[NWH]

The only way to get off the ladder as far as WC goes is to prove to the customer that it does as good a job if not better,that`s the only way your gonna convince them.A couple of custies said to me at the start the proof is in the pudding,they have made no comment since.Mine wouldn`t put up with a rubbish job so them saying nothing is good enough for me,and there are other WCS they could go to if they wanted to.

[tonyoliver]

the shop was called stiches  an accodent waiting to happen ?

[Neil271052]

Neil271052, You sound like a guy who thinks the invention of the wheel was OK, but we'd've been fine without it Ladders have their place, but wfp HAS been invented and no amount of bullsh*t spouted can convince me that it's not better to clean windows standing on your feet rather than standing on a ladder.

Not at all, I'm all for new technology but I don't think ladders are as frightening as some make out. It is no hardship to me and is in fact very good exercise(the only exercise I get bar walking the dog  )

I am a trad WCer and although I could easily afford go over to WFP I choose not to, I've seen them pulling their hoses around the garden.

Actually I have picked up quite a few jobs from customers who had WCers go over to WFP and they didn't like it,

"saturates all my frames, water running down the walls etc etc."

Now I know that in the right hands a WFP is an excellent tool but my customers like the personal touch and are willing to pay for it.

So that is how I will carry on in the foreseeable future.

[DASERVICES]

Quote - "saturates all my frames, water running down the walls etc etc."


I just say to them so when it starts raining you run outside and try and deflect all that rain that runs down your frames and walls, or do you have a phobia of water.


That solves the problem as they realise they have a phobia of wfp

[Sir Squeaky]

Quote - "saturates all my frames, water running down the walls etc etc."


I just say to them so when it starts raining you run outside and try and deflect all that rain that runs down your frames and walls, or do you have a phobia of water.


That solves the problem as they realise they have a phobia of wfp

Since when does your house get saturated walls from rain? :

Most of it is shielded by the eaves or roof.
You get far more water everywhere with wfp.

[Adam Boss]

Neil, you can't make any comments on here against WFP, they won't like you for it.
I use WFP but only as and when needed because it's a tool, I much prefere to Trad cos it's a lot less hastle and gives better results. When the glass is left wet you can't see if the glass has a good finish. What with spots, runs, water left on paths and in winter it could freeze which is another hazaed , it goes on and on.
With Trad the glass is left dry and you see the end results.
Alot of WFP guys go for quantity and don't care too much about quality.
Ladders are safe if used as they should be ! and it annoys me when guys who have never used ladders slag them off .
WFP bring problems which keeps this forum going and trad means you do the job pack up and go home giving a great finish whether the frames are upvc, wood, aluminium oxidized or whatever.
Rant over.
Regards to all.
 

[DASERVICES]

Quote "Since when does your house get saturated walls from rain?"

The side of the house that does not have a gutter will always be saturated by rain, it is more noticeable in winter where you will see the walls are wet.

Also I was concerned of wet patches on the walls below the sill and thought it was wfp, until I noticed it on houses which were done by trad also had this.

Yes wfp does leave a small amount of water but compared to the rain we have had this year it is like a bucket in an ocean.

[windowwashers]

Neil271052, You sound like a guy who thinks the invention of the wheel was OK, but we'd've been fine without it Ladders have their place, but wfp HAS been invented and no amount of bullsh*t spouted can convince me that it's not better to clean windows standing on your feet rather than standing on a ladder.

Not at all, I'm all for new technology but I don't think ladders are as frightening as some make out. It is no hardship to me and is in fact very good exercise(the only exercise I get bar walking the dog  )

I am a trad WCer and although I could easily afford go over to WFP I choose not to, I've seen them pulling their hoses around the garden.

Actually I have picked up quite a few jobs from customers who had WCers go over to WFP and they didn't like it,

"saturates all my frames, water running down the walls etc etc."

Now I know that in the right hands a WFP is an excellent tool but my customers like the personal touch and are willing to pay for it.

So that is how I will carry on in the foreseeable future.

