[Spruce]

You have 3 months to register a business when you first start with the tax man Don.

I thought you had up to 6 months after the end of the first tax year to register?

Sorry, my mistake;

The receiver says.
https://www.gov.uk/set-up-sole-trader/register

Register as soon as you can after starting your business. At the latest, you should register by 5 October in your business’s second tax year.

Example

If you start working as a sole trader between April 2014 to March 2015, you should register before 5 October 2015.

If you register later than this, you won’t get a penalty as long as you send your Self Assessment tax return and pay your bill on time.

I was told I had 3 months to register unless things have changed since then. I had an appointment with the Receiver before I started and this is what I was told.

[SeanK]

Firstly if earning £60 to a £100 you wont need an accountant well unless you stink at maths, if you earn £100 then the most
you will pay is around £27 if you claim £20 a week in expenses then you will pay around the £20 mark.
This will depend if your already over the tax threshold on your full time job.
One piece of advice I will give you is if you sneak around like somebody that has something to hide then you will draw
attention to yourself.

[slap bash]

How many fireman, policeman and state workers do window or a second job part time and do they pay tax.  Not at all. Every fireman in my area do window part time and they have flashy car to prove their true income. On a firemans salary. NO. If they paid tax it would eat up all the extra income.

[Walter Mitty]

I cleaned windows the trad way for years without needing commercial insurance - so long as the insurance know that you are using your vehicle in connection with your business.  I used direct line whilst driving first a car, then car derived vans (Nissan Sunny followed by Ford Escorts).  They were happy for me to carry trad tools and latterly, a few containers, so long as I stayed within the weight limits.  When I switched to larger van+tank setup, that was when I had to getmore specialised insurance.  Direct Line lost my business as they didn't offer such cover at that time.
This was all some years ago and things may have changed.

Same with me. They used to cover me under the 'social, domestic, pleasure and getting to and from work' section.
However, I think this may have changed. Over the time I did it, which was some years ago, it became increasingly difficult to find an insurer who would cover me that way even when just carrying a ladder and bucket and a few hand tools. The last time I managed to do it was probably 10 years ago.
Not too long ago I heard of a case where a chap was pulled over for a busted brake light. He happened to be helping a friend with a sandwich delivery service as his van had broken down. When the police noticed a tray of sandwiches on his back seat they queried it and when he told them what he was doing, the first thing they asked him was about his insurance. As he wasn't insured for business use they wouldn't let him continue his journey with them in the car. Sounds ridiculous I know, but it happened.

How annoying having to eat all those sarnies before continuing.  I hope he let the coppers have some

[Walter Mitty]

I cleaned windows the trad way for years without needing commercial insurance - so long as the insurance know that you are using your vehicle in connection with your business.  I used direct line whilst driving first a car, then car derived vans (Nissan Sunny followed by Ford Escorts).  They were happy for me to carry trad tools and latterly, a few containers, so long as I stayed within the weight limits.  When I switched to larger van+tank setup, that was when I had to getmore specialised insurance.  Direct Line lost my business as they didn't offer such cover at that time.
This was all some years ago and things may have changed.

Same with me. They used to cover me under the 'social, domestic, pleasure and getting to and from work' section.
However, I think this may have changed. Over the time I did it, which was some years ago, it became increasingly difficult to find an insurer who would cover me that way even when just carrying a ladder and bucket and a few hand tools. The last time I managed to do it was probably 10 years ago.
Not too long ago I heard of a case where a chap was pulled over for a busted brake light. He happened to be helping a friend with a sandwich delivery service as his van had broken down. When the police noticed a tray of sandwiches on his back seat they queried it and when he told them what he was doing, the first thing they asked him was about his insurance. As he wasn't insured for business use they wouldn't let him continue his journey with them in the car. Sounds ridiculous I know, but it happened.

10 years ago sounds about right.  That was when I first got a larger van with tank.

[Spruce]

I cleaned windows the trad way for years without needing commercial insurance - so long as the insurance know that you are using your vehicle in connection with your business.  I used direct line whilst driving first a car, then car derived vans (Nissan Sunny followed by Ford Escorts).  They were happy for me to carry trad tools and latterly, a few containers, so long as I stayed within the weight limits.  When I switched to larger van+tank setup, that was when I had to getmore specialised insurance.  Direct Line lost my business as they didn't offer such cover at that time.
This was all some years ago and things may have changed.

