[paulscotney]

Good advice

[matt]

ive said it before

get a vent in the roof of your van, all the gear ( inc a electric jigsaw if you dont own 1 ) for under 30 quid , thats the vent, the sealant, the whole lot

The vent in the roof will remove the hot exhaust gases, but as paulscotney rightly says - gas is heavier than air so you need to fit a 'drop vent' (a vent under the boiler) to remove escaping gas.

 

it will help ventilate the van thats for sure

[Nathanael Jones]

I've 3 vents in the roof of my van,... and about 20 holes in the floor!

[Dave Turley]

NWH why, just because you now have a nice 3k "safe" heater, do you feel the need to get on the backs of all the people who went along with your l5/cheap hot water ideas?

I for one have told my insurance that I have a propane water heater in my van and am carrying a gas bottle and they said "not a problem-carry on"

also, my mate is a corgi heating engineer. he's had a look at my heater and says whilst the fitting isn't up to BUILDING REGULATIONS, there is nothing dangerous about it.

my conscience is feeling pretty clear at present.

[Nathanael Jones]

I was also very interested to see in reply 7 on this thread (Thanks Chris) that you don't even need a Corgi installer for this kind of setup!!! Although just for my own peace of mind I'd always recommend using one.

[chrisyg]

NWH why, just because you now have a nice 3k "safe" heater, do you feel the need to get on the backs of all the people who went along with your l5/cheap hot water ideas?

I for one have told my insurance that I have a propane water heater in my van and am carrying a gas bottle and they said "not a problem-carry on"

also, my mate is a corgi heating engineer. he's had a look at my heater and says whilst the fitting isn't up to BUILDING REGULATIONS, there is nothing dangerous about it.

my conscience is feeling pretty clear at present.

who is your insurance?  Ive heard A Plan are ok with these, but it depends on what they have been told. like of the system is left alone when in operation etc.

Personally i dont see a problem using it, i just want to make sure on the insurance side it wont be a problem, so i can go ready to an insurer with all the info behind me.

[David Slater]

I was also very interested to see in reply 7 on this thread (Thanks Chris) that you don't even need a Corgi installer for this kind of setup!!! Although just for my own peace of mind I'd always recommend using one.

Did DIY wfp cold systems get this sort of ctisism when they first appeared? 

[chris@c.m.s]

I was also very interested to see in reply 7 on this thread (Thanks Chris) that you don't even need a Corgi installer for this kind of setup!!! Although just for my own peace of mind I'd always recommend using one.

Did DIY wfp cold systems get this sort of ctisism when they first appeared? 

Probably not the former promotes health and safety,  the latter makes a mockery out of it  :

[NWH]

I only had it in my van for a few weeks and not a day went by when i wasn`t worried about it being there,good luck to those that have it in there van.I took mine out after advise from guy`s that know what there on about and nagging from the Mrs,it`s so easy for so called freinds to say naah that`s alright in there mate but they havn`t got it in there van have they.I think the fact that it`s risky has crossed everyones mind if there honest.

[tomy jackson]

its not rescay if put it rite 

[RSWindows]

These systems can be installed correctly and safely, and in a way that will keep your insurance company happy,... if you do some research and know what you are doing.

I fail to see the major difference between Gas & Diesel powered systems. There is still heat/flame/ignition etc. A diesel leak is just as risky as a gas leak! An incorrectly installed diesel powered heater is also deadly!

But, you're on a mission NWH, and you'll continue to make sweeping generalisations about all gas systems no matter what I say.
I'm going to quit replying to these threads when you get involved.

I always thought diesel needed to be compressed before being able to combust? I didn't think you could set light to it from just a flame, like you do with petrol.

Diesel cannot be lit with a naked flame unless it has a wick in which to burn, for instance diesel on a rag would burn just as well as petrol would but your right it does have a higher temperature rate of combustion...hence diesel engines having glow plugs, or coils instead of spark plugs.

[NWH]

Saying diesel heaters are dangerous is just provoking argument,i don`t like to do that lol.

[David Slater]

These systems can be installed correctly and safely, and in a way that will keep your insurance company happy,... if you do some research and know what you are doing.

I fail to see the major difference between Gas & Diesel powered systems. There is still heat/flame/ignition etc. A diesel leak is just as risky as a gas leak! An incorrectly installed diesel powered heater is also deadly!

But, you're on a mission NWH, and you'll continue to make sweeping generalisations about all gas systems no matter what I say.
I'm going to quit replying to these threads when you get involved.

I always thought diesel needed to be compressed before being able to combust? I didn't think you could set light to it from just a flame, like you do with petrol.

Diesel cannot be lit with a naked flame unless it has a wick in which to burn, for instance diesel on a rag would burn just as well as petrol would but your right it does have a higher temperature rate of combustion...hence diesel engines having glow plugs, or coils instead of spark plugs.

chrisyg,

Diesel DOES NOT need a wick to combust.

