[C o z y]

What do you mean "If you let them carry on "? They're in that area cleaning. If they keep customers and are doing a good or bad job, it's upto the customer who gets the job. Nothing to do with anyone else. Nobody "lets" other windies work anywhere. We work where we want.

These 2 guys aren't taking anything of anyone except the money for cleaning people's windows. Unless any windie can say he would get 100% of an area, how is anyone taking anything off them?

If these blokes are muppets and can't do a good job, they will lose their customers. Then the customers are there to be picked up. It's all pretty simple really.

Makes me laugh sometimes how barrel chested some of us get and the way we all prepare for war 

[William McCafferty]

if a cleaner is working a area and you know that the customers want a change but are scared, if you go away then you are letting them take work off you, because if not then you will soon gain these customers.

[colin purewater]

Colley just find out what week they clean in that area
Then make sure your not there on that week !

Simples 

[LT carpet cleaning]

This is a reply to the original post. I've not read replies.

Daz,

I went out today leafleting a nice area by mine. About 10 doors in, I walks down the drive of this big detached house with 2 merc's parked outside and the lady in the garden asked me to price the house up so I did. Then she grabs my sleeve and marches me next door and basically demanded her next door neighbour to let me give her a quote too! anyway I booked the big house in and the neighbour said she would get back to me in a couple of weeks and they were telling me how there last window cleaner had been a nice piece of work but hadn't called for months. So I carried on with my leaflets and a guy on his drive asked me for a quote so I obliged. Only when I finished he said "Well we have a couple of window cleaners round here and they are to big skin heads, don't take no for an answer, that type of thing.." So I told him to get in touch with me if they ever let him down but he said that nobody in the area want them doing their windows just that they don't want to cancel in case. Now this area isn't to be sniffed at, they are all really big houses and by the sounds of it these lads aren't going to take kindly to me stepping on their toes. So what do you think should be the way forward for when I do step on their toes? As these guys aren't providing a good service and I'd like a few of these houses for myself 

what would you do, if these people broke into your house and nicked everything? because if you let them carry on cleaning in a area you can earn money in, then they are taking this money and food off your table

Erm, I think breaking into houses is illegal. Fairly certain people trying to make a living isn't.

[C o z y]

if a cleaner is working a area and you know that the customers want a change but are scared, if you go away then you are letting them take work off you, because if not then you will soon gain these customers.

I think you're being a bit naive mate. Just because some bloke in a street told him that he didn't like his window cleaner doesn't mean nobody in the whole street wants to keep that windie. I bet I've got one or two gobshyte customers that don't really like me and would like to cause trouble for the entertainment but it doesn't mean all of my work is up for grabs.

Sounds like a bed time story "One day a nasty windie was holding a whole street to ransom and stood in the shadows practising darting eye movements, then one day a dashing 6ft 5 hero windie rocked up and saved everybody"

It's all assumption and speculation. Canvass the street and see what happens. If a knuckle dragger turns up and says he will do this and that to you if you don't go away, you're onto a winner. The ones that threaten usually do naff all. It's bluff. It's the ones that don't warn you that are a bit dangerous. If you do get threatened, report it to the police.

[colley614]

I was thinking about this meeting today and I thought I bet the guy with the 'these two big blokes' story was probably the local window cleaner himself trying to frighten me off. Why ask for a quote then tell 'scary tales of mean old windie' kind of makes sense...

Reminds me of when I first started cleaning windows and we used to do the call centres for a big banking group, one of the call centres was massive. It took four lads with 2 reach and washes 2 days to get the outsides done and it was only on two floors. At the back there was woodland and there was a drive htat went up about 1/4 of a mile to this big old mansion where the big bosses of the company worked. This place was fort knocks and when we did the insides we had to have to security guards watch us clean the windows. Anyway this one day the guards started telling me and this other lad how the place was haunted and how sometimes of a night you would he screams from other rooms and this, that and the other. So we finished and went for our lunch in the car with the boss and told him our interesting story to which he turned round and said " You pair of muppets, think about it. It's one of the most secure places in the country, who's going to try and break in of a night if everyone thinks it's haunted. We're some of the only people who know where the place is!!" I felt a right idiot!
 

