[Shaun_Ashmore]

Don't forget the staff and premises.

We've had this debate before I don't want to get into that again.

Shaun

[Billy Russell]

I actually agree with Steve on that, my question is why? and as a member what can i do to help change that?

I think many years ago it was a lot harder to promote things on a huge scale( Nationally), but as the internet as grown it will be a lot easier to get the message out there and create public awareness! and the more people on board with this, the easier it becomes, but if you have so many other people out there who knock it, saying it don't mean anything, the hard it is to promote!

Like i said i'm not saying there's not faults, but it takes bums on seats and ideas thrown in the pot to change it!

As the saying goes you can't moan that you don't win the lottery if you don't buy a ticket!!!!

I think thats got some meaning! ( sounded good anyway)  

[wynne jones]

Maybe one day the time will be right for some form of new organisation, who knows.

In the meantime it would be a better use of energy to build up your own business, promote professionalism and high standards through the way you do business and build up your relationship with like minded carpet cleaners you trust. This is a far more flexible and practical approach and just plain works.

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

1 secretary in a 12 x 12 office could deal with membership renewals.

The training course premises are funded by the training fees.

They've had no shortage of money and no shortage of time.

There are anywhere between 10000 and 15000 carpet cleaners in the country if figures are to be believed and they have 500 members.

Just  imagine what a force they could be if they could only tempt 10% of those cleaners to join.

[Billy Russell]

Steve,

Youmake some good points, but like i said you don't know exactly until you get involved and see the incomes and expenditure, I'm not that clued up on it, i've only been a member since october last year!

All my staff think i have a life of luxury, if only they knew what goes in and out! They think well he must get so much for this and i only get this, we should have a pay rise blah blah blah,

truth is they don't know

[creighton foyle]

steve have you included the money they make on training courses ?, the one i was on had over 30 people attending so that one course was about 10k and how many a year do they do ?.

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

It's not a question of casting aspersions as to where the money goes.

I would like to know why it isn't being invested in PR on a national scale.

Raising customer awareness is a win/win scenario for the NCCA

[Billy Russell]

Steve,

Are you coming to the NCCA Carnival?

[Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)]

I would have liked to Billy, but I will be on my honeymoon in Mauritius.

[Billy Russell]

you lucky git!

well for the trip to mauritius anyway!!!


I would like to know these things as well, thats why i intend to go to the next meeting and ask questions, i want to try making difference, and see if i can help

[Simon@arenaclean]

When I was a memeber of the NCCA the exam was an exam. It took the form of questions on various aspects seperately for which a long form answer was expected. There were 3 exams, one for carpet, upholstery and spot and stain treatment. I always accepted that if you could pass all 3 you would have a very good understanding of most aspects of our industry. If it now takes a different form like multiple choice I would be disapointed although I accept I have not been a member for 18 years.

The two biggest hurdles are, public recognition and whether there is an appetite for independent business' to join and put in the effort for development. The first is fundemental but I ask myself does the puplic see carpet cleaning as a 'life or death' industry. Gas Safe or 'Corgi' are recognised as a safe installer of potential hazzardous equipment, as carpet cleaners we know the risks but most of my clients know I have standards based on recommendation, not caring if I know how cellousic browning is caused, I sometimes thing we over estimate our own importance. Yes it's important I know what I'm doing so I can offer my customers the best service possible and joining an organisation that uses multiple choice questions  is no assurance of being competent.