Hi Neil, they were the same things I thought till i had a car crash last year that nearly killed me, made me think quite hard I have three kids that need me and a wife that spends money like it is going out of fashion, going up and down a ladder however good you think you are is dangerous you are on a waiting list to fall same as me and anyone using ladders however careful you think you are, one mistake one moving stone one slip, this is all it takes then can be game over, I have been looking at wfp for years now, first it came out all ladders are going to be banned, looked right into that (seems it was started by companies just trying to sell systems (worked great as it scared poeple into it) I looked right into it and funny enough it was a complete lie, ladders are getting banned etc. after a year or more i looked again and was put off again, I am now buying a van system (why) because I value my family and is 1000% safer than using a ladder, and at the end of the day will also make more money, thats the whole point of working in the first place, as for personal touch I will always give this to every customer I clean or my guys, yes people are going to say certain things about the change as alot do not like change, but if explained to them correctly they cant have a problem with it, I do not at the mo clean frames unless they pay extra for it ( i am trad to m8) when i go to wfp this will be done everytime so frames will get wet, anyone saying i dont like them getting wet is a little silly really as the rain will make them wet even if the roof covers some of it, rain changes direction  : I am guessing the jobs you picked up from wfp companies was either becuase they did not take the time to explain to the customer the benifits and safety issues or they just did not do the job correctly. When I start all will get a 100% guarantee as we do with any work we do.

hope you see the point I am making, your safety is most important 

Ladders are safe if used as they should be ! and it annoys me when guys who have never used ladders slag them off .
WFP bring problems which keeps this forum going and trad means you do the job pack up and go home giving a great finish whether the frames are upvc, wood, aluminium oxidized or whatever.
Rant over.
Regards to all.
 

Ladders are safe if they are on your van/car as soon as you take a step off the floor the safe issue goes out the window so to speak, I use them every day doing trad window cleaning (they are not safe and our bodies are not made for impact when falling off them for many many reasons some people fall off ladders that is through no fault of there own " a push bike can hit them a dog can jump up etc that list is endless, so safe I have to totally disagree there sry.

[Tosh]

Squeaks makes a point here of saying you have to be 'careless' to fall off, which to me indicates 'stupid' to fall off.

I used ladders for 9 years with no problems, and so do many others.
Of course it matters how careful you are.
You'd have to be pretty careless to fall off. :

But in another post Squeaks says:

When I did them off a ladder they scared the poo out of me.
They're pretty high with sloping gardens.

(Full text of post here:  http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=42414.20#msg337843)

So my question is, if Squeaks - an (ex) ladder user is 'poo scared' when using his ladder on certain jobs, how careful can he have used it?

(Sorry to pick on you, Rog, I'm just using you as the typical example of an (now ex) over-confident ladder-only user)

[windowwashers]

Squeaks makes a point here of saying you have to be 'careless' to fall off, which to me indicates 'stupid' to fall off.

I used ladders for 9 years with no problems, and so do many others.
Of course it matters how careful you are.
You'd have to be pretty careless to fall off. :

But in another post Squeaks says:

When I did them off a ladder they scared the poo out of me.
They're pretty high with sloping gardens.

(Full text of post here:  http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=42414.20#msg337843)

So my question is, if Squeaks - an (ex) ladder user is 'poo scared' when using his ladder on certain jobs, how careful can he have used it?

(Sorry to pick on you, Rog, I'm just using you as the typical example of an (now ex) over-confident ladder-only user)

Hes off the waiting list to fall and fair play to him, I myself try and be as careful as i can, My m8 son broke his back a couple of years ago falling he was 23, so me thinks squeaks made a very good choice 

[Tosh]

I still regularly use a ladder; I climbed one four times today; but I promise you, I was extremely carefull every time, more so since I don't climb it so much these days.

Shame they're wobbly B & Q ladders; but they fit on my estate nicely!

I know, I know!

[windowwashers]

I still regularly use a ladder; I climbed one four times today; but I promise you, I was extremely carefull every time, more so since I don't climb it so much these days.

Shame they're wobbly B & Q ladders; but they fit on my estate nicely!

