[lippy]

Have the toys been thrown out of the pram

[windows_chepstow]

Have the toys been thrown out of the pram

I think so.

M'lud, I rest my case. 

The 'jury' can decide whether Squeaky is correct and that water fed poles; and the work I do with them is rubbish; or not.

I've nowt else to say on the matter; at present. 

But I would love Squeaky to take Ian_Giles up on his offer of a race.  I'd turn up to judge; take some photos and maybe submit an article to PWC mag.

Come on Squeaky, put your money where your mouth is... take Ian up on his offer!

I'm sure we'd all be interested in the outcome.

[Sir Squeaky]

What on a house I've never done before that he knows he's quick on, with small opening conservatory windows?

It takes half a dozen cleans before you work out the best order and technique to do them in.

I picked up some houses 4 months ago that took me about 4 hours to do.
By the 4th month I'm doing 2 extra houses and finishing them in under 3 hours....

You can't expect to compete on a strange property.
Same as I could pick one of mine he couldn't compete with either, as he wouldn't know the best way.

It just wouldn't be fair either way, so forget it.
I'm happy with my work and speed and that's it.

[brett walker]

Over the past few months Gaza has had a lot of work off me, one i did trad he changed it over to wfp not likeing it but they did not give it a chance.  A couple of other customers said Brett used to do this,  Brett used to do that

Sometimes customers will play you off against each other to get extra bits done or a cheaper price etc

But ive told Gaza im a hard act to follow 

Brett

[lippy]

ive been cleaning for 21 years a window is a window, if there is no obsticles in the way there should be no probs.Go on give it a go

[windows_chepstow]

ive been cleaning for 21 years a window is a window, if there is no obsticles in the way there should be no probs.Go on give it a go

I agree mate.  It's a bungalow too that Ian has in mind, so no need to learn the best place to put your ladders.  Pure squeegie work.

I met up with Ian_Giles this week for a beer, and he was serious about this challenge.

[Sir Squeaky]

Rubbish, I proved in my last post that it makes a difference.

Might not to mere mortals like yourselves though....

[windows_chepstow]

Rubbish, I proved in my last post that it makes a difference.

Might not to mere mortals like yourselves though....

But, Squeaky, you posted:

Squeaky quote:

You won't do bungalows quicker with wfp, unless your really slow by hand.

So go on, take Ian_Giles up on his offer.

I think many of us here would be interested in the results. 

[Ian_Giles]

I choose this account because for trad work it is very straight forward, a low level bungalow, it does have a fair few windows, but as you may have seen in the one pic I put on the other thread, they are all 2 pane windows.

You can walk around the bungalow and work out how you wish to approach it, the windows are all clean of course, and so are the frames, so it is a really straight forward clean for you.

And it isn't just about speed Rog, I'm also saying that it will dry out to a first rate finish that you will struggle to find mistakes on.

That bit is important  as you are continually saying that WFP doesn't do as good a job as trad, and I want to show you that it does.

Pick a straight forward house that you do, not one with oxidised paint, but a straight forward one.
Can be a standard semi if you like, how about one of the ones up near your mum & dads place?
I could even do their place if you like?

I'm happy to do one of yours that I've never done before.

Ian

[windows_chepstow]

Could I take photos and do a write up for PWC mag?

I think it would make an interesting topic!

[Ian_Giles]

Hey, good idea Tosh,

It could show what if any difference there is between the two methods, and on something like a bungalow too, something most would say is pointless to do with WFP, lets face it, hardly any safety issues as you would not need to use a ladder on any of the windows, probably more awkward for the WFP'er due to the plant pots and the amount of hose that needs to be uncoiled to do it.

Both cleans could be scrutinised carefully and compared.

I'm prepared to stand up and be counted...are you Rog??

Ian

[Sir Squeaky]

What and never be able to show my face on here again if I lose?

Not likely!

Ah, I'll think about it. But not when we're already on a 4 day week with the bank holiday.

[Paul Coleman]

What and never be able to show my face on here again if I lose?

Not likely!

Ah, I'll think about it. But not when we're already on a 4 day week with the bank holiday.

Well if you two decide to go ahead with this, please keep it to bungalows eh?  The last thing anyone wants is someone to fall off a ladder due to racing.

[jeff1]

Very good point from the shiner,

keep to bungalows, and don't do it for a race, do it for a magazine, or something like Tosh has suggested like the PWC mag

[gaza]

Brett:was told by one of  your customers that you  cleaned all of the frame ? the hell you do, they think I  was born yesterday.YES BRETT your a hard act to follow but having only lost one
 customer in all that work Ive bought off you [and gaining 4 new customers on a round youve done for years its time you came to daddy      

I will meet up with stummpy[the tree fellow] sometime ,and ask him why not ave the guts to tell me to my face instead of just a text message and he calls himself a buissman?might just send him on a false job by text of someone elses phone
Anyway been out today cleaning [Sunday]and picked up 2x£8.00p jobs to replace him [am I bothered]
Another complaint was I didnt clean the sills  on 1 window [if you want to clamber through 2/3 ft of waist high prickly scrubs when its been pouring with rain your welcome to it shes leaving when she sold her house the new customer will be paying £1.50p more.

gaza

[Ian_Giles]

Actually, I wouldn't be racing, for me the speed thing is about the pace you can work at comfortably all day long.
Ok, in a competition I wouldn't be chatting to the customer or pausing to see if I'm right, and the helicopter I can hear but not see is a chinook (spelling) or not

With trad you can really go for it, you really can treat it as a race, you only have to watch Turbo Terry in action to see just how fast you can go in a speed competition.