It's a laudible aim to group indendendent company's together but as this and other threads demonstrate, and as others have tried and failed, whilst laudible no one is prepared to pay for it and until WE are resolved to foot the bill and supply the resources in time, effort and money it is a non starter. This is despite our desire to inform about despicable practices like bait and switch and the many other problems our industry is tarnished with. The truth is everyone would join subject to two conditions, it wont cost them much and they wont have to do anything, most do not see the need so most wont support it. There are a few who care enough to keep trying but until we are regulated and standardised nationally there will be little success. Some will see this as being negative but I like to think of it as being realistic. In most things Mike halliday seldom wanders in the wrong direction and it's his approach I would personally endorse, start small and let it grow organically and take people with you. The big problem is informing the public and I'm not sure they care enough either.

quote
"if you want an organisation then just start one, if it has 5 members then so what.... next year it might have 8 members the next year 15 members

why does it need to be big from the start?

why do people have to take on the world, it might be good for your ego to be president of a massive organisation..... but it isn't going to happen.

all you need is for some carpet cleaners to roll up their trouser leg, kiss the chickens bottom and swear an allegiance to work for the common good of all members.... and there it is..... an organisation"

[Andrew Briscoe]

It's not a question of casting aspersions as to where the money goes.

I would like to know why it isn't being invested in PR on a national scale.

Raising customer awareness is a win/win scenario for the NCCA

Steve makes some good points,
the more members the better, i think more regional meetings would be better.
People on here always complain about having to travel long distances to get to venues meetings.
We see loads of complainers on here about 8.99 a carpet etc.
If there where more members, more money would be available to use on PR
therefore more public awareness and less low cost merchants.

Andrew.
ps have a great day on your wedding Steve.

[Billy Russell]

Wll said Andrew, I like the idea of regional meetings, surely it's poss to put these forward to the board at the carnival

[happy mondays]

Pay No Money

Get Loads of Press PR

Advertising on Radio ?TV

Training resources on line at no cost

THe Important thing is NO COST

 

What about offering cover for holidays and sickness, free book keeping, free baby sitting service, free servicing and repairs on your van and extraction machine 

It was fun reading most of the posts from the tacca thread 

I might be wrong but the feeling I got from some posts was that some want to pay a small fee for an association or "franchise" that will market their business and get them loads of work.  Its very easy for anyone to say my business isnt where I want it because the association or franchise isnt doing enough.

Whats  really funny though, some people who say these associations mean nothing and slate them but they actually advertise that they have been trained by them, and even have links to the associations websites  but dont pay to join 

No association or franchise will ever run your business for you, they wont make you rich, they are just a tool to help you on your way. The more people that join them will raise customer awareness and by becoming a member it is your job to promote it, this in its self makes any association bigger and of more benefit to a business and a consumer.

Building and maintaining a profitable business is down to you and no-one else.  No one is perfect and no exam, paid membership or training in carpet cleaning or any other industry will make someone faultless and the very best in what they do. 

Imo the ncca can only be a good thing for someone wanting to earn a living by cleaning carpets, the more that pay the couple of hundred £'s to join and promote it can only make it bigger and better for all.

[derek west]

Pay No Money

Get Loads of Press PR

Advertising on Radio ?TV

Training resources on line at no cost

THe Important thing is NO COST

 

What about offering cover for holidays and sickness, free book keeping, free baby sitting service, free servicing and repairs on your van and extraction machine 

It was fun reading most of the posts from the tacca thread 

I might be wrong but the feeling I got from some posts was that some want to pay a small fee for an association or "franchise" that will market their business and get them loads of work.  Its very easy for anyone to say my business isnt where I want it because the association or franchise isnt doing enough.

Whats  really funny though, some people who say these associations mean nothing and slate them but they actually advertise that they have been trained by them, and even have links to the associations websites  but dont pay to join 
No association or franchise will ever run your business for you, they wont make you rich, they are just a tool to help you on your way. The more people that join them will raise customer awareness and by becoming a member it is your job to promote it, this in its self makes any association bigger and of more benefit to a business and a consumer.

Building and maintaining a profitable business is down to you and no-one else.  No one is perfect and no exam, paid membership or training in carpet cleaning or any other industry will make someone faultless and the very best in what they do. 