"Without sufficient heat, a fire cannot begin, and it cannot continue. Heat can be removed by dousing with water; the water turns to steam and the steam is further heated, taking the heat with it. Introducing particles of powder or any gas in the flame remove heat in the same manner. Separating burning fuels from each other also reduce the heat. Turning off the electricity in an electrical fire removes the ignition source. "

"Diesel is designed for use in a high-compression engine. Air is compressed until it has been heated above the autoignition temperature of diesel; then the fuel is injected as a high-pressure spray, keeping the fuel-air mix within the flammable limits of diesel. There is no ignition source. Therefore, diesel is required to have a high flash point and a low autoignition temperature.

Diesel flash points vary between 126°F and 204°F (52°C-96°C/WJ)."

The 'flash point' is the state at which Diesel will 'flash burn' (ignite/explode) without an outside source of fuel (wick).

NWH - I'll keep replying to this thread if you can come up with sound logic/reason beyond "my mate down the pub said it was bad"....

Your theory is flawed.

Your grasp of H&S is flawed.

You have bought a 3k diesel system...... Good for you  

SHOW ME where it says gas is any more (or less dangerous) than using diesel?

You can use ANY site. ANY reference. ANY Regulation.

I will throw down the gauntlet right now - you WILL NOT find a single source that says or shows diesel to be safer/less dangerous than LPG as long as it is properly controlled.



Prove me wrong NWH - wheres you're evidence?

  

[NWH]

Keep grafting and 1 day you`ll be able to get a proper 1 lol,if you keep coming up with rubbish so will i.Dear insurance company i have an outside shower heater hanging on the back door of my van or sometimes in the van itself with hardly any ventillation,i intend to use this daily connected to a gas bottle within bombing distance of the public hope this is ok,yours truthfully ide ott.

[David Slater]

Keep grafting and 1 day you`ll be able to get a proper 1 lol,if you keep coming up with rubbish so will i.Dear insurance company i have an outside shower heater hanging on the back door of my van or sometimes in the van itself with hardly any ventillation,i intend to use this daily connected to a gas bottle within bombing distance of the public hope this is ok,yours truthfully ide ott.

So thats it?

Thats what you're basing your purchase on?

So what if I said Diesel was dangerous?....You wouldnt listen to me because somebody was selling a system and by virtue, that must be better? And because I'm not  selling you something my thoughts must be wrong?


Havent we already been down this road with Inonics v DIY set-ups.....and Inoics was found to be wanting?

If you'd like to enter into a full discusssion of the pro's and con's of Gas/Diesel please feel free.

I have researched this topic enough to know what I'm talking about 




......HAVE YOU? what are your sources of reference?


I have no axe to grind. I have no product to sell. I have everybodys best interest at heart.

Why rubbish another way if you dont have the knowledge to back it up with fact?

PROVE to me what I'm saying is wrong.

[RSWindows]

David just in case i wasnt too clear in my post i never said that diesel simply just wont ignite unless it has a rag or wick, i wasnt wanting to go too much into it but the wick is what burns which in turn steadily heat the diesel to its ignition temp and walla! 

Put a spark to diesel it wont go boom, put a lighter onto diesel it wont go boom but under the right circumstances its every bit as deadly.

[David Slater]

David just in case i wasnt too clear in my post i never said that diesel simply just wont ignite unless it has a rag or wick, i wasnt wanting to go too much into it but the wick is what burns which in turn steadily heat the diesel to its ignition temp and walla! 

Put a spark to diesel it wont go boom, put a lighter onto diesel it wont go boom but under the right circumstances its every bit as deadly.

RSwindows,

I hear what you're saying, but from a H&S viewpoint Diesel has certain issues that gas doesnt - namely it is carcinogenic

It is combustible liquid (otherwise it would be useless as a fuel!!) so it must have a 'flash point'

It MUST be controlled. An engine working on diesel must by virtue of the fact it is running diesel have a temp high enough to cause 'flash point'....what temp is the exhaust from that system? Enough to cause 'flash point'?...most likely the answer is yes.

Gas has a low 'flash point' but this can be adequatley controlled by drop vents and User Checks/Instruction/Toolbox talks/Fire Action Plans etc etc etc..



If NWH thinks he can avoid these measures by "buyng a system" he is sorely mistaken!

Gas is no more dangerous than diesel as long as proper controls are put in place.
 

[NWH]

David later, I think that’s his point. The proper controls are not in place.

Justification, knowledge and kidding yourself are not proper controls.

Ewan i could kiss you lol.

[RSWindows]

Gas is no more dangerous than diesel as long as proper controls are put in place.
 

definately, just be sure for your own sake and that of others that all reasonable steps are being taken to minimize risk

[NWH]

Gas is no more dangerous than diesel lol,if i lit a match right next to a gas leak and a match next to a diesel leak which would you choose,doh.