[bassjamm]

Hi,

I'm in a bit of a dilema...

A friend of mine, who runs a local round cleaning the high street shops has become seriously ill and will no longer be able to do his round.  The round takes £1000 per month, consists of 75 customers, and is way under priced, as in prices range from 60p with the highest being £11, these are all high street shops, not many large names in there, mainly local small businesses.

The other thing is, this chap. due to his illness has, over time, began to forget things, which doesn't help seeing as his round is in his head, not on paper/pc.  Although, i trust him and know that there is certainly the larger amount still alive (only one or two jobs in dispute).

The family are asking £1500 for the round, but with the poor prices, lack of 100% assurance that everything is as they say it is, and the fact that all of the customers are going to be firstly, new to wfp, and secondly, not going to appreciate a huge price hike.

What do you think???

I can see the potential there, i mean, if i put the prices up and lose 20/30 customers, i'll be no worse off if the jobs average £5 after this, but i'd rather not lose anyone and still increase the prices, but the average price is like £2/£2.50 so it's a big increase.  Having said that, nobody in the local area will do them for the prices the shops are used to, so one way or another, they're going up!!!

Should i pass it by, or take it on and sort it out (and haggle on the £1500)

Thanks
Jamie

[Mr.G]

how about speaking to the potential customers first, asking them if they'll accept the price increases, before comitting yourself?

[Dave hook]

£1500 is a bargain for £1000 worth of work mate! youve made your money back plus profit in 2 months!

[macmac]

talk to the customers, explain that no one will do it for the existing prices. you however, are prepared to take the work on BUT you'll have to raise the prices. I think they'll be more than happy, the alternative being no window cleaner at all. if you lose some of the jobs because of this innitialy, i'm sure given time they will come back anyway.

[bassjamm]

Thanks for the replies.

As for speaking to the customers before taking the round on, it's not really that simple, as every window cleaner in the area could do this which will annoy the customers and cause too much confusion for the seller.

As regards £1500 being a bargain, yes it is for £1000 of work, but no it isn't for a round that isn't exactly intact, it's not like it's a £1000 of good work either, potentially it is, but i could spend the £1500 and find that of the 75 customer, 50 of them are inside and out for £3 and the remaining 25 are once a month not once a week...the chap can't help it if he's ill, i appreciate that, but from a business point of view, this work is not worth £1500.00 to anyone who knows anything about cleaning windows!!!

The good thing is that a few of the local window cleaners, including myself are looking after the round untill it's sold, none of the other cleaners will try and take the jobs, they're honourable business men, and good friends at that.  So the jobs are being looked after, the issue is that as we go round, where we've been told it's £2.50 for the shop front every mon/thurs, we turn up, and it's £2.50 in and out, every other week.

It's just not been documented...and that makes it worth less!  It's a shame though, i don't want to fleece the family nor the owner of the round, but they don't understand the situation for a potential buyer i don't think...

Hmmmmmm!!!

[macmac]

its a tough cookie, i bought some work once and that too had some realy underpriced jobs with it, i eventually ditched some and put some up but there's nowt worse than doing a job knowing that its well underpriced.

[bassjamm]

I agree about that.

My current line of thought is that it's roughly £1000 of work. If worse comes to worst it stays that way, although i'm not sure that all will take a pole system that easily, but that's just how it's going to be, i don't like using a blade, so will do this as little as i have to.

If i did take this on, i'd look to build up the round on the domestic side anyway, and that will be priced correctly, so when i get £100 of domestic, i can approach the really bad jobs and say it's either prices up, or no window cleaner, no one else will be charging any different to what i would be if charged correctly.  I'll put the prices up asap anyway.

My main concern is that it's a bit of a gamble with the seller not remembering things too well.

Just another point, how do you guys clean shop windows, blade of wfp?  And if with the wfp, how do you get around busy high streets?  I was thinking of doing the round in the early part of the morning, say from 6-9...what are your thoughts?

Jamie

[D.Salkeld_Ltd]

Do you realy want the round?

Iff so then, my opinion would be sit down with the chap and his family and make up a list of the work.  Then go around the customers with the family member who is sorting it out and check the work the chap has stated.  Hopefully after this you will all have an accurate list of the round and it's working value.  Then you can talk about a fair price.

David

[bassjamm]

This is kind of what i've resolved to do.

Someone has already sat down and made a list with the chap, but due to his illness, the list is innaccurate in places, this is one of the main causes for concern.

I've called the family member who's sorting it out, he's calling me back tonight.  I'm going to air my concerns and ask for his permission to go and talk to the customers on the list and clear everything up, introduce myself as potentially their new window cleaner, and see how much scope there is for price increase.  This way, my mind will be settled either way, and the family will have a clearer picture of what the round is actually like.

I'll then see if i think it's worth the £1500, or what i'm prepared to pay, and see what happens.

Just on a side point...how do you all clean windows then on the high street, blade on pole?

Thanks again guys,

Jamie

[mgba_78]

I'm going to air my concerns and ask for his permission to go and talk to the customers on the list and clear everything up, introduce myself as potentially their new window cleaner, and see how much scope there is for price increase. 

