[steve rix]

  Go and knock doors, that costs you nothing but your time, 100% return on each successful knock rather than % to bank every clean for however many years.

Thats why I'm saying about the extra bit of money for the leaflets. If I borrowed a little extra I would be using the banks money to get work through advertising to repay them and the work I bought would be mine. The time I would spend doorknocking I could spend earning and repay them with a bit of the return I was getting.

And you would have a little bit extra to pay back each month. Trust me the banks will SCREW you without you helping them. Design and print your own leaflets on your computer and deliver them yous self. You will be amazed what a well worded leaflet will pull in.

thats not a fast fix though Steve, we all no leaflets bring in work but not in large numbers at a time, it is a good trickle of work though and can last years

Not so sure, I started in April 2007, In my first year I turned over £28554.00. We now turnover in excess of £100K and I have NEVER canvassed (Haven't got the bottle!!!)

you got that all from leaflets ?

YES all from leaflets and recomendations

[Window Washers]

  Go and knock doors, that costs you nothing but your time, 100% return on each successful knock rather than % to bank every clean for however many years.

Thats why I'm saying about the extra bit of money for the leaflets. If I borrowed a little extra I would be using the banks money to get work through advertising to repay them and the work I bought would be mine. The time I would spend doorknocking I could spend earning and repay them with a bit of the return I was getting.

And you would have a little bit extra to pay back each month. Trust me the banks will SCREW you without you helping them. Design and print your own leaflets on your computer and deliver them yous self. You will be amazed what a well worded leaflet will pull in.

thats not a fast fix though Steve, we all no leaflets bring in work but not in large numbers at a time, it is a good trickle of work though and can last years

Not so sure, I started in April 2007, In my first year I turned over £28554.00. We now turnover in excess of £100K and I have NEVER canvassed (Haven't got the bottle!!!)

you got that all from leaflets ?

YES all from leaflets and recomendations

nice, are you in kingslyn ?

[steve rix]

No the North Cotswolds

[G Griffin]

if it was viable, I would

I agree but it depends on many, many things.

true, but I would without doubt get a loan for this if needed, I am at the moment looking to buy out other window cleaners, just none being sold at the moment where I need them if one came along and I needed finance thats a route I would look down.

G Brookes makes a very valid post above in many ways

Course, yeah.
I meant if the work was worth it, why not. But that depends on many, many things  .

[colley614]

if it was viable, I would

I agree but it depends on many, many things.

true, but I would without doubt get a loan for this if needed, I am at the moment looking to buy out other window cleaners, just none being sold at the moment where I need them if one came along and I needed finance thats a route I would look down.

G Brookes makes a very valid post above in many ways

Put it this way at the moment I'm stuck in a rut. I'm in a job I don't enjoy but I can't afford to quit, I'm trying to save but am just earning enough to turn over. If I left this job then the money I earn would in part be replaced by tax credits and my wife is willing to go from part time to full time to help me get going which would cover the rest. But the round would have to cover itself, I'd have no spare money to replace anything that went wrong. If I bought this round I would be able to spend money to buy 20k in leaflets every month and have them delivered so work would come flying in and in 12 months I'd be booming.
Course, yeah.
I meant if the work was worth it, why not. But that depends on many, many things  .

[Window Washers]

I would want to know:

How long the work had been established
How it is cleaned
how often
do they have a record to back up the claims they make


if you didnt have any money as a back up plan I would ask why this is, because a pump can and will break as could a load of equipment.

what is the price of the work per month and how much do they want for it, if you cannot afford to pay a loan and have money extra on top of this then to me the deal is not a good one, I dont know what the work is so just gussing. 20,000 leaflets is not alot, I have already done over 10,000 this year another 5,000 are going out in the next month, they do get work in but it is in no way guarenteed mate, I am not trying to put you off, more tying to help.

do you know the figures ?

[steve rix]

and for the record, banks dont 'screw' you, everything they do is in your terms and conditions which you agre to when you take out their banking product so as long as you stick to them there you wont have any problems with the loan

Banks can and do change their t&c all the time!!

[Window Washers]

and for the record, banks dont 'screw' you, everything they do is in your terms and conditions which you agre to when you take out their banking product so as long as you stick to them there you wont have any problems with the loan

Banks can and do change their t&c all the time!!

totally agree, and they do try to screw you, they have tried it many a time with me, sometimes a credit card is cheaper than they lending, which I find shocking seeing as they are meant to be helping business's not trying it on

[colley614]

The work is £3.5k to buy and turns over £710 a month. It's in an area where he is getting asked all the time but has full round. It's been established 20 years trad.

If I take out a personal loan because of my credit the apr is 47.9% but on a secured loan its only 12.9%. The repayments are about £110 a month. If I was earning £710 a month from my business then that would be mine to spend so I'd be able to send out leaflets every month with it if I wanted or buy a new pump or resin if needed.

I'm thinking the £710 income would be mine to play with.