[mikecam]

have any of you guys done it?

when i started back in 1993 i started from scratch.id worked for a window cleaner for a year first then started on my own working a few days for him while i built my own round up.

it was hard going i was canvassing nearly every night and weekends for 6 months.i also found out about a few guys that were not doing a very good job in my local area so i targeted their work and canvassed and canvassed.i never offered to do them cheaper just asked them were they happy with their current cleaner.i picked up a few then word spread and i picked all their work up plus some more to add to it!!i was well happy!!

i did get them trying to threaten me but when they squared up to me they realised the best thing they could do was get back in their battered old escort and do one!!

i was young and pretty wild.no one was gonna stand in my way of building a round up for myself.i also did this in 2 other areas and again picked up a fair bit of work in a few months.

if you can find people who are really fed up with their window cleaner then there could be a chance for you to get in there and show them there is better cleaners out there!!


best wishes to you all


dazmond

You sound like a dickhead to me. I'm sure you're a great guy, but i'm just going on what you sound like.
Aggresivley targetting someones work is gonna land you in a whole heap of trouble one way or another.
'Aggresive'in this context means 'activley', so how do you do that? Tell them you're better, or cheaper? Heavens no 'cheaper' can;t be an option because everyone knows that 'undercutting' is a big no no , or maybe its not?
Maybe you think being 6 foot plus just seals the deal for you?

[G Griffin]

I was thinking about this meeting today and I thought I bet the guy with the 'these two big blokes' story was probably the local window cleaner himself trying to frighten me off. Why ask for a quote then tell 'scary tales of mean old windie' kind of makes sense...

Reminds me of when I first started cleaning windows and we used to do the call centres for a big banking group, one of the call centres was massive. It took four lads with 2 reach and washes 2 days to get the outsides done and it was only on two floors. At the back there was woodland and there was a drive htat went up about 1/4 of a mile to this big old mansion where the big bosses of the company worked. This place was fort knocks and when we did the insides we had to have to security guards watch us clean the windows. Anyway this one day the guards started telling me and this other lad how the place was haunted and how sometimes of a night you would he screams from other rooms and this, that and the other. So we finished and went for our lunch in the car with the boss and told him our interesting story to which he turned round and said " You pair of muppets, think about it. It's one of the most secure places in the country, who's going to try and break in of a night if everyone thinks it's haunted. We're some of the only people who know where the place is!!" I felt a right idiot!
 

No, I'd never break into a haunted house. Not because I'm a scaredy cat but because Shaggy, Scooby, Velma (after losing her glasses, again) and the other meddling kids would catch me out and my real identity revealed at the end of the programme.
And Fort Knocks would be a good name for a canvassing company. 

[William McCafferty]

This is a reply to the original post. I've not read replies.

Daz,

I went out today leafleting a nice area by mine. About 10 doors in, I walks down the drive of this big detached house with 2 merc's parked outside and the lady in the garden asked me to price the house up so I did. Then she grabs my sleeve and marches me next door and basically demanded her next door neighbour to let me give her a quote too! anyway I booked the big house in and the neighbour said she would get back to me in a couple of weeks and they were telling me how there last window cleaner had been a nice piece of work but hadn't called for months. So I carried on with my leaflets and a guy on his drive asked me for a quote so I obliged. Only when I finished he said "Well we have a couple of window cleaners round here and they are to big skin heads, don't take no for an answer, that type of thing.." So I told him to get in touch with me if they ever let him down but he said that nobody in the area want them doing their windows just that they don't want to cancel in case. Now this area isn't to be sniffed at, they are all really big houses and by the sounds of it these lads aren't going to take kindly to me stepping on their toes. So what do you think should be the way forward for when I do step on their toes? As these guys aren't providing a good service and I'd like a few of these houses for myself 

what would you do, if these people broke into your house and nicked everything? because if you let them carry on cleaning in a area you can earn money in, then they are taking this money and food off your table

Erm, I think breaking into houses is illegal. Fairly certain people trying to make a living isn't.

