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nathanjd

  • Posts: 112
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #20 on: February 22, 2013, 03:01:18 pm »
Thanks John for your vacuum knowledge, ive read everything you've said on these boards regarding this subject, and you seam to have the voice of reason and impartiality.

I didnt realise the storm needs two wires to work.

FibreSafe: if you have immersion and steammate its one cord. A rocker switch lets you choose either, nothing, immersion or inline(steammate) which is whats been on the ninjas for years

james roffey

Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #21 on: February 22, 2013, 03:07:22 pm »
I use an Airflex triple vac with warm water in the tank, if i need to then i will add the Magma, i am not sure how hot it is but at 300 psi you can hear it "popping" the same sound you get from an iron. i did a job this week where a brightly coloured child's sun tan lotion had been spilt all over a cream carpet, i could not get it out with anything, until i attached the Magma the extra heat worked. yes i use three cords to achieve this  plus two into the nearest sockets and one from the kitchen ring main, dont really see this as much of an inconvenience for the results achieved.

Surely you cant have your cake and eat it, if you want extra power then you are obviously running more amps, so require extra cords.

Nathan regarding impartiality, as owners of these machines we speak as that, owners, I have never owned an Enforcer but nothing i have seen has convinced me it is better than my own machine the Airflex turbo let alone the Storm, it looks better than the Ninja and is probably better than that machine. i can only give my own perspective and if i were in your shoes would buy the Storm, guided by the fact its a well thought out and tried and tested model, ie the Turbo which preceded it, and has good back up and service which you can trust, not something i can say with your alternative supplier, your right though i am not impartial in my view because i have experienced both suppliers which you have shown an interest in.

john martin

  • Posts: 2699
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #22 on: February 22, 2013, 03:32:37 pm »
Thanks John for your vacuum knowledge, ive read everything you've said on these boards regarding this subject, and you seam to have the voice of reason and impartiality.

I didnt realise the storm needs two wires to work.

FibreSafe: if you have immersion and steammate its one cord. A rocker switch lets you choose either, nothing, immersion or inline(steammate) which is whats been on the ninjas for years

I would hit the thanks button if there was one  ;D

john martin

  • Posts: 2699
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #23 on: February 22, 2013, 03:39:54 pm »

Storm has 2 x 6.6 motors. The Enforcer only has one of the powerful Electro vacs. The other motor in the Enforcer is a much less powerful 5amps/400 peak airwatts motor.

If the Enforcer had two of the powerful Electro vacs then, yes, it would be comparable to the Storm machine and would also need two power cords.

Nothing wrong with an immersion heater if you don't mind waiting for the water to heat up.

Yes thats the tradeoff they choose ,  the difference then comes down to series vs parallel and the suction where the wands meets the carpet . Harder  to measure , from russ chadds initial review it would seem to work well enough .

Manufactures probably have to stick to 13 amps to meet regulations , but i would put two electros or 6.6 on one cord without thinking twice , its not that easy to trip switches , and during use restriction causes a certain amp drop .
With the mytee escape , woodbridge has put two electros and a 2500psi pump on one cord !   

nathanjd

  • Posts: 112
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #24 on: February 22, 2013, 03:41:35 pm »
Thanks james for your thoughts. However this thread is not about cleansmart vs ashbys, two suppliers that i have been dealing with for many years. Its the vacuum question. :)

james roffey

Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #25 on: February 22, 2013, 03:57:53 pm »
Both suppliers haven different ideas about that, its about who you believe
.

jim mca

  • Posts: 827
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #26 on: February 22, 2013, 07:10:37 pm »
Storm
twin 6.6 vacs easily runs 100 foot of hose
800psi pump can be used for tile and grout
design easy to work on
auto pump out as standard
warranty transferred if you buy second hand
approved local engineers allowed to service and carry out warranty work

downside no immersion heater

Enforcer

a mix of vac motor configurations    don't know how they perform
400psi pump   on prices for larger but 400 from ninja was pants by all accounts
warranty no idea ashbys policy
local engineers don't think ashbys allow
design showerproof       FANTASTIC   if it works but for Scotland gale proof would be needed

the enforcer should be compared to the airflex pro range just my opinion

 

JandS

  • Posts: 4239
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #27 on: February 22, 2013, 08:04:29 pm »
400psi pump on Ninja is fine.
Mine's nearly 4 years old and all it's needed are
a new pump seal kit.
Impossible done straight away, miracles can take a little longer.

jim mca

  • Posts: 827
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #28 on: February 22, 2013, 08:57:05 pm »
JandS

Its only my opinion based on reading posts on here and my opinion takes into account the positive posts from guys like yourself

Jim

Simon@arenaclean

  • Posts: 1054
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #29 on: February 22, 2013, 09:38:33 pm »
I've had series machines and parallel and have to say my preference is parallel and after the Turbo the Storm was always going to be the next step and i've been very happy with that and the excellent support from Cleansmart. The one thing though that is being missed I think is that Cleansmart, Solutions, Alltec & Ashby's have all produced 'Flagship' machines over the last couple of years that have some really nice inovations and the exciting thing is they they are not standing still either. Nothing is ever perfect or ideal and as others have said the debate will go on as to which is best.

