[andyralph]

Hi all looking at fitting one do they need to be fitted at the bottom of my tank as it’s going to b difficult I can probably get half way and how do u set temp do they come with thermostats any ideas please thanks andy

[High-Tower]

Ideally need to be at the bottom, but will still work ok 1/2 way down, obviously needs to be in the water when it’s switched on.
They have an internal thermostat that can be adjusted, think the maximum on most is 65, so depending on your tank size you’ll probably want it on full anyway.

Here’s a link to the 2kw heater I’ve been using for a while now. It’s what you’ll want if you aren’t going to upgrade your supply to handle a 3kw, or it’ll melt standard wiring and burn your house down if you are unlucky.
https://www.midlandchandlers.co.uk/products/immersion-heater-2kw-240v-hc-042

[Dry Clean]

Your cold water will rise as it heats and then drop again as it cools/hotter water replaces it,  so for an even distribution of heat the middle of the tank will actually be the best place to put it, ( think of water circulating in the tank) the downside of this is you  will only be able to heat a full tank of water which is why items such as electric kettles have their elements at the bottom.

[andyralph]

Thanks for reply’s does it matter f I use a 3kw element thanks andy

[Ched]

Thanks for reply’s does it matter f I use a 3kw element thanks andy

The problem with a 3KW element is getting power to it. A 13A plug isn't enough as 3KW at 220V is 13.5Amps! So you need a 16 Amp supply installing at your house!
If you shop round you can get 2Kw elements that run of 13 plug no problems.

[andyralph]

Hi does it matter if I fill up the tank first the  first the heat as for me to put the element down towards the bottom of the tank it will b hard to fit as my tank is an upright and would u normally heat as u fill the tank thanks andy

[Smudger]

The element must be under water or it will burn out - fill then turn it on and leave overnight

Darran

[andyralph]

Hi thanks what the best temperature to set it at and how long would it take to heat 700 litres thanks andy

[Smudger]

Depends on what temperature your aiming for ...

I tend to set my stats at 60 degrees

It's been a long time since I checked what they get to but I run them from 10 pm until 7.30 am - my vans are inside a unit so don't really have to battle the really cold outside weather

If I was outside and the temp was zero to minus 3 I would have it running  from 6 pm right through to the morning  to achieve something like 45 degrees in the tank - really you need o try different times with different outside temps  use your water tds meter to check water temp

Darran

[andyralph]

Hi thanks can u adjust temperature on all emmersion elements or do I need to buy one with there being at setting facility and does it matter what length and weather there copper or stainless or titanium thanks for your help andy

[AuRavelling79]

3kw divided by 240v not 220 so just within 13 amps.

However if you go 3kw I would get an electrician to install a separate supply rather than a spur and to fit 16amp caravan type sockets.

I did thus for a few years but on my current element dropped to 2kw as it let's you run a light or a battery charger off the same lead/socket and let's me retain normal 13a plugs.

[Smudger]

Hmmm....

All the ones I get have a thermostat as part of the element - they have an adjustable dial - some are marked 40 to 80 others 4 to 8

I would go for stainless or inox over copper as for length if you have a clear run inside the tank go for a 22" ( or whatever he longest is ) I've just used 11 " ones

Darran

[Smudger]

3kw divided by 240v not 220 so just within 13 amps.

However if you go 3kw I would get an electrician to install a separate supply rather than a spur and to fit 16amp caravan type sockets.

I did thus for a few years but on my current element dropped to 2kw as it let's you run a light or a battery charger off the same lead/socket and let's me retain normal 13a plugs.

Good post - I ran 3 kw off the mains ring iit used to get warm (quite warm) when I had a timer plugged in it did fry that quite nicely 😊

Now I have 16 amp dedicated sockets for the 3 kw vans but standard 3 pin for 2 kw - but not off a spur

Darran

[Ched]

3kw divided by 240v not 220 so just within 13 amps.

UK supply used to be 240vac but with EU harmonisation in 1994 we changed to be more inline with Europe. The harmonisation was completed in January 2003.

I believe UK supply is actually more like 230vac nominally. The point I was trying to make was it's not a good idea to run a 3Kw immersion heater of a 13 amp socket!