Same with me. They used to cover me under the 'social, domestic, pleasure and getting to and from work' section.
However, I think this may have changed. Over the time I did it, which was some years ago, it became increasingly difficult to find an insurer who would cover me that way even when just carrying a ladder and bucket and a few hand tools. The last time I managed to do it was probably 10 years ago.
Not too long ago I heard of a case where a chap was pulled over for a busted brake light. He happened to be helping a friend with a sandwich delivery service as his van had broken down. When the police noticed a tray of sandwiches on his back seat they queried it and when he told them what he was doing, the first thing they asked him was about his insurance. As he wasn't insured for business use they wouldn't let him continue his journey with them in the car. Sounds ridiculous I know, but it happened.

I occasional use my car for collecting and for that privilege I have to have business insurance on the car as well as the van.

[Walter Mitty]

I cleaned windows the trad way for years without needing commercial insurance - so long as the insurance know that you are using your vehicle in connection with your business.  I used direct line whilst driving first a car, then car derived vans (Nissan Sunny followed by Ford Escorts).  They were happy for me to carry trad tools and latterly, a few containers, so long as I stayed within the weight limits.  When I switched to larger van+tank setup, that was when I had to getmore specialised insurance.  Direct Line lost my business as they didn't offer such cover at that time.
This was all some years ago and things may have changed.

Same with me. They used to cover me under the 'social, domestic, pleasure and getting to and from work' section.
However, I think this may have changed. Over the time I did it, which was some years ago, it became increasingly difficult to find an insurer who would cover me that way even when just carrying a ladder and bucket and a few hand tools. The last time I managed to do it was probably 10 years ago.
Not too long ago I heard of a case where a chap was pulled over for a busted brake light. He happened to be helping a friend with a sandwich delivery service as his van had broken down. When the police noticed a tray of sandwiches on his back seat they queried it and when he told them what he was doing, the first thing they asked him was about his insurance. As he wasn't insured for business use they wouldn't let him continue his journey with them in the car. Sounds ridiculous I know, but it happened.

I occasional use my car for collecting and for that privilege I have to have business insurance on the car as well as the van.

It sounds to me as if the insurance regulations must have really tightened up over the years.

[CleanClear]

Wether you have Social/Domestic insurance or Business/Commercial insurance is a matter between YOU and your Insurance company. It could result in them trying to negate any claim by yourself. It is NOTHING to do with the Police. And will not prevent a Policy paying out a third party claimant. And the law requires you to have Insurance for Third partys. I hope thats of some help to the drama queens.

[duncan h]

I started out not declairing anything, thinking if I get caught I have 6 months anyway.
1 day I was doing a 3 story and my water stopped. I rested it on the gutter while I sorted it out.  The pole slipped. If it fell it would have smashed 4 car roofs.
I went home and got public liability and registered with tax man.
Not worth the risk

[SeanK]

Wether you have Social/Domestic insurance or Business/Commercial insurance is a matter between YOU and your Insurance company. It could result in them trying to negate any claim by yourself. It is NOTHING to do with the Police. And will not prevent a Policy paying out a third party claimant. And the law requires you to have Insurance for Third partys. I hope thats of some help to the drama queens.

Your insurance states what you are allowed to use the vehicle for, failure to keep to the terms stated renders your insurance
void so therefore your not insured.
That's when it becomes a matter for the police, my mate delivers for a Chinese take away and has been done and fined twice
for doing it without the proper cover.

[CleanClear]

Wether you have Social/Domestic insurance or Business/Commercial insurance is a matter between YOU and your Insurance company. It could result in them trying to negate any claim by yourself. It is NOTHING to do with the Police. And will not prevent a Policy paying out a third party claimant. And the law requires you to have Insurance for Third partys. I hope thats of some help to the drama queens.

You insurance states what you are allowed to use the vehicle for, failure to keep to the terms stated renders your insurance
void so therefore your not insured.
That's when it becomes a matter for the police, my mate delivers for a Chinese take away and has been done and fined twice
for doing it without the proper cover.

