[Pristine Clean]

Hi guys,

For those that do commercial cleaning on larger contracts. Do any of you ask for a deposit upfront like a months payment or a few months?

Just wondered as when you take on new staff on large contracts if the cleaning staff have been there for like 20 years thats a lot of redundancy pay.

We have been asked this morning to quote for a large building. They have existing cleaners direct employed by them. But we need to take them on under TUPE. Now they have been there for over 20 years.

What worries me is that we take them on, and the thought that has ocurred to me is that they could after a month or so say to us Terminate our contract. Then we have to find the redundancy money for these cleaners.

Thats now 3 large quotes we are going through in the space of a few days. Thing maybe picking up.

Dave

[Robert Parry]

Hi Dave,

Before submitting your quote, you should obtain all the required information relating to the transfer, this, in this case should be very easy, as the cleaners being transferred are employed directly.

Once, you have the information, your costs should reflect any liability that you may face in the future.

If you are at all unsure, obtain information from your accountant and your HR rep.

We deal with this on a regular basis, as most clients are PLC's, getting this wrong in any shape or form could seriously damage your wealth!

I dont know the size of the company that you are engaged in quoting for, but I would also advise running an advanced credit check on them and any subsidary or holding company. This will give you a very good idea on their current financial staus, some companies, large and small will bend the rules without a second thought in order to lessen their own liabilities.

As for asking them to pay a deposit, or pay upfront, I doubt it very much!

You also need to ensure that your contract and terms and conditions are rock solid, not got off the net, not even bought of the net, these documents need to be drawn up by professionals, who know what they are doing.

This, will of course, mean a large investment, but once you get to a certain stage in your companies growth, it is a very neccessary expense.

The fact that they have directly employed their own cleaners for the last 20 years, now they are looking to outscource, could mean a couple of things, I suggest that you approach with caution, and with your eyes wide open.

Regards,

Rob

[Pristine Clean]

Hi Rob,

Thanks for the detailed reply. Yes we are trying to get all the facts accross. We have dealt with this many times before but not on such a larger scale.

So as its on a larger scale there is alot more risk involved financially.

So yes we are taking our time on this as although we want to grow the company we do not want to grow too quickly beyond our resources.

Cheers

Dave

[cml]

Just to add a few more pointers on top of useful advice already given. 

Not sure if this is a PLC, LTD , private or public organisation but I would add that a copy of their published accounts be reviewed alongside all the other checks you carry out. 
You may also want to consider trying to negotiate  a fixed period by which your contract cannot be terminated i.e. within the 1st year of transfer.

Remember some companies use outsourcing as a way of trying to avoid redundancy payments.  On the otherhand it could be a part of their business that places a burden on their current resources. In these cases they find it would be of benefit and  huge savings if these works were outsourced. 


Not all doom and gloom but a slow YES rather than a fast NO!! GOOD LUCK

[Pristine Clean]

CML,

Thanks for the reply.

Yes we were in negotiation late this afternoon about a fixed term.

This has already crossed my mind many times
"Remember some companies use outsourcing as a way of trying to avoid redundancy payments." 

Not to sure if I understand this part.

If this part places a burden on their resources, how does out sourcing make it easier. Do you mean the management of the cleaning itself.

On the otherhand it could be a part of their business that places a burden on their current resources.

How would they save here? They are paying, employing direct so if we come in to manage the site we would be more expensive as we have to pay the wages plus pay our profit etc. 

Or do you mean that the TIME Management resources ie over seeing the cleaning schedule here?

In these cases they find it would be of benefit and  huge savings if these works were outsourced. 


cheers

Dave

[Robert Parry]

Hi Dave,

Under TUPE regulations, ALL staff liabilities pass to the incoming contractor, holiday pay, any employee claims etc.

Outscourcing the cleaning will in effect, nullify your customer from any and all of these costs.

Regards,

Rob

[Pristine Clean]

Hi Rob,


At present we are harmonising the T&Cs and TUPE

We are considering

•the customer might renew the contract with us;
• the customer might switch contractors to a new contractor;
• the customer might decide to take the service back in-house; or
• the customer’s need for the contractor’s services might cease

So we are looking at alternatives such as the client will re-employ them again direct or included in the cost a fund for the reduindancies if it was to arise. Or is no reduncies the client can have back the fund.

Many many things to consider

Dave