[simon knight]

Always work whatever the weather. Don't see how you can keep up a reliable service any other way. Always tell customers when we take them on so they are prepared. Got equipment debts so have to keep the pennies rolling in. I now love working in the rain cos there's not so many people to get in our way. Don't like getting behind on work either.

D.

Oh come on Dominic, you can't have it both ways...you either:

a) Need the money and don't mind getting wet and doing a less than 100% job.
b) Offer a reliable service, but surely a "reliable" service also means that the customer gets 100% satisfaction....not possible in rain! 

[john tomkins]

that is why we impress on our guys that if you spend that little bit of time each clean making sure the tops of frames and surrounds are totally clear from dust etc then you will not get a problem when it rains.

I agree with you generally but with the excessive wind and rain conditions we are experiencing lately I've noticed on my own newly cleaned windows that the rain is washing down the brickwork and depositing a load of brick dust/dirt all over the windows leaving them in a terrible state, if I was a customer I would not be pleased with that, so no I'm not working in the rain, I'll finish a job in the rain but not start the next one.

[Paul Coleman]

I had a few customers who would send me packing if rain threatened.  Some of those would also get on my case if I was late.  They can't have it both ways.  One of them was deeply religious so I went around to clean on a Sunday just to annoy her.  Got the sack eventually and was glad to see the back of that one.

[simon knight]

I had a few customers who would send me packing if rain threatened.  Some of those would also get on my case if I was late.  They can't have it both ways.  One of them was deeply religious so I went around to clean on a Sunday just to annoy her.  Got the sack eventually and was glad to see the back of that one.

Like it   

[Ian_Giles]

Trev,
You are quite right, a drop of rain is niether here not there, I've worked in the rain today...though I'm feeling guilty about the last account I did, it was exposed and really catching the wind and rain

If the rain is so hard its soaking the walls above the windows, it's highly unlikely you'll be cleaning windows in conditions like that...you'd be mad to in fact.

But the wind picks up debris from fields, fron passing cars, off trees and hedgerows  , roofs and walls, it gets swirled high into the atmosphere, mixes with the rain and is driven onto the windows.

Now as every one knows, I am a keen advocate of WFP, but I'm also honest enough to look at things with an unbiased eye (that applies to trad too I'll have you all know!)

WFP does not cope well with windy, stormy conditons, yes, you CAN go out and work in conditions that would be madness off a ladder, but the trade off is the much greater potential for low standard work.

I do my local Spar shop, was doing it last week (in & out) WFP on the outside, but I squeegee the doors as they open out and get stinking, so better safe than sorry.
On calm days the windows on the outside dry out perfect, I can't fault them.

But on this day, the doors were good (not perfect because of the heavy wind and rain) and the big window to the one side of the doors was also nearly perfect (I'd squeegee'd this one off) but the big window the other side of the door had noticable spots when looked at from the inside after they had dried out. (the other window and the doors only failed on very close inspection)

The wet glass will hold onto crap, it takes a little longer for the squeegee'd windows.
I do lots of insides and I notice the difference between work done in squally conditions and that done in fine conditions.
I want the work I do to be acceptable by my own standards, I don't like charging for work that I know doesn't achieve those standards.

I did a house a couple of weeks ago, she wasn't in (I still haven't been paid either ) and as I called back on her to see if she was in at the end of the day, I saw a couple of windows that were not quite right, no one about So a quickly tidied them up and checked over the rest of the house.
They had all dried out perfect, was a bit windy but not too bad.
Last Wednesday I was going past the house and popped in on the off chance of making the collection, I didn't, she was out, it had been less than a week and the windows were minging
I was stupidily grateful to the fact that I had called back on the day I did them and found them spotless   (bar a couple of panes on two windows) otherwise I would have been thinking I had done a terrible job, looked just like I'd done a slipshod WFP job.
But of course that was all down entirely to the weather.

We have to have some give and take, customers have to accept their windows are going to potentially get dirty very quickly in the winter, but I think we should also consider the fact there are some days when you have to just take it on the chin and not work.
Just lately the weather has been pretty exceptional, it's why the two threads on weather are getting so many hits!
And of course the pressure is really on us all to get as much work done as possible because of the financial pressure of Christmas (JW's notwithstanding of course! )

These are conditions when shops are a real godsend
I have plenty of them (and offices, pubs and so on) so I can afford to be pusillanimous

Ian

[dai]

I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai

[simon knight]

I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai

So are you saying Dai that customer satisfaction comes secondary to you earning?