The money I make sending out the first batch of leaflets would cover the loan repayments, but could pay the loan out of the £710 income I'd be buying.

Then every month I would be able to send out another batch of leaflets from the £710 of work. I don't have to finance anything else apart from the business. But the business would have to pay for itself.

[richard jagger]

If you at this time are not already doing window I would not go to any bank as I don`t think you would get the loan on the strength of the value of the round as it has many risks if you were already working a year or two i would consider a loan.I would not take any advice on a loan with the scant detail you have provided.its a big step.i THINK IN THE BACK OF YOUR MIND YOU KNOW THE RISKS AND DO NOT NEED ADVICE BUT ARE REALLY LOOKING FOR CONFIRMATION.

[colley614]

If you at this time are not already doing window I would not go to any bank as I don`t think you would get the loan on the strength of the value of the round as it has many risks if you were already working a year or two i would consider a loan.I would not take any advice on a loan with the scant detail you have provided.its a big step.

I'm not new to window cleaning, been doing it over 12 years. I'm looking at the idea of a loan but am giving it good thought at the moment and will probably wake up in the morning with a totally different opinion on the subject but I am waying up the pro's and con's.

What do you mean by scant detail?

[Window Washers]

from the sounds of it, I dont agree with wixzid that in the back of your mind your doubting it, as that sounds ok to me. I could well be wrong, but from what your saying it could well make sence, yet it is a big jump, but sometimes if we pass things we tend to always think what if.

[thermoclean]

Banks can only screw you if your an idiot, buying work is a very sensible decision
For anyone who can't wait for the build up of work that comes from canvassing or any form of advertising. I bought rounds when I started window cleaning because I had bills to pay and was used to a certain amount of income.
Sometimes buying an existing business is the best way forward than starting from scratch and that is true in any industry.

[colley614]

I'm not thinking I want to do this but I want you guys to say yeah go for it. I honestly feel like I'm standing on a cliff edge looking down and saying " Have any of you guys jumped?" I know the risks and rewards but I'm trying to balance them in my mind.

[richard jagger]

Scant details you have just answered I would say it sound good to me .I was writing at the same time you answered as below good luck its sounds good Mate.
The work is £3.5k to buy and turns over £710 a month. It's in an area where he is getting asked all the time but has full round. It's been established 20 years trad.

If I take out a personal loan because of my credit the apr is 47.9% but on a secured loan its only 12.9%. The repayments are about £110 a month. If I was earning £710 a month from my business then that would be mine to spend so I'd be able to send out leaflets every month with it if I wanted or buy a new pump or resin if needed.

I'm thinking the £710 income would be mine to play with.

The money I make sending out the first batch of leaflets would cover the loan repayments, but could pay the loan out of the £710 income I'd be buying.

Then every month I would be able to send out another batch of leaflets from the £710 of work. I don't have to finance anything else apart from the business. But the business would have to pay for itself.

[colley614]

Right I've decided the best way to think about this is to do a full 12 month cashflow projection. I'm going to run off the fact that I've got the loan and bought the work (obviously I haven't) and am now looking at how many jobs I can get in a month for 20k leaflets. I'm going to work off the figure of 0.5% success rate so for every 1000 leaflets I get half a job so I'm going to sit down and take it from there. Any other factors do you think I should put i.e. each job should be would be worth £xx each?

[Londoner]

0.5% sucess rate means you get 5 jobs per 1000. I would just skip the loan and bang on with the leaflets. I am very reluctant to go into debt. By doing that you should be on better than £700 a month pretty quickly. And canvassing should get you one a night easily now the evenings are getting lighter.

[Nameless Drudge]

Your saying £710 a month took 20 years to build in one of the most affluent areas.It doesn`t make sense!

[Helen]

Don't borrow money, unless you can afford to pay it back straight away.
Don't buy a window cleaning round unless your gut feeling is 100% good about it.
Unless you have a really good relationship with your bank, it's unlikely they will lend (unlike what the government is saying!) This will push you to loan elsewhere with higher interest rates.
If you are really interested int his work, why not ask for a deal, a lump sum up front and monthy payments thereafter?

[Paul Coleman]

The work is £3.5k to buy and turns over £710 a month. It's in an area where he is getting asked all the time but has full round. It's been established 20 years trad.

If I take out a personal loan because of my credit the apr is 47.9% but on a secured loan its only 12.9%. The repayments are about £110 a month. If I was earning £710 a month from my business then that would be mine to spend so I'd be able to send out leaflets every month with it if I wanted or buy a new pump or resin if needed.

I'm thinking the £710 income would be mine to play with.

The money I make sending out the first batch of leaflets would cover the loan repayments, but could pay the loan out of the £710 income I'd be buying.

Then every month I would be able to send out another batch of leaflets from the £710 of work. I don't have to finance anything else apart from the business. But the business would have to pay for itself.

If you do this, bear in mind that banks are more reluctant to lend for business purposes so it may have to look like it's for something else.  Also, if possible, try to get the loan showing separately as the principal will be tax deductible as well as the interest.