It was mean't as a metafore, by letting someone carry on working a area because they show bully boy tactics to scare off the competition is the same are someone picking your pockets, and harrassing someone from canvassing a area is illegal.

[William McCafferty]

have any of you guys done it?

when i started back in 1993 i started from scratch.id worked for a window cleaner for a year first then started on my own working a few days for him while i built my own round up.

it was hard going i was canvassing nearly every night and weekends for 6 months.i also found out about a few guys that were not doing a very good job in my local area so i targeted their work and canvassed and canvassed.i never offered to do them cheaper just asked them were they happy with their current cleaner.i picked up a few then word spread and i picked all their work up plus some more to add to it!!i was well happy!!

i did get them trying to threaten me but when they squared up to me they realised the best thing they could do was get back in their battered old escort and do one!!

i was young and pretty wild.no one was gonna stand in my way of building a round up for myself.i also did this in 2 other areas and again picked up a fair bit of work in a few months.

if you can find people who are really fed up with their window cleaner then there could be a chance for you to get in there and show them there is better cleaners out there!!


best wishes to you all


dazmond

You sound like a dickhead to me. I'm sure you're a great guy, but i'm just going on what you sound like.
Aggresivley targetting someones work is gonna land you in a whole heap of trouble one way or another.
'Aggresive'in this context means 'activley', so how do you do that? Tell them you're better, or cheaper? Heavens no 'cheaper' can;t be an option because everyone knows that 'undercutting' is a big no no , or maybe its not?
Maybe you think being 6 foot plus just seals the deal for you?

Why should targetting work get anyone in trouble, its up to the customer who they use, and if you are offering a better service or better price than their excisting cleaner, why can't you do so?

As far as I know, we work in a free world, their are no unions to join because its a closed shop, all properties and customers are up for grabs, it's only down to how you go after them, that might leave a smell behind.

But if someone wants to target aggressively, then thats up to him, and if your only response to this type of marketing is to attack and beat him, then you don't deserve to walk among free men and women.

[Danny Guest]

I was thinking about this meeting today and I thought I bet the guy with the 'these two big blokes' story was probably the local window cleaner himself trying to frighten me off. Why ask for a quote then tell 'scary tales of mean old windie' kind of makes sense...

Reminds me of when I first started cleaning windows and we used to do the call centres for a big banking group, one of the call centres was massive. It took four lads with 2 reach and washes 2 days to get the outsides done and it was only on two floors. At the back there was woodland and there was a drive htat went up about 1/4 of a mile to this big old mansion where the big bosses of the company worked. This place was fort knocks and when we did the insides we had to have to security guards watch us clean the windows. Anyway this one day the guards started telling me and this other lad how the place was haunted and how sometimes of a night you would he screams from other rooms and this, that and the other. So we finished and went for our lunch in the car with the boss and told him our interesting story to which he turned round and said " You pair of muppets, think about it. It's one of the most secure places in the country, who's going to try and break in of a night if everyone thinks it's haunted. We're some of the only people who know where the place is!!" I felt a right idiot!
 

I have heard this a few times from loyal customers trying to stop me canvassing. Most of the time they are nice people. I joke with them by saying "are you going to work for me when I've taken all your customers" they say things along the lines of "f*** off" or "no chance". There are others who just ignore you but it's all good fun

They either up their game or move over

[davids3511]

I have read the comments and agree and disagree with some points mentioned, but i will give my opinion on the subject.

I have been cleaning windows for roughly 28 years, been running my own business for 22 years and i have NEVER gone looking to take work from other window cleaners, but if a customer is not happy with the service they are recieving then if its around where i am working i will give them a quote.