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

3kw divided by 240v not 220 so just within 13 amps.

UK supply used to be 240vac but with EU harmonisation in 1994 we changed to be more inline with Europe. The harmonisation was completed in January 2003.

I believe UK supply is actually more like 230vac nominally. The point I was trying to make was it's not a good idea to run a 3Kw immersion heater of a 13 amp socket!

Couldn't agree more.

DO NOT run a 3kw immersion heater from a 13amp socket unless you wish to burn your house down.......like I nearly did!!

You need to come from a dedicated 16amp line from the consumer unit with suitable cable, timer and connections. It's all cheap and freely available to buy and a very simple job for a qualified electrician.

[KS Cleaning]

I’ve also got a 3kw immersion, dedicated 16 amp socket straight from consumer unit, all fitted by a qualified sparky.

[andyralph]

Hi all best place 2 get a 2 kw Emmersion element as all the ones I’ve looked at r 3kw and they all seem to b 11 inch’s in length will that do the job thanks andy

[KS Cleaning]

You will also need a mechanical flange like this, just make sure the size of thread matches the thread size of the element.
https://www.toolstation.com/mechanical-flange/p38614

[Smudger]

thermtec make immersions just down the road from me I got several off them

here is there website  http://www.thermtec.co.uk
I had a quick look - I can see 1kw and 3 kw - you might need to ring for a 2kw

Darran

[Ched]

Just a quick google and this company came up https://www.midlandchandlers.co.uk/products/immersion-heater-2kw-240v-hc-042#
I have not used the company.

[Smudger]

Good price too

Darran

[andyralph]

hi all just fitted emmersion element any idea of cost for running it over a six hour period cheers andy

[KS Cleaning]

hi all just fitted emmersion element any idea of cost for running it over a six hour period cheers andy

As an example, if you are 25 pence per kw per hour and you use a 2 kw immersion, that would be 50 pence per hour, so 6 hours @ 50p = £3:00.

[jk999]

I would put one in but my wife's a bit tight with electricity, she wouldn't even let me dry a pair of socks in dryer because she said it used to much electricity wow 🤣🤣🤣

[Ched]

hi all just fitted emmersion element any idea of cost for running it over a six hour period cheers andy

As an example, if you are 25 pence per kw per hour and you use a 2 kw immersion, that would be 50 pence per hour, so 6 hours @ 50p = £3:00.

If you are paying 25p a unit then switch suppliers!! I am paying 15p a unit!! So for 6 hrs would be 12 units x15p = £1.80.

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

Unless your tank is pretty small, a 2kw element on for 6 hours won't do much. For 500lts you're probably looking at double that.

[neiljoust]

I have used a 3kw for a long time , use a extension reel which will take 3150w and a 13 amp plug is 3kw max never got warm

[Ched]

Unless your tank is pretty small, a 2kw element on for 6 hours won't do much. For 500lts you're probably looking at double that.

A 2Kw heater on a 500 lts tank with water starting at 8DegC would take 15hrs to get to 60DegC. At just 6 hrs temp would increase to 29DegC from 8DegC.
A 350lts tank, 2Kw heater 8DegC starting temp would take 10.5hrs to get to 60DegC and in 6 hrs would be at 38degC.
Both the above calcs assume 100% efficient tank insulation!!!

[NWH]

Not being funny guys and I know you lot always say I harp on about hot water but I can achieve 60 degrees within 10 minutes with my diesel heater.

[KS Cleaning]

hi all just fitted emmersion element any idea of cost for running it over a six hour period cheers andy

As an example, if you are 25 pence per kw per hour and you use a 2 kw immersion, that would be 50 pence per hour, so 6 hours @ 50p = £3:00.

If you are paying 25p a unit then switch suppliers!! I am paying 15p a unit!! So for 6 hrs would be 12 units x15p = £1.80.

I’m not!! That’s why I said “ as an example ”

[KS Cleaning]

Not being funny guys and I know you lot always say I harp on about hot water but I can achieve 60 degrees within 10 minutes with my diesel heater.

But it’s just a case of plugging in, so no biggie is it? Just as easy as you plugging in to charge your batteries, or flicking your switch.

