[BSF]

Could'nt agree more Tim, With the over heads I have I must charge a minimum £13ph, I try an average £15ph plus vat. I really don't see the point in setting up a contract where its hard work for a small margin. we all know the maths charge out at £7.50 pay the staff £6.50 100 hrs a week £100 profit but it never works out that way, you either cut the hours and loose the quality to make it work!
regards Phil

Phil the above is one of the biggest loads of rubbish I have ever read,

If you had a contract for 10hrs per week, 1 cleaner 2hrs mon – fri, and you made a £6 per hour profit, that would be £60 pw profit.

You’d be much better off having a 100 hrs per week contract making £1.50 per hour profit, that’s £150 profit per week, then all profit from hand towels, toilet rolls etc, also this job will be 10 cleaners doing 2hrs, if two are off sick, the other 8 would manage the work load, you’d save 4 hrs pay that shift. If a member of staff left, you might struggle to replace him/her for a couple of weeks, but the work will still be done, you would then make more money, this is the advantage of a big contract

If your other cleaner from the 10hr per week contract was off, someone else or you would have to carry out the work, what if they left?

Big contracts run themselves they take up very little of your time after the first few months of transfer, the hardest part is replacing the bad apples in the workforce and keeping hold of the good ones.

Come on guys please wake up

Regards

BSF

[Prestige1]

BSF
I think its you that needs to wake up, Cleaners can be some of the most unreliable staff there is even you must know that? A large contract needs managing so you would need that in place as well, with so many staff you’re going to get hassle without direct management which adds to the cost; if you haven’t got enough fat in it you will loose money on the deal. When you say other staff will do it? Will they? No, quality will suffer and you will lose the job and that’s just why the cleaning industry has such a bad name. Its people like you who quote that low you can’t put the hours in to maintain it, and you will blag your way through the job as long as you can, cream of as much as you can, and in the end there will cancel.

Look matey if you’re happy making living at it that’s just fine! Not a problem. but if you want more from life then I suggest you loose the attitude problems you have, grow up and try and learn something. I am getting bit sick of people posting like you who think they no it all, use aggression and disrespect others on this forum with your rude replies, and on top of that don't disclose any information about yourself. I can only assume from that you either work for someone else or your company has such a poor reputation you don't want anyone else to know. Go on prove me wrong and show us your website!

No!!! There’s a surprise!!!

[Carolann]

It's only 2 days per week, for this you can charge more, the client will know this and expect this.
Your estimate of £60 per week I think is spot on, as they only want you twice a week it will be a small ofice so your materials costs will be relatively low and you can incorporate this into your overheads, and once you become more established and take on bigger contracts you will be more aware of incidental costs involved, and be more confident in yourself and your costings.
Good Luck

Ps I started out 6 years ago just like you, worried about what to charge, it's second nature now.
Carolann

[Phoenix]

Come on BSF,

Lets see your web site

[BSF]

No

[BSF]

BSF
I think its you that needs to wake up, Cleaners can be some of the most unreliable staff there is even you must know that? A large contract needs managing so you would need that in place as well, with so many staff you’re going to get hassle without direct management which adds to the cost; if you haven’t got enough fat in it you will loose money on the deal. When you say other staff will do it? Will they? No, quality will suffer and you will lose the job and that’s just why the cleaning industry has such a bad name. Its people like you who quote that low you can’t put the hours in to maintain it, and you will blag your way through the job as long as you can, cream of as much as you can, and in the end there will cancel.

Look matey if you’re happy making living at it that’s just fine! Not a problem. but if you want more from life then I suggest you loose the attitude problems you have, grow up and try and learn something. I am getting bit sick of people posting like you who think they no it all, use aggression and disrespect others on this forum with your rude replies, and on top of that don't disclose any information about yourself. I can only assume from that you either work for someone else or your company has such a poor reputation you don't want anyone else to know. Go on prove me wrong and show us your website!

No!!! There’s a surprise!!!

Another load of rubbish its you that hasnt got a clue Phil, please dont make assumptions about me.

[Prestige1]

Very tame from you I wouldnt make assumptions if you could show a little more respect, and the missing web site???

