[carlton care]

Good morning one and all.

Some time ago I posted my thoughts on the likeliehood of Training Standards being introduced and how it might affect the industry.

Recent, or current events rather highlight the need for such standards and are likely to speed up the process, if it has started, or being looked at, which is almost certainly the case.

Unlike the majority of trades or services, this industry is unregulated, which most like, but the reality is, we are living in an age of litigation, with people realising and not being shy about raising claims, if anything goes wrong.

What has to be considered and considered very seriously, is the fact that we are dealing with items which have a high value, whether to repair, or replace and it's very easy to get it wrong !

Personally, I have often taken chances, by using products which I knew to be risky, but only when I also knew how to control the outcome..............I HAVE NEVER HAD A DISASTER, BUT MAYBE I'VE JUST BEEN LUCKY !



I had a much longer post but have accidentally deleted the bulk of it

[RAM Cleaning]

Unfortunetly the whole of the cleaning industry is unregulated not just carpet cleaning, and that may be a good thing or a bad thing...who knows, but you will find there are also may other high risk industrys that are also unregulated.

I just sold my bouncy castle business and there are no laws what soever regarding that industry, just HSE guidlines.  As carpet cleaners you still have to follow HSE guidelines to avoid accidents, but you can simply go out buy a machine and start charging custys for cleaning, wheter you know what you are doing or not.

By putting in regulations you put up the cost of starting a business which then gets put onto the customer, if you then have to charge £100 to clean a carpet that cost £100, i think most customers would just have the damn thing replaced.
At the end of the day it is very unlikely that a badly cleaned carpet is going to kill someone, where a badly wired house definetly has the potential to harm or kill someone.

Just my thoughts, keep the industry unregulated as it is, but maybe HSE should d someting to remind people of the obligations on the Helath and safety at work act

[Ken Wainwright]

The NCCA, with help and support from much of our industry, have sponsored a Publicly Available Standard (P.A.S.) for carpet cleaning. The work has been completed and, for reasons unknown to me, we are all waiting for The British Standards Institute (B.S.I.) to complete their part of this project. After a couple of years or so, if BSI feel that this document is creditable (my words, not theirs) they will "promote it" to full BSI accreditation.  It could then possibly br further promoted to an ISO.

The P.A.S. is not a word for word training manual. It is a proceedural document laying out all of the requirements for all generic systems from initial survey, through testing, , dry soil removal, pre-treatment etc. etc.

Once this document has been released, all interested parties will have access to information, so will then know what's required of a carpet cleaner. In the case of problems or complaint, there will be less opportunity for BS.  It is anticipated that insurers, manufacturers, facilities managers, trading standards and other government agencies et al will take this on document onboard.

OK, it isn't  quite the answer to carlton care's question, but it is a step in the right direction.

Safe and happy cleaning
Ken

[carlton care]

Thanks for that Ken

As I mentioned, I deleted a lot of typing !!!!!!!which I'm slow at.

I'd suggested that the NCCA and BICS are the two organisations who should become the Training Providers for the industry. Ideally the NCCA but I know the current set up would probably have to be radicalised to do so.

Problem is, there are predators galore out there and training is very lucrative, so it's quite possible that some " on the ball " organisation is already knocking on doors.

I hate formality and am not myself of a compliant nature, but the industry would benefit in terms of credibility, uniformity, and elimination of stetson wearers.

Off to the dreaded Ikea

robert m

[liahona]

If this happens which is a good idea, what will happen to all the "dry" cleaners?

If proper guide lines are instigated then the systems will not pass any standards put in place.

Bring it on I say.

The guide lines from most manufacturers allready say that dry systems shouldnt be used to "clean".  Wouldnt it be great that the industry would finally put this info into some sort of regulations.

Sadly this will never happen but it should,

Best, Dave.

P.S.  At least we can now discuss something that should be banned.........

[Barry Livingstone]

Think HOST might say different dave, but i no where your comming from.

[Ian Gourlay]

What i am concerned about is

When  I was on IIRC site

In America some carpet manufactures are insisting on Truck Mount only cleaning

Others indicate a Rug doctor will do



I am all for Codes of Ethics etc but you will always have people pushing the boundaries flying close to wind saying they abide by them as part of their marketing and use the most unscruplious methods . Evidence is usually Grey so no action taken.

So I am ME using My Standards Giving Customers Best Service I can Offering Genuine Guarantees including refunds.  Keeping in regular contact with local Trading Standards etc

  

[Jim_77]

....you can simply go out buy a machine and start charging custys for cleaning, wheter you know what you are doing or not.

Very true, and is a major industry problem.

By putting in regulations you put up the cost of starting a business..

Which would be a good thing, wouldn't it?  Only those serious about doing it properly would invest the higher amount in a new start-up, rather than some joker and his George getting into it for a couple of hundred quid invested.

which then gets put onto the customer, if you then have to charge £100 to clean a carpet that cost £100, i think most customers would just have the damn thing replaced.

New regs aren't going to make our running costs double overnight so that wouldn't be the case, would it?  I already quote prices to people who reel in shock and say they could replace their carpet for that price.  They're the pikeys that we don't work for!

At the end of the day it is very unlikely that a badly cleaned carpet is going to kill someone, where a badly wired house definetly has the potential to harm or kill someone.

Just my thoughts, keep the industry unregulated as it is

You're making an argument in favour of cowboy cleaners here.  In both cases the customer is being ripped off.

The focus of this subject is protecting consumers, NOT how lazy carpet cleaners can avoid hassle.  If you're serious about running a business in this industry you should welcome something like this.

If you can show some proper credentials to potential customers, something that really tells them you're a bona fide business, I think that's going to be a massive help in winning jobs at decent prices and scaring people away from the low-priced cowboys.

[RAM Cleaning]

there are arguements for and against, and i can see where you are coming from, but sometimes when regulations are put in those that do the training for the regulations, put up training prices to stupid amounts, its fine if you have several companies doing the training because they have competition.


With regards to starting up its ok to say that the serious people would invest more, but some people just don't have the capital like others, so they may chose to go down the road of buying a used machine at half the price to a new one.  Others may chose to take out loans to get going, personally i had very little invest and built up from there.

I don't beleive im making an agrument for cowboys, just seeing both sides of the coin, regulations are good in most instances, but it can narrow down your options in the way you do things sometimes, as Ian has said

In America some carpet manufactures are insisting on Truck Mount only cleaning

Others indicate a Rug doctor will do
 

It is usually some idiot that has no clue on the industry that brings in regulations, my concern is that something along the lines of truckmounts only, eco products only or no dry cleaning will come into force. 

Consumers are protected, and they have always been protected through trading standards, but if they chose someone who is not reputable wheter regulations are there or not they wont be protected, Wheter regs are in place or not you will always get the splash and dash brigade, but something to disguish the good CC's from the bad ones is a good idea.

As i said it was just my thoughts, its not about being lazy its about being practical, and good regulations would be a good thing, i just don't want to see this industry become to restrictive and stop the creativity of new products and ideas

Richard