I know, I know!

im guessing you are not insured then, you may want to check with insurance if they cover domestic ladders for trade work 

[Steve Weatherley]

What a load of old sh**e. Do your thing, whether it be poles or ladders. Mind yer own business and stop slagging off other systems.
I use wfp but I say live and let live. If it weren't for the traditional ladder using window cleaner what would we have done years ago?

[kevinc]

  was working in leeds last summer,in some back to back terraces where this trad wc was flying around the houses-gave me the inspiration.i wondered how the hell he could clean those windows at what i'd call stupid angles(not steep enough for me)i watched him for over 1/2 hour and i sussed it,he had some timber ladders with a steel spikes sticking out from the bottom of the ladders and he stuck them in the tarmac outside the houses he cleaned (he'd pre-drilled holes into the tarmac path)no slipping the whole footpaths were littered with two foot wide holes all over-thats clever

[windowwashers]

was working in leeds last summer,in some back to back terraces where this trad wc was flying around the houses-gave me the inspiration.i wondered how the hell he could clean those windows at what i'd call stupid angles(not steep enough for me)i watched him for over 1/2 hour and i sussed it,he had some timber ladders with a steel spikes sticking out from the bottom of the ladders and he stuck them in the tarmac outside the houses he cleaned (he'd pre-drilled holes into the tarmac path)no slipping the whole footpaths were littered with two foot wide holes all over-thats clever

Cant see my customers going for the holes in tarmac thing, but fair play to the guy, least he works safe as he can

[Neil271052]

me things I thought till i had a car crash last year that nearly killed me, made me think quite hard I have three kids that need me and a wife that spends money like it is going out of fashion, going up and down a ladder however good you think you are is dangerous you are on a waiting list to fall same as me and anyone using ladders however careful you think you are, one mistake one moving stone one slip, this is all it takes then can be game over, I have been looking at wfp for years now, first it came out all ladders are going to be banned, looked right into that (seems it was started by companies just trying to sell systems (worked great as it scared poeple into it) I looked right into it and funny enough it was a complete lie, ladders are getting banned etc. after a year or more i looked again and was put off again, I am now buying a van system (why) because I value my family and is 1000% safer than using a ladder, and at the end of the day will also make more money, thats the whole point of working in the first place, as for personal touch I will always give this to every customer I clean or my guys, yes people are going to say certain things about the change as alot do not like change, but if explained to them correctly they cant have a problem with it, I do not at the mo clean frames unless they pay extra for it ( i am trad to m8) when i go to wfp this will be done everytime so frames will get wet, anyone saying i dont like them getting wet is a little silly really as the rain will make them wet even if the roof covers some of it, rain changes direction  : I am guessing the jobs you picked up from wfp companies was either becuase they did not take the time to explain to the customer the benifits and safety issues or they just did not do the job correctly. When I start all will get a 100% guarantee as we do with any work we do.

hope you see the point I am making, your safety is most important 

I appreciate your concern mate. 

To be honest I think we stand more chance of being killed or injured whilst we drive between jobs in motor vehicles rather than the danger from ladders when we get there as you have unfortunately found out. 

I hope you are completely over your injury now and send you my best regards. 

A thought provoking post of yours and also very interesting.

[Feen]

What a load of old sh**e. Do your thing, whether it be poles or ladders. Mind yer own business and stop slagging off other systems.
If we all minded our own business, there would be no forum. Opinions, that all they are.
I use wfp but I say live and let live. If it weren't for the traditional ladder using window cleaner what would we have done years ago?

Years ago wfp wasn't invented, so the ladder was the only option. Years ago the combustion engine wasn't invented, so the horse was the only option.

[xxmattyxx]

Years ago self-cleaning glass wasnt invented, so window-cleaners were the only option, now it has been invented, seems they still are......


s'ok, I'll get me coat.... 

What a load of old sh**e. Do your thing, whether it be poles or ladders. Mind yer own business and stop slagging off other systems.
If we all minded our own business, there would be no forum. Opinions, that all they are.
I use wfp but I say live and let live. If it weren't for the traditional ladder using window cleaner what would we have done years ago?

Years ago wfp wasn't invented, so the ladder was the only option. Years ago the combustion engine wasn't invented, so the horse was the only option.