[Cleaner Windows]

I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai

[Paul Coleman]

I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai

So are you saying Dai that customer satisfaction comes secondary to you earning?

ot trying to do Dai's writing for him but my service only exists while it is economically viable for me to provide it.  Therefore the choice is to price much higher and take the time off or work in wet weather up to a point.  The other alternative is that the service ceases to exist.  Others may try to provide that service but would probably flounder on the same obstacles.  If it's a reasonable bet that the windows will get dirty over the few days following a clean, at least a window cleaner is preventing a build up of dirt.  The customer is paying a sort of retainer to prevent such a build up occurring.

[Trevor Knight]

Trev,
You are quite right, a drop of rain is niether here not there, I've worked in the rain today...though I'm feeling guilty about the last account I did, it was exposed and really catching the wind and rain

If the rain is so hard its soaking the walls above the windows, it's highly unlikely you'll be cleaning windows in conditions like that...you'd be mad to in fact.

But the wind picks up debris from fields, fron passing cars, off trees and hedgerows  , roofs and walls, it gets swirled high into the atmosphere, mixes with the rain and is driven onto the windows.

Now as every one knows, I am a keen advocate of WFP, but I'm also honest enough to look at things with an unbiased eye (that applies to trad too I'll have you all know!)

WFP does not cope well with windy, stormy conditons, yes, you CAN go out and work in conditions that would be madness off a ladder, but the trade off is the much greater potential for low standard work.

I do my local Spar shop, was doing it last week (in & out) WFP on the outside, but I squeegee the doors as they open out and get stinking, so better safe than sorry.
On calm days the windows on the outside dry out perfect, I can't fault them.

But on this day, the doors were good (not perfect because of the heavy wind and rain) and the big window to the one side of the doors was also nearly perfect (I'd squeegee'd this one off) but the big window the other side of the door had noticable spots when looked at from the inside after they had dried out. (the other window and the doors only failed on very close inspection)

The wet glass will hold onto crap, it takes a little longer for the squeegee'd windows.
I do lots of insides and I notice the difference between work done in squally conditions and that done in fine conditions.
I want the work I do to be acceptable by my own standards, I don't like charging for work that I know doesn't achieve those standards.

I did a house a couple of weeks ago, she wasn't in (I still haven't been paid either ) and as I called back on her to see if she was in at the end of the day, I saw a couple of windows that were not quite right, no one about So a quickly tidied them up and checked over the rest of the house.
They had all dried out perfect, was a bit windy but not too bad.
Last Wednesday I was going past the house and popped in on the off chance of making the collection, I didn't, she was out, it had been less than a week and the windows were minging
I was stupidily grateful to the fact that I had called back on the day I did them and found them spotless   (bar a couple of panes on two windows) otherwise I would have been thinking I had done a terrible job, looked just like I'd done a slipshod WFP job.
But of course that was all down entirely to the weather.

We have to have some give and take, customers have to accept their windows are going to potentially get dirty very quickly in the winter, but I think we should also consider the fact there are some days when you have to just take it on the chin and not work.
Just lately the weather has been pretty exceptional, it's why the two threads on weather are getting so many hits!
And of course the pressure is really on us all to get as much work done as possible because of the financial pressure of Christmas (JW's notwithstanding of course! )

These are conditions when shops are a real godsend
I have plenty of them (and offices, pubs and so on) so I can afford to be pusillanimous

Ian

Hi Ian,

Fair points and valid ones. I understand exactly what your saying.

I guess on this one we will agree to do things our own way. I will work in the rain until my customers complain, like previous postings I have never experienced any real flack so happy days.

The pressure on xmas is a very valid on, we are working from daylight til nightfall as we finish on Friday 22nd and don't eturn until after the new year so we are getting all our months work done early. We do this every year and our customers are fine with this, they no we will be early in the month as we want a holiday too!