Imo the ncca can only be a good thing for someone wanting to earn a living by cleaning carpets, the more that pay the couple of hundred £'s to join and promote it can only make it bigger and better for all.

guessing thats a cheap shot at me paul.

don't understand it though, the ncca has 2 sides, training and being an organisation, i think they do the training well, i'd be a fool not to promote on my website that i have certificates which i paid bloody good money for. i know for a fact that my customers have never heard of the ncca but i know for a fact that they know what a certificate means.

[jim mca]

Having only been in this industry for 1 year trained at cleansmart 3 days Im not going to do
another basic cource so I can join the ncca now if they have a cource that can take me to another
level then fine count me in. The real business we are in is sales and marketing as everybody on hear
is a business owner alot of national companies prefer to deal with one supplier and thats what I
think the franchises have over independent carpet cleaners as its easier to sell with your foot in
the door this forum has a lot of great people with a lot to give from website designers, sales profesionals
and Quality carpet cleaners but its about pulling together to make it better for us. I joined the FSB as soon
as I started as I get value for money and I can network at local meetings with like minded people. 

[happy mondays]

No dont do cheap digs Derek, if I am honest, which I am   I had noticed you promote that you have passed the exam and find it frustrating as a member that your web design company put a link on your site that could implie to a potential customer that you are associated with this association because you have passed the exam. Even though in some peoples eyes, means nothing at all really   Just interested to know if it means nothing to your customers who have never heard of them, your logic in promoting the ncca. Imo the small cost of membership is very reasonable for what you can get from it.
  

[Simon Gerrard]

The problem with Associations is that everyone wants it to do what they want it to do. Some are just happy being able to advertise that they are a member of an association because they believe that  it gives them some extra kudos. Others want work from it and if they don't get an immediate return on their money, won't renew their membership. Some think they should be promoting the industry. The trouble is the VAST majority of professional carpet cleaners don't see a need to be a part of any association so the NCCA or any other Association can't grow to the size required to really make a difference, but then to really make a difference you need a collective will and there just isn't that in the CC industry.

Simon

[derek west]

No dont do cheap digs Derek, if I am honest, which I am   I had noticed you promote that you have passed the exam and find it frustrating as a member that your web design company put a link on your site that could implie to a potential customer that you are associated with this association because you have passed the exam. Even though in some peoples eyes, means nothing at all really   Just interested to know if it means nothing to your customers who have never heard of them, your logic in promoting the ncca. Imo the small cost of membership is very reasonable for what you can get from it.
  

like i said paul, i paid good money (to the ncca, money in there bank) for a certificate, and people know what a certificate means so i'd be mad not to promote it, and in a way i'm helping the ncca get recognised. i'm not a member and don't promote that so don't see the problem. ive done 2 courses with the ncca so ive paid a lot to them. personally i think your grief should be with people that have not paid any money into the ncca kitty and still mention there name on trhere website.
i'm not doing anything wrong. ive paid my money, got a certificate and i'm marketing that certificate to my customers.

anyway, join TACCA, its free
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=168506547806

[Joe H]

Wll said Andrew, I like the idea of regional meetings, surely it's poss to put these forward to the board at the carnival

Billy
Up until last year (at least) the NCCA welcomed regional roadshows, hoping that a member would help find a suitable venue to hold it ie some social club etc

In 2009 I went to one in Shrewsbury, 3 different speakers during the day, reasonable well attended.

I was impressed, so I offered my services to find a place in Warrington which would be suitable for those travelling from throughout the North West, North Midlands, Merseyside, North Wales, West Yorkshire - potentially covering a massive catchement area.
Apart from finding a suitable place and making provisional arrangements there was no other work or costs for me, the NCCA office did the rest.
Cost was £30 including buffet lunch. Non NCCA members were welcome.
It was mentioned on here and another forum.
Total number that turned up was disappointing, but at least an opportunity was given for c/cleaners to attend and support the aims of the NCCA.

Maybe Billy (and other members), the NCCA is still open to members helping out in this small way.

I wish the NCCA Carnival day a great success. Well worth the effort and I hope many more members will be the result, and hopefully the local press will be able to cover the event.