[BSF]

Come on Phil, telling you your post was rubbish isn’t aggression, its not thinking I know it all either, I take offence at the fact that because I choose not to advertise my company on here, you have decided its because I might work for someone else, or my company has a poor reputation.

My website isn’t missing Phil, if you had half a brain and added a few sums up from my previous posts you’d find it no problem.

Its you who chooses to advertise your company on here, I and anyone else can find out a great deal from the details off your website, so if I were you I’d quit trying to disrespect my company before it gets embarrassing for you.

Because if you do want to carry this childish nonsense on for a few more days, I’m your man. 

[Prestige1]

There you go again using terms such as “Half a brain!" and using threats again, There’s no need for it. you can pick as many faults about my web site as you wish, I am sure there’s loads, its due for replacing this week so you can have a go at that one as well, its out there for all to see, but what gives you that right when yours is no where to be seen. You hide behind your failure to disclose your identity or reputation and throw insults and threats. I have not decided you work for anyone else or disrespected your company how can I when I don’t know it? You have done that yourself by not telling anyone about yourself and behaving in the way you do. . And if it’s out there in your previous posts then why not tell us? And when you threaten to escalate the argument because you’re backed into a corner, sums you up. I am sure you have a lot to offer I just don't know why you use the language you do, everyone has an opinion I just wish you would respect that.  Before you have a go about my website have the bottle to put yours up for inspection as well, and put your reputation up for scrutiny by all. Regards Phil

[supernova77]

Thanks for your reply Carolann.

Whereabouts are you based?

Andy

[Phoenix]

Come on B.S.F show us your web site. 

Are you that blinkered that you may be missing a great sales opportunity?

People will hit your site just to see it and then we can all give our feedback as you seem to have an awful lot of feedback/ opinions about other peoples sites.

If your proud about what you do and you have a good reputation then advertise it for free as a link to your profile.  Come on don't be shy.  What have you got to lose.

Hats off to you Phil @ prestige1 you've hit the nail squarley on the head.

[BSF]

Phil, I wasn’t having a go at your website, it doesn’t interest me, how good or bad it is, I was merely referring to the fact that I or anybody else can find out important details about you and your company from the information on your web site, I am not hiding from anybody Phil, saying you’ve got half a brain isn’t a threat, its an opinion, one day you will realise that putting your details on here isn’t/wasn’t a very good idea, by the way this isn’t a warning or a threat to you,   Phoenix & Phil, I do not need to advertise on the forum, I could have the best website in the world, but it shouldn’t mean I should be judged on my posts by the quality of it.

It’s my own choice to hide my identity on the forum, for various reasons.

Regards

BSF

[Sarah S & P Cleaning]

My small contract cleaning business i have offers extremely high standards of cleaning and we charge around £10.50 per hour per member of staff for man power only (no stock & equipment) and around £12-£14 per hour depending on the contract with stock & equipment.
All our clients are more than happy with the rates and the service, you get what you pay for is often true.
Hope that helps 

[BSF]

My small contract cleaning business i have offers extremely high standards of cleaning and we charge around £10.50 per hour per member of staff for man power only (no stock & equipment) and around £12-£14 per hour depending on the contract with stock & equipment.
All our clients are more than happy with the rates and the service, you get what you pay for is often true.
Hope that helps 

Yes Sarah………

You can charge this and a lot more for small jobs, my company does.

The tittle tattle aimed at me by a few members isn’t justified, unless they have large jobs or have ever quoted for one of more than 50hrs weekly, they would understand my point/s, Phil has one for 60hrs a week and must charge £13 per hour for it because that is his minimum charge, if he is true to his word on that price, he is charging too much for it, without him thinking about what contradictions he is writing on this forum, it is he not me who is giving cleaning companies a bad name, by trying to overcharge for a service, if we all quoted over the top prices for office cleaning, all large contracts would employ their own staff.

Phoenixdrivers limited must have some idea of how it works because he allegedly has a 1.7 million pound turnover from his company/s.

I can supply a first rate cleaning service at a reasonable price, this is why my business is continuously growing.

