[chrisrobson45]

hi all

Please can you tell me if the prochem cleaning machine is a good machine.

it is model no. 2100PX-P, with a 4.8 bar 1 vac motor with a single jet wand it has only been used a handful of times what price do you think sounds ok,
and is it a good start out machine.

[Charlie Payne]

chris, hello! the machine you mentioned is quite adequate,but, if it were me, i'd personally go for something with a bit more power ie twin vac, 40 to 50 ltrs waste/solution, 135psi or above & a wand that has 2 or 3 jets. this is my own personal opinion, other cc on this forum would prob tell you different. regards char

[chrisrobson45]

Thanks Char,

Yea think am gonna save up a bit more and buy the new Prochem with 135 psi and twin jet wand with the twin vac motor, think its called the Promax. What you think?

Thanks for your opinion much appreciated.

Cheers Chris.

[Charlie Payne]

yer that sounds alot better, you don't want to get a machine thats a bit down on power & not to be happy about its performance. its best to go that extra yard than throw your money at something you would regret. char.              try this site; www.alltec.co.uk/ they have some good mid- range machines. 

[lands]

Hi Chris, the machine you mentioned is the steempro powermax. If you buy new shop around as you can buy it from Express for example a bit cheaper than direct (believe it or not) as Charlie says its just an opnion but I would advise you could keep an eye on the buy sell section here or ebay as you can pick up something of that spec for half the price. Agree you should have at least 100psi (135 is plenty) and definitely have min. 2 jet wand.

Pete

[Liahona]

Pete, why would you suggest at least a twin jet wand?  For truck mounts the difference between 1 or however many jets isnt that noticable.  But for a portable why would you want to limit what is already a minimal pressure and VOLUME anyway.  A single jet for a portable and any machine is always more productive.  If we as cleaners are looking for more psi and volume then more than one jet isnt the best way of obtaining this.

I am not saying that twins or more dont work as clearly they do.  Just saying that a single is better.

Best, Dave.

[lands]

Hi Dave

I'm just basing that on the PSI against the amount of jets. I use a 3 jet wand and find that when the psi goes above 150 it leaves lines in most wool carpet so I would have thought a single jet channeling all that pressure would make that worse.

Please enlighten me if my thinking is not correct but this what I have found since I bought a ninja that goes up to 400psi.

Cheers
Pete

[carpetguy]

Surely you're not using the full 400 on your domestic work. It's handy to have the power, but I rarely used more than 200 in domestics, only using 400 for really heavy work.

[lands]

No of course not like I said I don't go above 150 on domestic. The point I was trying to clarify is whether having a single jet wand would lleave lines in carpets if one jet was dispensing all that pressure rather than sharing it across 2 or 3. What do you think?

Pete

[Liahona]

Pete, I would imagine you are leaving lines because of the amount of jets you are using.  Even brand new there will always be a difference between the 3 of them.  If you are using only one then you will not get the lines you are referring too as it is an impossability to have a line in a good working single jet.

If you are using three jets unless they are absolutely perfect which they wont be then you are putting more water down in at least two areas of the wand stroke.  While this may not cause lines it is not best for the carpet you are cleaning.

Also, Rob, whats wrong with using 400 psi.  The cfr you speak so highly of I think is 500 psi and I think you have said they make a 1000 psi machine.  Not that there is a problem with that as carpets should be cleaned at a higher pressure.  Certainly higher than 150.

I believe it is from Shaws but not 100% certain but it is usually regarded that around 450 psi is the best to clean a carpet.

For this you of course have to have a good recovery but nevertheless nothing wrong with high psi cleaning.

Having said all this most porties dont have the volume to do any damage to a carpet even if they are so say producing 400 psi.

Pete, give me a bell if I havent explained this very well.

P.S. I know some carpets dont need or want high pressure but the above I refered too was for most "normal" carpets. 

I clean silk wall to wall carpets as well as linen and paper carpets.  These I hasten to add I dont use too high a pressure.  But again, volume is the key as much as psi.

Believe me a 400 psi ninja is not producing the same cleaning ability as any truck mount at 400 psi.  I know thats another story but putting it into perspective.

[lands]

I understand Dave.

I'll take a look to see if they are a bit clogged then. I thought it was high psi causing this which is why I turned it down. Does this sound feasible? Any other possible causes? I bought the whole kit 2nd hand so if wand is knackered I'll just get a new one.

Thanks
Pete

[Liahona]

The only reason really is that there are 3 jets.  I would just change them as opposed to see if they are clogged.  They are only pennies to get new ones.

 If you do go to buy a new wand then I would suggest a single fan jet wand.  After all they are the best for upholstery so why wouldnt they be best for carpets too. 

Best, Dave.

