[Steve Gunn]

carpet cleaners tonight bbc1now

[Bob Robertson]

You on it Steve?

[Steve Gunn]

No spotted them straight away so changed tact

[Bob Allen]

About time they named and shamed this shower of poop!!

[Simon Gerrard]

I just cannot imagine myself going into a customers house with the sole intention of conning them. What is even more astonishing is that people actually fall for it. But what a horrible way of making a living.

Simon

[jasonl]

The company is still trading , they have a large telesales team at the office in Ferndown , all wel motivated and on good commission .

They see it as a legitimate service they are offering, they are well funded by some extremely wealthy backers.   It plays on the greed of the customer wanting something for nothing.

[ianharper]

Guys

Have you seen this yet? found this when suffing.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xfjqlo_watchdog-bait-and-switch_news

[matthew martin]

cowboy always come unstuck about time to

[wynne jones]

Like a lot of these Watchdog programmes you never actually get to see the company owners do you?

It's like coppers will tell you, serious crims rarely get caught, they have some mug to get their hands dirty whilst maintaining an air of respectability. They know the law intimately and have expensive lawyers to keep it that way.

[clinton]

Your prob spot on there wynne with the post.

[robert meldrum]

Like all rogue traders and cowboy builders, etc. None of them ever stop. There were others on the programme recently, plumbers, builders and locksmiths who were ripping people off to the tune of tens of thousands in some cases .............they all seem to keep trading no matter what.

What happened in the USA following J P's long campaign against Bait and Switch ? Has it gone away, or is it still their, but disguised as Bronze / Silver / Gold standards of cleaning, or..............is it still in use but presented as " upselling ".

When, does what's regarded as a legitimate trading practice become a " con " or a " rip off " ?

[wynne jones]

Where I have a problem with the programme and maybe the LAW is to say that quoting something on a leaflet and then providing something else for more is illegal.

For instance I could say a maintence clean £30 for carpet that need 'maintenance'. However if I got there and it was a complete minger I would be doing them a diservice if I did not advise it wouldn't be a good idea. Also if I refused to offer the maintenance clean I would also be in trouble according to the law.

Upselling, bronze silver and gold ideas are completly different to bait and switch as you are offering a CHOICE of ADDITIONAL things and you are happy to supply the bronze as it is a kosher, professional option for the custy.

[robert meldrum]

So..............define upselling. Other than offering stain protection as an additional service.

[wynne jones]

'Hey Mrs Jones as well as doing your lounge we can do your HSL for £xx today'

Whats wrong with that?

[robert meldrum]

That's got nothing to do Bronze,  Silver,  Gold marketing,  which is really....... fair result, good result or better result but you have to pay extra for the service you should have got in the first place.

[wynne jones]

Robert

I'm not being drawn into this, you seem to be coming over all self righteous about the way you do things and if you want to play that game fine.

[Joe H]

I see as ok saying we can do your hsl today for x amount, thats ok.

Cant see fair result, good result, better result as sitting ok with me.
The result has to be the best I can get all the time.

Now if I had different gradings based on what work I do - something like -

You vac up bronze
I vac but no furniture moved silver
I vac and I move furniture gold

I am ok with that

but cant be doing on different levels of soil removal.

[ianharper]

same here joe. why should a customer that look after their carpet pay the same as a bad one. its going to take time to vac, move stuff and stain removal, plus the extra cost of stin removal products. its just not fair to people that look after stuff.

If customers move stuff, vac, and dont have stains that saves me time and them money.

You must always make clear the difference when quoting or estimating. plus as required by trading standards a full spec with the invoice and quote. we quote over the phone but follow up with a writtern one with a spec and a list of what we want from them. hot water, parking, stuff moved etc.

if you provide more than one level of service you must put it in writing. its only fair. I will add that people dont tell you the truth about stains. we ask them over the phone about "black spots" which we c lass as spots which is included in all cleans, and ones that have colour these are stains and need the full spec. anyway when they have stains we will remove them for free but when do the walk though we tell them that the spec they have does not cover these but we will do them anyway for free. I think this stops any misunderstandings and is professional.

This stuff works both ways why should i give my time and products to people that dont care about their stuff and charge others that do for it.

Respect

Ian Harper

[garry22]

The "victims" on Watchdog had no idea what a "proper" carpet cleaning job was or how much it should be.

They ordered a job at a fixed price. That is a legally binding oral contract.

They were then told that was not the case and that the price would be increased by up to 2000%. That is illegal.

That is a world of difference from offering people different levels of service as per bronze, silver, gold etc.

[Matt Seymour]

You've hit the nail on the head there Garry.

The vast majority of this mob's victims probably have absolutely no idea what carpet cleaning generally costs. To them £8.99 might have seemed cheap, but not ridiculously cheap for all we know.

That is why the scam works so well. They managed to bait people who almost certainly wouldn't  have considered having their carpets cleaned in the past or future and that is a whole lot of people.

Let's not forget that Enterprise lured most of their victims via telesales, which is a very powerful form of marketing. People sat there (many elderly) minding their own business with no opinion or intentions one way or another when it comes to carpet cleaning and suddenly someone calls them out of the blue with an amazing offer.

It's no surprise so many people went for it.