[NWH]

Come on hours and hours to get the kind of temp I get in 10 minutes and then get it constantly for as long as I so wish,what happens if you heat the water up all night and then the next day for whatever reason you don’t work what a waste.

[P @ F]

I can get 60c within 5 minutes

[Ched]

Come on hours and hours to get the kind of temp I get in 10 minutes and then get it constantly for as long as I so wish,what happens if you heat the water up all night and then the next day for whatever reason you don’t work what a waste.

It's not like the hrs heating you could have been cleaning - it gets heated overnight.
As for the not working, well its a couple of quid wasted. How much did your hot system cost and how much to service it?
I don't have an issue with diesel heaters at all but immersion heaters are a great cheap way of getting warm water if you have power close by.
I freely admit virtually instant hot water is useful but I'm not sure I would pay the high price for it. It takes a lot of extra jobs to recoup the outlay.
Every business is different and everyone works out returns on investment and ease of use differently, no right or wrong.

[tlwcs]

I have used a 3kw for a long time , use a extension reel which will take 3150w and a 13 amp plug is 3kw max never got warm

That’s why you only have 3 likes 😁
While you have been doing this successfully for some time, I doubt any sparky would say it’s ok.
If you’re going to do this, seek professional advice if you go 3kw before you fit one
Tony

[NWH]

20 notes a week to buy a diesel heater over 5 years and regardless of what you hear about servicing costs etc it’s rubbish,when the unit comes as new it’ll give you no problems for years especially for the years you’ll be paying it back for.
How much a week to run an emersion unit a week can’t be much different in cost maybe more.

[Den68]

20 notes a week to buy a diesel heater over 5 years and regardless of what you hear about servicing costs etc it’s rubbish,when the unit comes as new it’ll give you no problems for years especially for the years you’ll be paying it back for.
How much a week to run an emersion unit a week can’t be much different in cost maybe more.

How much a day do you spend in diesel running your heater out of curiosity.

[NWH]

It’s costs peanuts on diesel to run it tbh mines plumbed into vehicle tank I hardly notice it and I do quiet a few miles and it’s always on.

[High-Tower]

they use about 1l per hour.

[NWH]

I fill the van up when I get fuel I don’t notice it over the week-month.

[NWH]

Apart from putting fuel in the van what else do you have to pay for once you’ve got poles and spares etc on a daily basis overheads are minimal compared to a lot of other trades,I’ve got people I know that would love to only have to pay a few quid on diesel a day.

[High-Tower]

The ‘just a few quid’ mentality is how you end spending £20k+ a year on going to work.

[NWH]

Lol eh

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

I think we are all intelligent and experienced enough to work out whether we need steaming hot water or not, and I reckon 99% of us don't.
However, there is more of an argument for a inexpensive, simple and effective solution to widening the scope of opportunity in subzero temperatures for working, with the added benefit of also keeping your entire system frost free. It comes in the form of a high power electric heating element (immersion) and at £4800 cheaper than a diesel water heater- makes it a very economical and attractive option. Add to that, it's also maintenance free, as simple as plug in, switch on, less expensive to run than it's diesel alternative and it becomes pretty much a no brainer for the vast majority window cleaners.
Also, at around £200/£250 all in, including parts and professional 16amp line installed from consumer unit you won't have to spend  all day, every day trying to convince everyone else and their mother that you've made the right decision!!👍

[NWH]

What’s it cost to run the element though after it’s all installed.

[KS Cleaning]

What’s it cost to run the element though after it’s all installed.

If you care to read other posts in this thread you will find the answer.

[Den68]

It’s costs peanuts on diesel to run it tbh mines plumbed into vehicle tank I hardly notice it and I do quiet a few miles and it’s always on.

Peanuts for diesel must be crumbs then for electric 😂

I had a diesel heater install in my campervan so got a good idea how much it cost to run defo more that a immersion .

Also have a Diesel heater installed in my shed 👍

I have just bought a 2kw immersion heater and  all the parts to install just over £50 👍

[JandS]

Why does a diesel hot water system cost £5000+.........had a new boiler fitted in November for £1800 with a 10 year warranty.....I get constant hot water and it heats the house to boot.