[lands]

Makes sense. Cheers Dave

[carpetguy]

I don't and never have been a T/M user, but I have as you say, used a C F R with variable pressure, up to 400 psi.

As mentioned, there were very few occasions, when I found it necessary, to exceed 200 psi and I believe that to be the case with at least some T/M users.

Perhaps it's to do with the prespray / aggitation regime followed by the many, who are happy to use portables, for whatever reason.

What a carpet manufacturer says about cleaning may not be "best advice" and should not be followed blindly....................they change their minds !

A colleague of mine startled the main supplier of commercial carpeting recently, by achieving a better result than he'd ever seen, on a trial clean, in a hospital, where H/W/E had been the stipulated method previously.

Now this man had seen many users of H/W/E and was happy to recommend the other system, which was a bonnet mopping system.

Pete...............Experiment, before assuming your wand is knackered, worn or damaged jets don't ammount to a replacement wand !!!!!!!!!!!

[Mike Halliday]

Dave, you normally talk a lot of sense, but today is an exception

a hand tool is normaly 4inch hence it only needs one jet a floor wand is 12inch so needs 3 jets.

 jets cost £s not pennies, I'd take them out and soak them in acid over night to give them a good clean, when you fit them back make sure they are slightly misaligned so the spray does'nt hit each other. Then fire it onto a dirty peice of concrete for 30-40seconds and look at the clean line to see if you have a uniformed spray pattern.

a single jet wand has a 11006 jet which (is commonly believed) mounted quite high up the wand so the spray reaches the full 12inches, which allows a lot of heat loss, a 3 jet wand has the jet alot closer to the carpet so usually hold the heat better .

Mike

[Liahona]

Mike, I was refering to a single fan jet wand where the jet is internally mounted.  This way there is no overspray at all and as no solution is outside of the wand it retains more heat than any other type of wand.  I think but I am not sure that the jets on the wand I use has the closest strike to the carpet than any other wand...... but again I am not sure about this.   The jets you refer to and therefore wand I agree with what you are saying.

  My mistake I should have mentioned the wand I use too.  Most know the wand I use but maybe Pete didnt.

  The single jets mounted so high up the wand as you have talked about I thought they were a thing of the past and didnt know you could still get them.

I am trying to find the technical info on the jets I use and if I find them I will put on a P.S. 

Hey and Mike, I always make sense, well in my own mind anyway.

Best, Dave.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Dave is yours like a internal jet PMF upholstery tool? don't Stanley Steamers use something like?

Shaun

PS when are you going to do some teaching here in the UK? I bet we all could do with your 'real world' education.

[Liahona]

Shaun, funny you should say that as most people think I live in my own world.

Ok, I do but then oh well, each to their own.

As to the jets.  You may well be right as the code on the jet is:

S.S. CO.  V8 K 3

Maybe the S.S. stands for Stanley Steamer I dont know.

As to price, I pay about $7 for them so although not pennies I was refering to how cheep thay are so its surely easier to have spare new ones as opposed to the hassle of cleaning them all the time.  Having said that in and I am guessing over 5,000 hours of use I have never had to clean out the fan jets that I use.

Mike, I dont work during the summer so I can send you my spare wand if you wanted to try it out.  Once used I am sure you would like it and see my point of view.

Best, Dave.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Dave I was refering to your wand, is it an internal jetted wand? what is the benefit (as I'm very interested) I'd have thought that you will keep the humidity of the room down which should assist in very quick drying!?!

When I have cleaned carpet with my internal jet PMF up tool the carpet comes up brilliantly is drier and fluffier, and regards Stanley Steamers I read somewhere (probably ICS BB) that they use this kind of wand.

Where did you get yours?

Shaun

[Liahona]

Shaun and anyone else who is listening.  I phoned up a mate of mine that is a Stanley Steamer Carpet Cleaner franchise back in California who runs a very profitable carpet cleaning business in Beverly Hills. 

Yes the wands they use are or have internal jets.  Very similar to the one I use.  Mine is from Steamway by the way, as are all the machines and tools I use, well almost all.

With shielded internally jetted wands you get very little unwanted moisture "flying" into the ambient air and so accordingly, yes there will be considerally less humidity.  Obviously with the vac hose connected you could just apply the triger to the solution, keep it fully open and you will recover 80 to 90% of fugitive solution maybe more.  I mean when pulling the wand backwards at the same time.   What goes into the textile will of course have to dry in the normal course of drying but I am sure you get what I mean.

I know Mike thinks I am wrong with this but I assure you I am always right.

Well again, at least in my own mind and thats all that counts.

Anyway, who would want to hear me talk about all this stuff?

I drive people to profanity as it is with what I say on here.  Maybe cos I am right, it drives 'em nuts.  Go on you have to laugh, best, Dave.