The difference between window cleaners of years back and window cleaners today seems to be that there has always been an unwritten rule around the north west area, in that we do not go knocking intentionally on other peoples work.

I am currently experiencing this problem myself where someone is knocking on doors which we clean offering to clean their houses for £3.00 (front,back,frames,sills etc).


I have taken exception to this person doing this and i will explain why !

1. Alot of my customers on this work are elderley, and we do not knock on there doors after 4.00pm, as some of them are living alone and are scared - so we know who not to knock.

2. When one of my customers was burgled a few years ago, she told me that when visited by the Police she was asked have you got new window cleaners, which i complained to Manchester Police about as this was a question in my opinion discriminating against window cleaners in general.

I decided to phone this window cleaner who lives in the area in question, warrington, (i did not withold my number, i told him exactly who i was, gave him my name - rather than hide behind my mobile shouting off) and i know who he is, and told him to stop knocking on the doors where i clean, because i am not taking to kindly to recieving complaints from my elderley customers, saying someone has been banging on there doors at 8 at night, then posting flyers.

He couldnt see the problem, at which point i then told him in simple terms to keep away for the work.

30 minutes later Pc plod telephones me saying he's had a complaint saying im going to fill this lad in.

Please tell me then, all you normal thinking window cleaners, not the ones who dont give 2 tosses about anything - how you would deal with someone like this.

I must also point out, that i have alot of friends who are window cleaners and we work alongside eachother as we have similar values and morals.

There are people on this forum that i have given work to and contact details to help build their business up, but i will not have some muppett mithering my customers in that manner without a fight 

At the end if the day, and as irritating as it is, its none of your business. I'd the elderly people feel threatened they need to call plod. They probably have gas and leccy guys calling, rspca, rspcc and many more. Are you going to call them too?

[dazmond]

this was something i did back in 1993 as i needed the work and wanted to get established in my local area.the guys whos work it was were absolute muppets doing a bad job!the customers were glad a young guy had knocked on their door who promised to do a better job!!(and did!)

i would never knowingly canvass a proper window cleaners work.written rule around my way as well.

crap dodgy window cleaners?their work is there for the taking IMO.



regards


dazmond

[TomCrowther]

Archer, I know it's annoying but I don't think there is much you can do {legally} about it. If he was following you round all day, knocking on each customer's door saying I will do it for half his price, there is still nothing you can do. I know lots of guys will say "fill him in" but you won't clean many windows spending 6 months in the "big house" {heard that phrase the other day for the first time in ages}.
You will lose some customers who only buy on price but not many. He will not be around for long.

[sunshine windows]

I've had work of mine canvassed in the past by someone offering to do the whole house for £4 regardless of size and conservatory  :. It dropped to £3 if they couldn't make it on the arranged day.  These jobs varied from £13-£28 monthly and I didn't lose a single customer.

What i'm trying to say is, do a proper job, respect your customers (even if you don't see eye to eye), be polite and curteous and always be reliable and honest i.e. break something in the garden then bloody well own up to it and insist they take the damage of the bill. Follow these guidelines and you can't go wrong.

As for, is it wrong in what the undercutters are doing. Morally in my eyes, yes it is but who gives a stuff. If they're happy working they're nuts off for peanuts then let them burn themselves out. There will always be people out there that think the way to get work is to go in cheap, but people (customers) aren't daft. Most of mine would rather have me as they know and trust me.

[dazmond]

good post sunshine!!

ive had loads of window cleaners knocking my work this year and i havent lost even one customer.keeps me on my toes.never EVER get complacent and take nothing for granted.always provide the best service possible.


best wishes to you all


dazmond

[C o z y]

I've had work of mine canvassed in the past by someone offering to do the whole house for £4 regardless of size and conservatory  :. It dropped to £3 if they couldn't make it on the arranged day.  These jobs varied from £13-£28 monthly and I didn't lose a single customer.