[Den68]

Why does a diesel hot water system cost £5000+.........had a new boiler fitted in November for £1800 with a 10 year warranty.....I get constant hot water and it heats the house to boot.

I can’t give you the answer why they are more expensive, I have  oil heating/water system  at home we don’t have gas in the village  and anything to do with oil costs a fortune,

Good thing about my diesel heater in the shed as it works perfect on heating oil which is currently 40p a litre.

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

What’s it cost to run the element though after it’s all installed.

For me, at 13.5p per Kwh it's 40.5p per hour and a max of 8 hours heat time. So a worst case scenario of £3.24 per day. An average winter in the Ten years I've been using it would normally require it being used about 15/20 times to keep me going throughout.  I've only needed to use it twice this winter so far. So, you could say, at most £70 to £100 per winter in electric would be more than enough for most people.

[Ched]

Why does a diesel hot water system cost £5000+.........had a new boiler fitted in November for £1800 with a 10 year warranty.....I get constant hot water and it heats the house to boot.

Simply because they can charge that much for putting a heater in a box!!!!
There are DIY systems are available for about £1,300 that is almost all you need - NEW Webasto Thermo Top Evo 5 including pump, heat exchanger, header tank, controller etc.  Granted that's ONLY a 5KW system but it's a lot cheaper than some companies are selling the same kit for!!!!!

[chris turner]

I nearly went down the diesel route but have instead gone for immersion, albeit the more expensive route of getting an insulated tank with in built immersion from stephen scargill at toolcraft.
Immersion just makes much more sense to me, cheaper to buy, cheaper to run, less to go wrong and let's not forget diesel is a dying fuel, will be very expensive in 10 years when most big companies stop producing it.

[Smudger]

 

I can get 60c within 5 minutes

 

[Smudger]

Why does a diesel hot water system cost £5000+.........had a new boiler fitted in November for £1800 with a 10 year warranty.....I get constant hot water and it heats the house to boot.

Exactly - I have hot boxes for the pressure washers - 150 degrees - these cost around one third of what is being charged for "warm" water on tap

Darran

[Smudger]

Not being funny guys and I know you lot always say I harp on about hot water but I can achieve 60 degrees within 10 minutes with my diesel heater.

I don't want 60 degree water - simple

[Smudger]

20 notes a week to buy a diesel heater over 5 years and regardless of what you hear about servicing costs etc it’s rubbish,when the unit comes as new it’ll give you no problems for years especially for the years you’ll be paying it back for.
How much a week to run an emersion unit a week can’t be much different in cost maybe more.

ongoing cost as well Nigel....

using diesel to run it ( more than the electric cost of an immersion)
you used to constantly gripe that brushes are knackered within weeks ( because you run too hot )
more expensive batteries to run the system and you've buggered them up as well..
Plus you have to charge them every night
so far more costs than you try to let on

Darran

[dazmond]

Why does a diesel hot water system cost £5000+.........had a new boiler fitted in November for £1800 with a 10 year warranty.....I get constant hot water and it heats the house to boot.

Mine was 4.5k.....its not just the 9kw webasto thermo pro 90 heater though is it?(they cost £1300 on their own!)£750 was VAT....then the metal cabinet it sits in,frost stat digital controller,heat exchanger,hoses,fittings,exhaust and air inlet pipe,etc,temperature probe,2 batteries and boxes,smart battery to battery charger and labour......

I'm very happy with mine....

I have no problem with window cleaners using immersion elements either....

Each to their own......👍

[dazmond]

Why does a diesel hot water system cost £5000+.........had a new boiler fitted in November for £1800 with a 10 year warranty.....I get constant hot water and it heats the house to boot.

Exactly - I have hot boxes for the pressure washers - 150 degrees - these cost around one third of what is being charged for "warm" water on tap

Darran

I know a pressure washing guy....he doesnt use his hot box too often because it gives off too much steam!(he can't see what he s cleaning!)...so he says....😄

[NWH]

I might put an element in the garage static too get it hotter 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[tlwcs]

I might put an element in the garage static too get it hotter 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

You won’t have time, your always on here

[NWH]

That’s because I don’t have to rush round during the day 😉