It isn't so easy to race with WFP, not if you want to be sure you have done a decent job, and in this case (should Squeaks have the balls to take me up on it that is) we will wait to check out the results.

Squeaks has stated on the forum that you'd have to be a really slow trad window cleaner to be slower than WFP on something as easy as a bungalow.
And on this bungalow all the windows are low enough that you don't need a pointer ladder (I would struggle cos I'm a short arse).
So all Sqeaks has to do is take out his bucket (he will not manage it without a second dip of the applicator in his main bucket of water, don't think his BOAB will hold enough for him to get around without doing so) walk up the garden path and start cleaning.
I on the other hand need to draw out almost the entire 50m of my hose.

You could not get a more straight forward clean for a trad, and I don't expect him to wash the frames either (though they have to be properly detailed where required and the sills wiped down) I will wash all the frames because for me that is part of the job.

Roger can walk around the account and spend as much time as he likes assessing exactly how he wishes to approach the job.
Roger will then get back into his car and the stop watch will be started from the moment he gets out of the car, and will be stopped when he has finished the job , packed his gear away and sat back in his car.

The same will apply to me.

My claim will be that he will not be faster than me (and I readily admit that Squeaks is a very fast window cleaner) and he will be hard pressed to find any spots after my work has dried out.
Squeaks is always claiming that WFP leaves spots and does not do as good a job as Trad.
Lets see if he is right, he will be the one to check out my results.

2 pics of the bungalow in question below...

[Sir Squeaky]

Ian, are those Upvc's on that conservatory the square edged ones with the inset rubber?

If so, forget it.
They're a nightmare to squeegee, particularly the opening lights.

It just gets caught in the edges.
Aaarrrgggghhhh!!!!!!

I won't take on houses with that type.
Kind of upsets customers, but not as much as they upset me.

[Moderator David@stives]

     whats a square edged window got to do with it, I can do them twice
as fast as the sloping rubber type.

Dave

[brett walker]

Brett:was told by one of  your customers that you  cleaned all of the frame ? the hell you do, they think I  was born yesterday.YES BRETT your a hard act to follow but having only lost one
 customer in all that work Ive bought off you [and gaining 4 new customers on a round youve done for years its time you came to daddy      

I will meet up with stummpy[the tree fellow] sometime ,and ask him why not ave the guts to tell me to my face instead of just a text message and he calls himself a buissman?might just send him on a false job by text of someone elses phone
Anyway been out today cleaning [Sunday]and picked up 2x£8.00p jobs to replace him [am I bothered]
Another complaint was I didnt clean the sills  on 1 window [if you want to clamber through 2/3 ft of waist high prickly scrubs when its been pouring with rain your welcome to it shes leaving when she sold her house the new customer will be paying £1.50p more.

gaza

Gaza

The job you are refering to , no i did not wipe the frames as it was trad but i always wipe the sills i have been told you are not doing this!  Its something i do religously so get born today and wipe them or you will loose more.  

The customer who sent you the text was not happy with the wfp job you did on his house and watched you on another house and was indeed equally unhappy on what he saw you do, which i have already explained !  You should have gone to see him as soon as he cancelled to put things right because he is a nice guy, sending him false jobs is very unprofessional.
For business word of mouth is very important in that area

You also had a cancellation from Mrs Andrews because of a scratch on her conservatory window
What i am trying to say is when somebody cancels do not take the attitude  F**k them as you do, like you say i have been doing them years and i know them well, any really awkward customers i would have already got rid of.  You have come from an area cleaning windows that is rough to work that is business people doctors solicitors etc.  So you will have to learn to work and behave in a professional manner

As for the lady with the prickly shrubs, she needs to be telling the new owner that you do a good job and wipe the sills then maybe you will get your 1.50 extra !

word of mouth and quality of work IS everything in this business

Brett.

[Ian_Giles]

You are wriggling like a stuck pig Squeaks, the windows are all straight forward cleans for trad.
The brown UPVC ones are all easy sloping edges, as are the white conseratory ones.
No oxidization on any of the seals.

The work is straight forward for WFP and straight forward for Trad. and you will be quicker unloading your kit and putting it back in your car than me.

what more do you want?

Maybe a house full of oxidized sash windows?

I have chosen a bungalow so there is no ladder work.
On each window unit, the biggest still only has 2 panes of glass, how much more of an advantage do you want?

I'm not even expecting you to wash the frames down, and as I will be going after you, I'll have to spend longer than normal because of the soap suds in your water, which also means that if I don't get it right and get rid of all soap residue it will show up when the glass dries out.

This isn't just about speed remember, it is also to show that WFP does as good a job as trad.

Detailing always adds time to the job if you are trad, but the fact is, that DETAILING IS a part of the job.
If you are skilful the amount of detailing you do will be reduced, or are you saying that the only reason you are so quick is that you cut corners and do a ropey job?

If the job isn't scrutinised and you could do the job without detailing you may well do it as quickly as I can do it WFP, but this is about the quality of the finish too....not an easy challenge for you is it?

And don't forget, if you would rather I clean your parents house (or Em's) I'll be happy to substitute one of those for the bungalow.

Ian