you're on a bit of a down at the mo' but rest assured it will pick up mate. It's just a case of taking the rough with the smooth. I'm on an up at the mo' with good quality work rolling in steadily but then again up till recently didn't have much new stuff coming in at all.
As for creating new work, what has worked best for me is good, well thought out & presented leaflets, but to add to that, it can sometimes take months for some response from them. They'll call when THEY are ready.

A tip for you which has worked great for me in the past & have had loads of possitive comments on from customers is to write this at the very bottom of your leaflet.-

Please note:-
This is an honest approach for new business & in no way an attempt to take work from any other window cleaner. I am not in the business of under-cutting any other window cleaner.
                                          Thank You

This statement speaks volumes about your integrity & lets them know that you are genuine & honest. It also acts as a deffence should any other window cleaner accuse you of poaching.

tony

[matt]

Another thing to remember dave, is that, depending on the kind of areas that you work in, a new "flashy" sign written van with "fancy" wfp system in the back could actualy work against you. Never underestimate the mentality of many people who would dread the thought that their window cleaner earns more than them & would rather give their money to the cheaper, poorer-looking w/c. It's the social status thing, i have nearly all great customers, many of them are like friends, BUT, i would never in a million years let them know my earnings & how much free time i get.
For this reason i'm more than happy to let them think i'm working 40 hours a week to make ends meet, ( & even encourage this thought sometimes ).

The BMW owners without 2 pennies to rub together are the worst for this kind of thinking. ( ten-bob millionaires)

tony

thats a valid point

i picked up 2 jobs near my " area", the reason they stopped the current WC'er, he had a new van and a system that he was bragging cost him 14 K

i dont get it to be honest, people still like to think of the WC'er as a working class struggling to make ends meet

on the flip side, when i told people i had been to orlando in fed, i had a few say " if you can afford that holiday, we might not need you anymore "

[Clive McDonald]

Alex, twenty six years ago what on earth made you pick window cleaning as a profession? It can't have been through choice.

Some good points matt. I like to brag about my van because I am very proud of it. It has just had it's first MOT and it's immaculate 16,000 miles. Scudo.
The sign writing on it is brilliant and achieves impact. But it is not flashy in any way, it is workmanlike.
(it's also brilliant inside)
To me that kind of bragging is harmless, and hopefully people can see that I'm proud of what I do etc.

I haven't got an ionics system, but if i did, my word the whole world would know about it.

You have mentioned your hols and again if that is bragging it's harmless. The one that impressed me that you managed to slip in the other day when talking about future plans was that you might be do another degree.