What i'm trying to say is, do a proper job, respect your customers (even if you don't see eye to eye), be polite and curteous and always be reliable and honest i.e. break something in the garden then bloody well own up to it and insist they take the damage of the bill. Follow these guidelines and you can't go wrong.

As for, is it wrong in what the undercutters are doing. Morally in my eyes, yes it is but who gives a stuff. If they're happy working they're nuts off for peanuts then let them burn themselves out. There will always be people out there that think the way to get work is to go in cheap, but people (customers) aren't daft. Most of mine would rather have me as they know and trust me.

Spot on, well put.

ARCHER, how will the guy know which houses are your customers? The whole thing is a non-starter, but I understand how you feel about it. Even though you didn't threaten him, the guy has got a mark against you as far as the police see it. It's all about who got a complaint in about who as far as they are concerned.

[Pro-Poler]

I had a call last week from someone who is upset with me leafleting a area, saying I'm the local window cleaner as I'm not according to him as he hasn't seen me.

When I asked what area he was on about, as I work all over, it turned out to be the estate I live on and have done so for over 20 years, how local do I have to be to be local

Anyway my new 12500 cards are ready to be picked up this week and should be going out next week, as this estate has only just been done I will use it, as a test estate, as these cards are different to the leaflets I normally use and they will be delivered differently.

Last month I picked up 6 new jobs from this estate and 4 came from a local cleaner who is cheaper, but he does a lot of work on the estate and I know a lot of his customers want to move to another cleaner, so let the fun and games begin.

I wouldn't like it if someone turned up on my patch, it's hard enough trying to keep the work you've got

[Pro-Poler]

Ian

I think that daz has a point, I don't know what your areas are like with window cleaners, but some of the guys who work (legally) where I work, give cowboys a bad name, they abuse or are agressive to their customers, don't do a real clean or even clean all the windows etc etc

These cleaners need a reality check and the influx of good cleaners are giving their customers more choises.

I had one joker a few years ago, who thought it was perfectly normal to egg all his customers windows who left him and went to another cleaner, if they were women/ elderly or on their own he would turn up and rant and rave.

You have met me and you know I am a softly, so imagine his shock when I turned up on his doorstep for a quite private chat.

He has now left the trade which is a good thing.

I have egged people who have owed me money, nothing wrong with that

[Danny Guest]

this was something i did back in 1993 as i needed the work and wanted to get established in my local area.the guys whos work it was were absolute muppets doing a bad job!the customers were glad a young guy had knocked on their door who promised to do a better job!!(and did!)

i would never knowingly canvass a proper window cleaners work.written rule around my way as well.

crap dodgy window cleaners?their work is there for the taking IMO.



regards


dazmond

Daz dont regret what you did mate you was being instinctive. You sensed an opportunity and took it. Dont be ashamed mate it got you where you are today and your successful.

Thats what being a business person requires the vision. I go to a street and canvass regardless of who cleans there. if i find out that the other wcs are doing a bad job it motivates me to stay out longer. I never want to be the cheapest if i am cheaper i up my prices and sell myself on quality.

Every street is available to canvass. I do know other wcs and joke with them but if they are competition my business is my primary concern. I pay salaries, mortgage, taxes and overheads so i need to keep expanding.

I have sold a few rounds and i have canvassed on those estates but NEVER on the streets i have sold. I would never take back a customer i have sold unless i bought it back. The reason, i promise anyone who buys from me i wont canvass those streets again. My word is my bond and i can count my reputation on it.

Bottom line is you can do what you want as long as its within the law. You can even undercut and its not illegal although frowned upon. I am looking to build a better business so every round i build gets better pricing but to build those rounds i need to canvas and maybe take customers from other wcs. Business is tough so you do what you have to do. I wouldnt bet against someone doing the same to me. I have my customers canvassed every month but dont lose any. If i did i would question why, if it was on service i would change, if on price i would let them go.

Danny