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Jonny jones

  • Posts: 387
help!!!!!
« on: June 07, 2007, 05:08:54 pm »
can anybody help, ive just won a job for a builders clean.
ive recieved a lot of paper work:
list :
contractors   Questionaire
contractors payment information
sub contractors safety assessment questionaire
and in the letter they want risk assessments and method statements
can anybody help me im stuck this is my first job,  i thought id lost the contract because i priced it 1 mnth ago
what do i write on the forms HELP

thanx jonny

let castle take the hassle  ( if he can write on the forms )

martin19842

  • Posts: 1945
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2007, 07:20:43 pm »
hi there

are your guys cscs card holders, cause if its a larger developer they should be insisting on cscs cards.

u need to complete all of the paperwrk.
usually they would have requested this information at the pricing stage, to ensure that you were upto scratch.

you need to make your risk assessments and method statements site specific. you will also be invited to a pre start meeting at the site.

regards

martin


Jonny jones

  • Posts: 387
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2007, 10:21:47 pm »
no we dont have cscs cards are they essential or will they overlook it and tell them that we have applied for them because the staff i will be using are one off staff and i dont want to fork out too much before i start.
and ive checked the cscs website and it doesnt have a specific cleaning industry for builders cleans

Jonny jones

  • Posts: 387
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2007, 11:43:55 pm »
forgot to ask is it ok for me to copy somebody elses risk assessment forms, 

Robert Parry

  • Posts: 535
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2007, 02:53:42 am »
Here we go again, you say your going to use staff on a one off basis, if more than five of them you actually need by law, a wrtitten Health & Safety Policy, NOT JUST A WRITTEN HEALTH & SAFETY POLICY STATEMENT.

Or, of course, you could subcontract the labour, thereby making themselves responsible, for Health & Safety, but not quite sure how the building contractor would react about that ;D

Martin, is quite correct, the builder should have made sure that you supplied him with the relevant documents etc, before awarding you the contract, but he probably picked you on price, no real surprise there! But, and heres the thing, he, and you have a legal duty, to show due care, it is the law! You or he, do not have the right to ignore this. legally, or in my opinion, morally.

If anything were to happen, and let me tell you that building sites, by their very nature, are very dangerous places, your insurance company probably wouldnt cover you, why, because you have broken your contract with them, you have wilfully, ignored the law, the law has and still is going through many changes, the penaltlies are getting stiffer, it is only 3 or 4 years away, before we see the first conviction for corporate manslaughter in this country, and it is also very very easy to sue under both employment and Health & Safety legislation.

Martin, again is quite correct, your H & S documents, should be site specific, indeed, if anything were to go awry, this would actually help you, as you have tried to cover all the basis.

As for help, get down to your local H & S office, pronto, or at least go to the website, bone up on it quick, get the book, I think its called H & S in the constuction industry, get the leaflets, fill in the forms from the builder, probably lose a little money on the deal, if not actually cash, certainly profit, and get some real training and professional advice as soon as the job is done.

No one has the right to place their staff in harms way, and yet every single year, someones father/mother does not come home, this is a fact, and all because, someone, somewhere allowed it to happen on their watch they failed in their duty to train, protect and inform their staff, because they didnt know, or wouldnt pay, or failed to comply with the law.

You could be forgiven for thinking that i am putting you down, or trying to stop you from acheiving your dreams, i am not. But so may people start out in this game thinking, that its a poorly paid, low investment, easy business, it is far from easy, the industry suffers, because of this perception, which is held by both many so called contractors and indeed clients, until we all realise that we all have to follow the same rules, nothing will change, best of luck on this one Jonny, but please, get this one out of the way, and get trained or get someone in to do it for you, accidents will always happen, but i wouldnt want to face somones family when i pleaded ignorance or poverty as one of the reasons for their loved one not coming home or being injured.

The above, is not meant to offend or upset, it does not represent the views of CMCCS, the views expressed are entirely my own.

Regards,

Rob

A world of difference....

Fox

  • Posts: 824
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2007, 07:43:21 am »
Rob

What a brilliant post.  I think your post will help open the newbies eyes to the importance of H&S etc as too many people 'borrow' a statement and think it is enough.  A risk assessment doesn't have to be long and daunting, just accurate for that particular site and as you say it could save a life.

Jonny

I am surprised you quoted for a job which you are obviously not set up to do, or did you not realise the amount and type of paperwork that would be required?  You need to go back to site to do a risk assessment alot can change on a building site in a month and compile your method statements from the up to date risk assessment.  How much time have you got before you start the job?

Fox

gmcs

  • Posts: 174
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2007, 10:08:05 am »
I think if you look at the CSCS site again you will find that the white card is what you and your staff will need

Kevin White

  • Posts: 97
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2007, 03:05:29 pm »
Jonni !

Don't be too daunted by the above, everyone on this site has done something for the first time before.

Get yourself CIS registered.

The rest although important is only paperwork and common sense at the end of the day.

i don't imagine you actually wanted to copy a risk assessment word for word, more like get an idea of what they contain.

You have e-mail

Regards
Kevin

PS when you are up there with initial you can help yourself, until then keep using the forum.
BE A WINNER
coming 2nd means you were 1st to LOSE

Jonny jones

  • Posts: 387
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2007, 05:55:08 pm »
thanx kev encouragement at last, ;D.

yes guys i did price the job and until yesterday i wasnt worried about forms because i didnt think i would get the job.

 but listen. i have been doing industrial cleaning for the past eight years. and floor care for 11 years. and yes this is a new ball game for me i have never been my own boss. so i will learn and people will teach me new  stuff. every chemical i have has coshh sheets and i have the risk assessments now, all of my insurances are top notch. 

so all of that said thanx for your support and any advice given is duly noted

thanx jonny

let castle take the hassle

myvanwi

Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2008, 08:01:30 pm »
thanx kev encouragement at last, ;D.

yes guys i did price the job and until yesterday i wasnt worried about forms because i didnt think i would get the job.

 but listen. i have been doing industrial cleaning for the past eight years. and floor care for 11 years. and yes this is a new ball game for me i have never been my own boss. so i will learn and people will teach me new  stuff. every chemical i have has coshh sheets and i have the risk assessments now, all of my insurances are top notch. 

so all of that said thanx for your support and any advice given is duly noted



thanx jonny

let castle take the hassle

How did you get on with your builders clean? We are going to be approaching the builders soon and want to get everything in order before we quote. How did you get the job in the first place and what paperwork and registrations did you need in the end?

Jonny jones

  • Posts: 387
Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2008, 12:03:06 am »
hi i did the clean, bit of a pain really,   i priced for ten days continious on site cleaning,  but when we got there most of the work wasnt done so had to do first half of building first, then when it came to the end of that part i was ready to pull out and wait for the second half to finish,   the site agent wanted me to leave two guys on there cleaning as they went along,  anyway we landed being there for a total of 4weeks, couldnt ask for anymore money because forgot to write it in the quote,  but still made a few quid, and it was ok for my first one,,

they called me for the work,  and you should be sending a lot of health and safety stuff and insurance stuff to them,  and try not to under price yourself,
just quoted for another clean, and ive made sure there are provisions there for hickups..

good luck,

thanx jonny

myvanwi

Re: help!!!!!
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2008, 05:53:50 pm »
I think they can smell a novice a mile off and so they take advantage. They must know how long it would take but they let you quote wrong so they can save the company money and look good to their bosses. There is alot of competion for these cleans too. But you have to be in it to win it. Good Luck. Hope your next job more lucrative.