[jamesjames]

Hi, I have just cleaned a cream wool carpet with HWE but what seems to have happend is either dirt from deep down or dye from the backing has come to the top ans made the carpet look slightly brown, this is only in the main walk way area, I told the client that if I carry on I would over wet the area and said I would return in the week,any help would be appreciated.

Regards
James

[carpetclean]

if it really is a wicking problem and you dont want to complicate things very lightly pre spray and use some micro sponges and agitate leave to dry for around 10 minutes vacuum off job done

[jamesjames]

if it really is a wicking problem and you dont want to complicate things very lightly pre spray and use some micro sponges and agitate leave to dry for around 10 minutes vacuum off job done

Hi Carpet clean, are these micro sponges different to ordinary sponges & should I just use an ordinary prespray??

[*paul_moss]

James It sounds like you have cell browning and have over wet the carpet.
Go back and thouroghly pre vac first then clean as normal with HWE using an acid rinse.
The Acid rinse will stop the browning.

Dont over wet. Drop the psi.

[Jeremy]

Had this problem myself. Paul is on the button. - Drop the PSI, Drop PH to as low as 4, HWE and my finishing touch was to towel dry the surface. Worked for me.

Regards
Jeremy

[carpetclean]

hi james any micro sponges will do , agitate with a sebo it should be ok .but if it is a browning problem then its a different matter you can use a debrowning agent . all pretty much the same

[the red carpet]

I could be wrong but if it was browning would it not be all over and not just the traffic areas?

My first thought would be that there just really dirty and your drawing the dirt up as your extracting

In this situation depending on if i felt the carpet could take the water or not
I would either just keep extracting the area and see what happened
Or leave it to dry and then go back a couple days later and try the traffic areas again

Another way of doing it would be to give it a light spray and finish of with a terry towell or spray and use some sort of bonnet system, this would remove the dirt from the top of the pile and make it look acceptable but at the end of the day it would still be full of dirt at the bottom, so still not really clean.

[rice]

The fact that it`s the traffic area could sugest that cust has diy`d with high allkaline cleaners
which as it happened immediatially caused  oxidisation,in a weeks time it`ll have gone darker either way an acid rinse and reclean with less pressure followed by alight mist of the acid rinse.
rice.

[*paul_moss]

Red
The reason why the traffic areas have browning and the other areas dont is because the traffic areas need a bigger hit to remove the dirt and therefore get wet more as more wet passes are needed.
The trick to this is to use a heavey  electric aggitator such as a host or envirodry machine to aggitate the chemical in to the yarn before extraction.By doing this the wet passes are more of a rinse with a lower psi rather than a number of heavier wet passes with a higher psi.

James
 
If the customer had used an akaline cleaner it does not mean that oxidisation has taken place unless an oxidising agent has been used and if so the result would be lighter shading and not darker.

[rice]

paul,

what I meant was that high ph, wet carpet and air, ie oxygen being the oxidising agent,
like when you leave a half an apple exposed to the air will go yellow,brown and sometimes
black.You know yourself some of the concoktions we all have to deal with on a daily basis.
My biggest problems are caused by diy customers with vax machines filled with washing up
liquid!
regards
rice.
 

[*paul_moss]

Hi Rice I understand what you are saying but that is not oxidisation the browning ( discolouration) on a apple is due to the multiplication of spoilage bacteira that you can see (and smell if left long enough)and not caused by a chemical reaction or oxidisation.
 
Paul

[scott.]

james
Had a similar prob, which left a brown hazyness on the carpet...went back to the customer 3 times and treated it with diff levels of de-browning agent as they tell you...no luck....it cost me £3500 to replace (insurance)...if it dosnt shift....you may have to cough up on the insurance....if youre insured, that is.

[jamesjames]

Thanks to all who replied I do appreciate, I go back to the house on Friday so I will let you know the out come.

[*paul_moss]

James a quick test when you go will be to get a cloth and sparay some acidic rince/browning prescription or something similar and agitate into an area of the carpet.This should dry quite quick and you will be able to see if it can be reveresed.

Another option may be to bonnet it.
Paul

[rice]

PAUL, why would an acid such as vinegar reverse browning on an apple instantly if it was just caused from bacteria.off topic I know,but i`m just curious.
thanks for the reply

rice.

[*paul_moss]

Hi Rice
It does not reverse it it stops it continuing.
If you where to put an acid or anything with a ph below4.5) on a brown apple it will kill off the bacteria.The brown on a apple is spoilage bacteria which cannot survive below 4.5ph or above 10.8 ph.Spoilage bacteria are naturally present in the air so when they land on a protien food such as an apple they start to multiply by binary fission at a rate of 1 bacterium becoming 1 million in a few hours.Thats why things like pickling preserves food for a long period of time as it is suspended in an acidic liquid which stops bacterial growth.
Hope this explians it simply with out going into loads of stuff.

[rice]

Thanks Paul,
Iwas thinking the same thing myself,but Idid`nt want to baffle you with my obvious
vast knowledge of chemistry 

[Mike Osbourne]

I thought acid would just fix it and would have been best used before the problem occurred and dried sharpish.

Also I'm unclear about what you mean about acid/debrowning stuff, this ambiguity could lead to someone using acid and debrowning powder together. I was led to believe this is potetially dangerous.

[*paul_moss]

Mike you are correct and this is why you dont ever mix any chemicals together unless you are experienced and know what your doing.

Be safe and just follow the manufacturers guide lines on the prescribed chemicals for the relevent job.

[carpetclean]

hi Paul  i agree with you about the heavy agitation on some carpets . i now use the environdri on most  jobs. it put the sebo duo to shame and the effort required is minimum a one handed guide is all that's required, people go on about the time involved but i do not think it takes longer because of the little effort required. i did a job yesterday in fact on a trashed carpet that had never been cleaned and down for years it was horrific and the only reason he called me was because he spilt milk tried to get it up and ended up with a lovely rancid spelling patch the rest of the carpet was covered in all sorts of stains that even he could not identify. as you state the traffic lanes were the worst so out comes the environdri and 5 minutes of agitation even before extraction the carpet looks 99% better. so little effort required on the actual extraction and one very happy customer. though i doubt he was the sort of person to clean the carpets regularly and will probably only call me back when he has another accident.