I think if you ask if there is any "scope" for a price increase they are just going to say no.

If they are poorly priced and do not like the idea of an increase who is going to clean the windows??

I think you just need to get the list from the family member and probably knock the whole high street if possible, names on list easy explain situation, ones with no customers are potenially a new customer.

Also £1000 per month and 75 customers is an average price of £13 is this correct??

[Pat Purcell]

Why not take the list of names,go and raise each ones price to an acceptable level,some will stay some will go
Then pay the original cleaners 50% of the first months take ,50% of second month, 25% of third and fourth months
This way you end up with a well priced bunch of stores for 1 1/2 times monthly take which is exactly what they are looking for now, and they may or may not end up with better than the 1500 they were originally looking for

[KarlJones]

It is yet another Asymetric Information type problem   I love these and I love finding solutions.

This one is a bit strange, because normally it is the person selling that has all the information, and the person buying that needs it.

However, in this case niether one person or the other has a clue.  Technically the round is worth nothing, because by the sounds of it your looking at 40 hrs a week on minimum wage and the very idea of paying so you can earn minimum wage is simply crazy.

But, you both know that this is not £1000 worth of buisness, and that it could be either a lot more, or a lot less, and most likely somewhere inbetween two big extremes.   

Solution is not to buy £1000 worth of it for £1500 but to offer him 150% of the new rate for each customer that says they are willing to stay.   

So you take him, or a relative of his around to these customers, you re-price them up, inform the customer and see if they are willing to accept the WFP and new price.  If they are then bingo your both happy because he gets 150% of a better price than he was offering originally.  If the customer says no then niether of you have really lost out as no money exchanged hands.

Everybody is happy, except some tight customers who wanted to take advantage of an old fella.

[Pat Purcell]

snap

[brett walker]

from 60P 


Do not ever take on under priced work you will regret it

I wouldnt take it on and then put the prices up go round to the customers will a family member if you prefere explain to them about the mans illness and that you are buying his business from him.  Ask them exactly what services they require and how often then explain to them that window cleaning has moved on with different methords but like everything prices have to go up.
If you talk to them as if you are running a business and be professional you wont loose many customers,  the ones who only want to pay 60p or a bit more arent worth having if they arent prepared to pay you what your worth.  I bet they wouldnt work for that much!

Brett

[bassjamm]

I'm going to air my concerns and ask for his permission to go and talk to the customers on the list and clear everything up, introduce myself as potentially their new window cleaner, and see how much scope there is for price increase. 

I think if you ask if there is any "scope" for a price increase they are just going to say no.

If they are poorly priced and do not like the idea of an increase who is going to clean the windows??

I think you just need to get the list from the family member and probably knock the whole high street if possible, names on list easy explain situation, ones with no customers are potenially a new customer.

Also £1000 per month and 75 customers is an average price of £13 is this correct??

I wish it was an average of £13, it's a 1 week round in most cases, one or two jobs are bi-weekly/monthly/twice weekly...so average is around £3

[KarlJones]

also, as for busy high streets and times.

I used to have to take my ex wife to work as she used to open up in town.  I would often wait for her to make sure she was OK.  The town used to be full of window cleaners.  They seemed to aim to finish before the shops open. 

I used to watch and think how much I would love to do that job.  I tell you one thing, high street shop window cleaners are fast, very fast.  I am not sure residential pricing and high street shops go hand in hand. 

What I am trying to say is maybe they just work for peanuts per window and have a good meal out of the amount they do in such sort periods of time.  If it was me, bearing in mind you said outside and inside, I think I would work along doing the outside before 8am and work my way back as the staff arrive.

[bassjamm]

Interesting stuff guys...

As regards the whole going around the round and then paying them 150% of the new value, this won't fly with the family, they want to see the end of it, and therefor, i won't be able to persuade one of them to come out with me.

It's a bit cheaky really, as they expect myself and others to give up our free time to look after the round whilst it's being sold, but they'll not look after a potential buyer.  I've already had an offer of £1000 declined, and have since withdrawn my willingness to help them out...as has my father who also w/c's, the simple reason being, they expect people to help them out whilst they make money in a greedy fashion.

If they'd take £1000 and allow me to go around the list and find out what's what then i'd take it, and i'd except that once it's mine and i put the prices up, if a few go, they go, but at least i'd know that the list was correct before parting with money...

As for your post KarlJones...that is what i had in mind, do the outsides before it gets busy, then work backwards doing insides and collecting my money as the places liven up.  I know that the prices are different due to the speeds you work at, but the average shop front, bearing in mind that you can do signs and that with a WFP is at least worth £5, as opposed to the £2 they've been paying.  I'd rather do 35 well paid jobs than 75 poorly!!!

[brett walker]

Sounds like the family are very greedy and want money for old rope, if i were you i would just go round the customers and sort it out yourself as the above post has advised before you hand that kind of money over.  You will find that all window cleaners are not as good hearted as you and will go round getting them for free if they wait much longer

I know of wc's who would cut your throat for shop fronts

Brett