Regards

BSF 

[Prestige1]

BSF
I respectfully disagree, anything over 80hrs per week will have to be more competitively priced I agree on that but not at the levels you imply. I honestly believe that a good cleaner if worth charging out at £12 to £16 per hour. its only that there is that many cleaning companies charging a lot less, that it forces the average down. In my opinion you can have the best cleaning company in the world with the best systems and processes available. But if your pitch or sales technique is inadequate you will not be able to get the jobs at a rate which is worth it. Sales is something I know a lot about, having managed as many 280 direct sales staff in a previous life. The staff I managed would be able to sell packages from £39 up to £140 the good reps would average £100 where the poor reps £62, the poor reps would always have the same excuses that have been outlined by some on this forum/topic, like, “you can’t charge more”! “No money in the area”! Or “I had to get them for £62 or he would go to a competitor”! Its all about your sales approach ( in my opinion) if you can go through the sales process on an estimate and follow each stage of the process., identifying needs, linking the features and benefits of your company, overcoming objections and closing the sale. Sounds simple but its not, you have to work on it. Get it right and you will be able to command a much better rate. But then this is only my humble opinion based on the time I was a Divisional Sales manager, managing everything from Hull to Manchester everything North, with 4 managers and 280 sales reps. Every one to there own if you dissagree fine no problem, Kind regards Phil

[garyj]

Can I throw my hat in hat ring?

Prestige has the most idealistic pricing, I wish we could all charge as much, perhaps we should!!

BSF has the most realistic pricing, and will get the job, and still make a healthy profit.

Prestige has the best picture, so I stole it.

I understand where Prestige is coming from, but in today's market BSF is on the button.

[BSF]

Phil,

So you seriously think that if you were asked to quote for a contract of 60 hrs per week you could convince the customer that its worth £13 - £16 per hour? even with all your sales experience, its not possible.

When the current company is probably doing it for around £8 per hour ( if current staff are paid £5.50 ph).

You really are convinced by the sounds of it Phil, is this some kind of a wind up?

By your price and very above average costs for, materials, insurance, administration, management, they know that you will be making in excess of £300 per week profit, that’s at the £13 charge (your minimum), its over £450 profit per week at the £16.00

That quote would be laughed all the way in to the shredder!

Your digging yourself in to a great big hole Phil.

Regards

BSF

[Prestige1]

Thats fine not a problem, getting the job is easy, its getting at the best price you can is the key, I can't argue if your happy charging what you do and making the profit what you do, I personally just won't comprimise my pricing. I have never chased commercial work, it just comes my way and some I loose the majority I don't, Regards Phil

[BSF]

Thats fine not a problem, getting the job is easy, its getting at the best price you can is the key, I can't argue if your happy charging what you do and making the profit what you do, I personally just won't comprimise my pricing. I have never chased commercial work, it just comes my way and some I loose the majority I don't, Regards Phil

Their you go Phil your now nearly at the bottom of that hole, Garyj just posted what I was going to say in a round about way, I wish I could make £300 pw profit on a 60hr pw contract, because if I could I wouldnt be on this forum I'd be in the caribbean with CMS .

Regards

BSF

[therapist]

Interesting exchange of views and whichever route you choose, you will require a great deal of dedication and singlemindedness.

Personally and I fall back on, not just personal experience, but all of the training and business education, etc, over 30 plus years, which has cosistently impressed certain values upon me.

One of which was the avoidence of falling into the ''  low price trap  '' which is the cause of many businesses failures.

Sure, you can discount and you can, theoretically sell products, or services at lower than the competition, but, you have to comfortably exceed your breakeven and be able to sustain a consistent level of growth to, just, stand still.

It is far better to achieve a level of profitability, with which you are comfortable and which gives sufficient surplus to re invest in your business, in capital expenditure, or marketing / training / diversification.

It's a simple and obvious fact, that a compact and well structured business is a lot easier to manage.

What you have to get from your business goes beyond, size, the most important thing is profitability and it's perfectly possible for a one man / woman business, with a small team of 6 to 8 employees to achieve a greater net profit, than a larger, but less well run business.

This kind of discussion could go, on and on, as opinions and attitudes will always be in conflict, but it does'nt mean that one approach will always succeed over another, as the personality factor, will determine the routes we choose and to a great extent , the success, or failure of our enterprise.

best wishes

rob m