The other day I had some stairs/landings in a block of flats to do at short notice and on a whim I took the back up Alltec Pro Plus for a spin. It did surprisingly well if a little slow! But I did take the time to consider putting a couple of the new 5.7's in there with a 200psi pump upgrade. Think that would make a nice machine.

john martin

  • Posts: 2699
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #30 on: February 22, 2013, 10:08:19 pm »
I've had series machines and parallel and have to say my preference is parallel and after the Turbo the Storm was always going to be the next step and i've been very happy with that and the excellent support from Cleansmart. The one thing though that is being missed I think is that Cleansmart, Solutions, Alltec & Ashby's have all produced 'Flagship' machines over the last couple of years that have some really nice inovations and the exciting thing is they they are not standing still either. Nothing is ever perfect or ideal and as others have said the debate will go on as to which is best.

The other day I had some stairs/landings in a block of flats to do at short notice and on a whim I took the back up Alltec Pro Plus for a spin. It did surprisingly well if a little slow! But I did take the time to consider putting a couple of the new 5.7's in there with a 200psi pump upgrade. Think that would make a nice machine.

The pro plus was a very competent design and could definitely be updated ,
I think it originally ran 7.2s so you could fit any motor into it .
replacing the 1.5" hose connector with a 2"would be desirable if you want to run high CFM setup .
Or sticking with the 1.5" hose a simple improvement might be one 6.6 or 8.4 with a standard 5.7 behind it in series .
Giving you 140cfm and 200" lift .



I spotted its big brother on steroids for sale here  ....  the millennium
always wondered what it looked like ...

http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/alltec-millenium-quad-vac-carpet-cleaner/1008729056
 

Shaun_Ashmore

  • Posts: 11381
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #31 on: February 22, 2013, 10:16:07 pm »
£1500 for that!

I wonder if you got 2 x 8.4 motors which current machine you could fit them in? I dont think their is one, not if you are going to fit a decent pump in also.

Shaun

john martin

  • Posts: 2699
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #32 on: February 22, 2013, 10:32:01 pm »
£1500 for that!

I wonder if you got 2 x 8.4 motors which current machine you could fit them in? I dont think their is one, not if you are going to fit a decent pump in also.

Shaun

Apparently it was 6500 new years ago !  but really there wasn't much like it then or since  .

Im sure you could fit the 8.4s into some of the current machines if you were determined , its one reason why id like to see inside an enforcer , it has the options to run 7.2s so 8.4 should fit some how ... they are big diameter but a bit shorter than a standard vac .

Shaun_Ashmore

  • Posts: 11381
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #33 on: February 22, 2013, 10:38:20 pm »
With the technology you'd have thought that the 8.4 motor would be the next evolution and an easy upgrade at that, I wonder who will claim to be the first? good selling point though.

Shaun

richie

  • Posts: 1179
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #34 on: February 22, 2013, 10:47:07 pm »
I didnt bother to read all the replies but heres my thought.......the Storm is getting awesome reviews.  In fact i have not seen anyone say a bad thing about it.  As for Vac hose......why 1.5 vac hose?  You should be using the 2 inch.  1.5 will just strangle the air flow.

john martin

  • Posts: 2699
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #35 on: February 22, 2013, 10:59:05 pm »
With the technology you'd have thought that the 8.4 motor would be the next evolution and an easy upgrade at that, I wonder who will claim to be the first? good selling point though.

Shaun

Wouldn't be surprised to see them in the jag  , you know hes not going to update the body at this stage so they need a bigger number to get the hype going again . A couple of his friends are field testing them in recoils in the states .

But really its not a huge leap in performance or technology  ... 
Domel have tapered fan 7.2 two stage for years that never gets a mention , its likely ametek copied that .
Performance wise ...  the electro has 645airwatts , the 8.4 almost 700 ....  not a huge difference .

But i would like to try a pair of 8.4s... in an enforcer

james roffey

Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #36 on: February 22, 2013, 11:51:17 pm »
John, don't take this the wrong way but i have often wondered, how do you know this stuff, do you have engineering experience or have you worked in this field.

john martin

  • Posts: 2699
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #37 on: February 23, 2013, 12:14:39 am »
John, don't take this the wrong way but i have often wondered, how do you know this stuff, do you have engineering experience or have you worked in this field.

Ha ha James   ;D      I guess i just read the boards a fair bit  .

nathanjd

  • Posts: 112
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #38 on: February 23, 2013, 12:17:30 am »
I didnt bother to read all the replies but heres my thought.......the Storm is getting awesome reviews.  In fact i have not seen anyone say a bad thing about it.  As for Vac hose......why 1.5 vac hose?  You should be using the 2 inch.  1.5 will just strangle the air flow.

Richie: I dont think you need to worry about strangling airflow if you are coming down on the side of high lift vacuum setups.

I have used 2" before and i know its performance is better with high airflow because i had a prowler with it until recently. But using 2" is just simply more annoying than 1.5". Its harder to unload, pack up, lift and use. Plus you need to be much more careful flinging it around a customers house.

oliver collins

  • Posts: 352
Re: Enforcer or Storm
« Reply #39 on: February 23, 2013, 09:45:10 am »
Hi,i had a triple vac ninja now have a storm and its power and dry times are in a total different league used it on my own carpets and the dry times are loads lower wih the storm.

Oliver Collins rise n shine cleaning