At the risk of being pedantic  , you cannot get done for not having the proper cover. The Police try to prosecute for no insurance. They ask ........"do you have business insurance"? To which someone will answer yes or no. If its no, they may try to prosecute for "no insurance". They will follow that through with the..."so you don't have business insurance , so you're not insured "?  routine. Sadly some drivers will say, "no i don't have it" and hang themselves. In actual fact all one has to do to  counter a charge of "no insurance" is appear in court with the policy. There is NO legal requirement to have business Insurance. The legal requirement is for a Insurance Policy to cover a mimimum of damage to third partys. Thats what your friend had.More fool him if he pleaded guilty to no insurance.
 Infact the law was changed to include such misrepresentations with Insurance Policies............
The Consumer Insurance (Disclosure and Representations) Act 2012.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/6/contents/enacted

If as you suggest its a clear case of .........not telling them means you're not insured.  Then we wouldn't of needed the above Act to stop Insurers trying to shirk their basic responsabilities. Never mind using the Police as their Policy enforcers. Like i said, they'll pay out and the driver does still have a Policy.
 Hope thats goes some way to helping you understand how it works.

[CleanClear]

I started out not declairing anything, thinking if I get caught I have 6 months anyway.
1 day I was doing a 3 story and my water stopped. I rested it on the gutter while I sorted it out.  The pole slipped. If it fell it would have smashed 4 car roofs.
I went home and got public liability and registered with tax man.
Not worth the risk

If that was me, i'd of tried to fathom out what made the Pole fall so i didn't repeat it. Sort of like a Risk Assesment. But you chose to register with the Taxman after a pole fall ? Thats interesting.

[Walter Mitty]

Thanks for the insurance explanation CleanClear.  I've learned something new today.
Can I get back on stage now?

[SeanK]

Thanks for the insurance explanation CleanClear.  I've learned something new today.
Can I get back on stage now?

You have learned nothing mate, ring the police or ask a solicitor, better still Google and read a few story's about people
being wrongly accused of using their vehicles for business by the police, you would think their solicitors would know about
this and get their cases dropped.

[CleanClear]

Thanks for the insurance explanation CleanClear.  I've learned something new today.
Can I get back on stage now?

You have learned nothing mate, ring the police or ask a solicitor, better still Google and read a few story's about people
being wrongly accused of using their vehicles for business by the police, you would think their solicitors would know about
this and get their cases dropped.

Solicitors do get the the cases dropped. Its a simple question Sean..........are you insured yes or no. Thats what the law requires. What type of isurance do you have ? Again, its spelt out in the Road Traffic Act..........minimum third party risks. Thats what you would have. If it was the case a Magistrates Court could decide that you had no insurance due to you nit declaring something we wouldn;t have the  The Consumer Insurance (Disclosure and Representations) Act 2012.
 The requirement is for Insurance for third party risks. Let that stick in your head. Thats what the law asks for. And thats what the Disclosure Act protects.
 Infact, if you're feeling cheeky when you're pulled up with SDP insurance and told you've got no insurance due to you using it commercially reverse into their car and see if they make a claim on your policy !!!
 If you've got third party risk insurance as the law requires then the rest of the contract is between YOU and your insurance. NOT for a copper to decide at the side of the road.
 And BTW, did your mate delivering meals get his car impounded? Or did he throw his meals on the floor thus validating his policy again imediatley and drive off fully insured?!!!! 

[SeanK]

Thanks for the insurance explanation CleanClear.  I've learned something new today.
Can I get back on stage now?

You have learned nothing mate, ring the police or ask a solicitor, better still Google and read a few story's about people
being wrongly accused of using their vehicles for business by the police, you would think their solicitors would know about
this and get their cases dropped.

