[City Cleaning Serv]

What are other cleaning companies doing to stop your own cleaning staff being poached by your own clients ?
Been in business now for 10 years without this happening . However this year alone we have had 3 occasions where we have lost a contract only to discover that the client has employed our cleaner ?
What can be done to stop this ?
We can have it written in to the contract but realistically  is this going to help stop this ?
Any advice from others would be appreciated.

[chrisham]

Just happened to us. Both our staff and client are in breach of contract. I am considering legal action. Have you taken it any further?

[Timmy Boy]

Hi
Don't you have any constraints in your contract with the client or within your employment contracts? If not get it in !
Regards
Tim

[chrisham]

Yes Tim, both!

I wondered if anyone had any success pursuing this or would it be a waste of time?

Cheers
Chris

[Timmy Boy]

Hi Chris
If its now a done deal, you are out and the cleaner is in, then send a letter to each one. When it happened to me (issued notice by client and he said that the cleaner was going direct), I rang the cleaner and said 'see you in court'. It freaked him out and he left the contract alone and the company rescinded the notice. He then re-approached the client 6 months later, client gave notice again and I contacted the ex-employee and told him he would be liable for TUPE. He had based his cost on doing it himself so, again he left with his tail between his legs!
Do you have a financial penalty in place on your contract or is it 'you must not solicit employees'. If its the latter, I would invoice 3 months of the contract value which is what a typical employment agency would do.
Some companies will pay it to get you off their back, some won't pay and some will want to compromise. By sending a nasty letter to both parties, one of the two will probably back out.
Regards
Tim

[chrisham]

Thanks Tim, the thing that really surprises me is the client is a doctors surgery and they tell me that after a financial review & careful consideration they have decided to bring the cleaning in house  How careful have they been???

I suspect  my staff and the practice manager have been conspiring for some time :-(

[chrisham]

Gutted!!
Just been informed by the my Qdos Legal Advice that this is a TUPE scenario and you cannot protect yourself against this happening either in your staff contract or the terms and conditions of business with your client. 

[Melissa123]

Thanks guys for sharing, but I make client sign contracts that protect me against poaching my cleaners. It was an issues before but now I ensure the clients pay a fine for taking my cleaners. I call it a "placement" fee

[Churchill Contract Cleaners]

You can write in what ever you want into contracts and employment contracts, we have a business protection policy in our contracts of employment and anti-poaching terms in our contracts with customers but there actually unjust as TUPE laws would over rule any such terms you have in place.

In practice there is nothing you can do about this, you just have to do your best so that your customer would not wish to do this to you - part and parcel of the industry were in im afraid.

[Gilbert Sprous]

So lets throw some more spanners in the works.  What if the cleaner is not completely eligible for TUPE.  The next thing would be that you are not stopping them from hiring the cleaner, but you have a vested interest in that cleaner with recruitment, training, a future income from their work.  They signed the contract up front and if you have a no poaching clause it has to be considered when they decide if they will take it in house.  Depending on the company and size you are wanting, you could take them to small claims court fairly cheap, and if they do not have the guts to show, you will win and get a judgement.

I am now in a issue kind of the same, but they poached my guy and put him on their production line.  My no poaching clause is for 12 x the monthly contract price.  The trick they tried to use is that they use an agency for all their hiring for the production line.  They sent him to the agency and hired him through there.  But, as I pointed out to them, this is their normal hiring practice and they asked for him by name so it was a blatant attempt to circumvent our agreement.  We will see how this one plays out.  I invoiced them for the full amount.

[JandS]

Surely you can't make people use you and nobody else.....in the same way how can you stop someone leaving your employ  to work for someone else.....especially if they are instantly replaceable .

[Gilbert Sprous]

That is kind of my point really, if it is so easy to get someone, why don't they get someone else instead of using the people I have recruited, trained and invested in.  But, like I said, they are not always taking them as cleaners so TUPE does not apply.  The issue I have is that they found him to be reliable, and a good worker, so they offered him a job and expected me to go out and recruit and train again.  I have a vested interest, I did not hold up the employee from moving, the contract  I have with him is separate to what I have with the client.  I put the clause in their to cover my loses, and as long as I have a vested interest and the clauses purpose is not to deter but to compensate it is legal