Onwards and upwards, have a good day today, its dry 

[dai]

So are you saying Dai that customer satisfaction comes secondary to you earning
Some customers will moan for sure, but I have to make a living or they won't have a window cleaner at all. The answer would be to increase my prices by 25% and then I could afford to lose 3 months a year to the weather.
The moaning about cleaning in the rain would be nothing compared to a 25% price hike.
The weather here in north Wales has been appalling for the last three weeks.
We had 5/12 inches of rain in just one night. The wind has been howling for most of the time too.
The odd day off is neither here nor there, but when you get a prolonged spell like we are having now, decisions have to be made. I have ot experience a spell like this in 14 years.
It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai

[simon knight]

Dai, sorry if I came across rudely as it wasn't my intention. For what it's worth I tend to work really long hours in the summer on the basis that in winter I'm gonna be rained off 1 or 2 days a week. Mind you the with the weather you've described in N.Wales I'd probably rapidly adjust my attitude if I earnt nowt for a week!

Blimey 5 1/2 inches in one night?!!!

[windows_chepstow]

It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai

I agree with Dai, but would like to add that any customer who complains about getting their windows cleaned at this time of year; given the weather we've had is:

a.  Tight.

b.  Stupid.

c.  Dropped.

[macc]

It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai

I agree with Dai, but would like to add that any customer who complains about getting their windows cleaned at this time of year; given the weather we've had is:

a.  Tight.

b.  Stupid.

c.  Dropped.

All 3

[simon knight]

It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai

I agree with Dai, but would like to add that any customer who complains about getting their windows cleaned at this time of year; given the weather we've had is:

a.  Tight.

b.  Stupid.

c.  Dropped.

a. Tight foremost...after all if you said "I know it's peeing down so I'll do em for nowt" They're hardly gonna say "no thanks!"

Can't comment on b

With c: I suspect it's how much the customer is worth annually that dictates how readily one drops. eg: I have a customer...Swedish, who absolutely has NO interst in her windows being done from Oct-Mar. But from Mar-end Sept she'll want em done 4 times @ £50 a throw....£200...how can I drop her?

[windows_chepstow]

With c: I suspect it's how much the customer is worth annually that dictates how readily one drops. eg: I have a customer...Swedish, who absolutely has NO interst in her windows being done from Oct-Mar. But from Mar-end Sept she'll want em done 4 times @ £50 a throw....£200...how can I drop her?

If 50 quid is a good price if you're happy with it and you've agreed a schedule of cleans, then don't drop her.  Maybe you would've charged less if she had it done every month?  The extra charge could be for the extra muck you've got to clean from her windows in March?

You've got to use some common sense.

But I don't do time-wasters; I don't care about the size of the account or how much I like the job or money.

If I'm turned away from an account, I drop them.  Cheeky monkeys!

It's been at least a year since I've had this happen to me; but I'm still cross from the times this HAS happened to me.

[simon knight]

Time wasters? They get the heave ho...always!

I tend to "finesse" my customers almost bi-monthly. And with me it's always a bit of:

a) Are you regular?....and here I'm not too fussed whether it's 6/8/10/12 weekly....as long as I know where I stand.

b) Is your house a place I can do "comfortably"....ie I don't feel unduly endangered.

c) Can I park?....important in SW London

d)....and THE most important, how much am I likely to earn from you over the next 12 months.

It's all a bit Ad Hoc but I'm very reluctant to drop a customer until he/she can be replaced with something more pleasing to me....and even then I don't drop them as such. They don't get a call and as and when they call me the price gets adjusted to compensate for above.

[john tomkins]

Had my first one this week say "not this month I've had loads of bills to pay/weather aint too good" it really wound me up but as I've only been at this game a few months I really have to bite my lip as I aint got enough customers to just drop any.....but he will be on my hit list for the future

[Cleaner Windows]

lol, i know what you mean chap!!!

[Paul Coleman]

Had my first one this week say "not this month I've had loads of bills to pay/weather aint too good" it really wound me up but as I've only been at this game a few months I really have to bite my lip as I aint got enough customers to just drop any.....but he will be on my hit list for the future

The problem with a situation liker this is not so much being turned away once only but the probability that they are testing the boundaries for doing it again in the future.  I have found that when there is not a very good reason for stopping me working, it inevitably happens again and again from the samer place.  At least it used to anyway.  I won't put up with it so much these days.
Now I do agree that any customer has the right to say "not today thank you".  That is fine.  However, I also have the right to take whatever steps are necessary to maintain the profitability of my business.  The customers who I have difficulty with are those who only seem to be aware of their own rights and think that I am not allowed to cancel the job.