Solicitors do get the the cases dropped. Its a simple question Sean..........are you insured yes or no. Thats what the law requires. What type of isurance do you have ? Again, its spelt out in the Road Traffic Act..........minimum third party risks. Thats what you would have. If it was the case a Magistrates Court could decide that you had no insurance due to you nit declaring something we wouldn;t have the  The Consumer Insurance (Disclosure and Representations) Act 2012.
 The requirement is for Insurance for third party risks. Let that stick in your head. Thats what the law asks for. And thats what the Disclosure Act protects.
 Infact, if you're feeling cheeky when you're pulled up with SDP insurance and told you've got no insurance due to you using it commercially reverse into their car and see if they make a claim on your policy !!!
 If you've got third party risk insurance as the law requires then the rest of the contract is between YOU and your insurance. NOT for a copper to decide at the side of the road.
 And BTW, did your mate delivering meals get his car impounded? Or did he throw his meals on the floor thus validating his policy again imediatley and drive off fully insured?!!!! 

Mate can you not see how silly your sounding, what your saying is the police are stopping and asking people to prove they have
insurance that's not needed and then prosecuting them for not having it.
You would think somebody would have highlighted this deliberate miscarriage of justice by now.

[CleanClear]

Mate can you not see how silly your sounding, what your saying is the police are stopping and asking people to prove they have
insurance that's not needed and then prosecuting them for not having it.
You would think somebody would have highlighted this deliberate miscarriage of justice by now.

Thats exactly what i'm saying. Its not silly at all. Its a FACT.

I have fitted some Alloys on my van (which does have commercial insurance BTW). If i was asked the same stupid question by a copper at the roadside.............nice alloys. Have you notified your insurance of them...............No.........oh, so you won;'t be covered then, is that right as its a modification............i suppose so? So you have no insurance then ?..................Oh please, do us a favour.
No one is highlighting this miscarriage of justice as they are probably doing it on the side for pin money and don't want to cause a fuss.
  Here's how it goes...........
Copper: Are you insured?
Driver: Yes, as your database will show.
Copper: what sort of insurance do you have?
Driver: Insurance to cover third party risks which is all you need to know. Bye.

or........

Copper: Do you have business/commercial insurance?
Driver: I have the insurance required by law officer, as your database will show. You can give me a producer and i'll bring a copy of my certificate in to show you. Is that all now officer i'd like to be on my way.

I can give you an example of the Police and Courts flouting the law and fining people and giving them points for other things if you like too?

Wake up. The legal  requirement is for third party cover. You have it once you're insured. The mere fact of carrying a pizza, curry or a ladder will not negate it. More fool you if you think it does.

[CleanClear]

 And BTW, did your mate delivering meals get his car impounded? Or did he throw his meals on the floor thus validating his policy again imediatley and drive off fully insured?!!!! 

Find this out for us Sean. I think it will be very interesting.

[SeanK]

 And BTW, did your mate delivering meals get his car impounded? Or did he throw his meals on the floor thus validating his policy again imediatley and drive off fully insured?!!!! 

Find this out for us Sean. I think it will be very interesting.

No he was approached while loading the car outside the take away, all the meals where in the boot in a  thermal container.
His car wasn't impounded but he wasn't allowed to deliver them.
It was the same the second time which ended up in court (very strange when he wasn't doing anything illegal ) he gave it up
after that as he was on the verge of loosing his licence and it wasn't worth his while paying for multi drop business insurance
as it was only a part time Saturday night job.
Just think if what you are saying was true he would certainly be entitled to compensation and the 6 points he got on his license revoked.
I certainly know that the police can make mistakes but blatant corruption you would nearly think this was China or similar.

[CleanClear]

No he was approached while loading the car outside the take away, all the meals where in the boot in a  thermal container.
His car wasn't impounded but he wasn't allowed to deliver them.
It was the same the second time which ended up in court (very strange when he wasn't doing anything illegal ) he gave it up
after that as he was on the verge of loosing his licence and it wasn't worth his while paying for multi drop business insurance
as it was only a part time Saturday night job.
Just think if what you are saying was true he would certainly be entitled to compensation and the 6 points he got on his license revoked.
I certainly know that the police can make mistakes but blatant corruption you would nearly think this was China or similar.

my mate delivers for a Chinese take away and has been done and fined twice
for doing it without the proper cover.

Was he done once or twice ? If the first time he hadn't drove and just loaded up with takeaways what did they do him for ? No insurance because he put meals in the back of his car but never drove ? Come on get it right !!! 

BTW i doubt he'd get compensation, but he could get his case re opened if information has conme to light which would reverse the descision made in court.......i.e he had an insurance policy. I'll guess he pled guilty