[֍Winp®oClean֍]

Just watched Panorama and was surprised to learn that the main player is one of my customers!!!!! If I had known I would have stuck another 100 quid on!

[Phil J]

Louis Hamilton 

[slap bash]

The government has the cheek to expect us working class to pay our tax while the rich don`t. And when the rich banks collapse we must bail them out.Even the cabinet ministers in parliament don`t pay on money earned in our country. It`s offshore, it's legal they say. |But moral it`s not as we can not do the same. Most y rich person is involved. The financial investment advisers help them screw us.

[Soupy]

The most pointless 'scandal' ever. None of these people have done anything wrong. Naming them is pointless.

Name the charlatans within the government and HMRC who have allowed these loopholes to exist and in many cases advised the rich how to exploit them.

[Shrek]

The most pointless 'scandal' ever.

None of these people have done anything wrong. Naming them is pointless. Name the charlatans within the government and HMRC who have allowed these loopholes to exist and in many cases advised the rich how to exploit them.

Exactly- the rich have been using legal ways to pay less tax . If it’s legal then good for them, I’d do the same if I was super rich too .... and one day I will be 

[robert mitchell]

They may be doing things to the letter of the law but not in the spirit of the law , its immoral failing to pay tax that they know they rightly owe .

[Missing Link]

Name the charlatans within the government and HMRC who have allowed these loopholes to exist and in many cases advised the rich how to exploit them.

+1

Those loop holes don't get there by accident.

[PHILIP HARDY]

These avoiders are taking money off every single one of us, The education and Health systems are ridiculessly underfunded compared with many of our international rivals, as for many years, we have put the persuit of money and profit, in front of the future, it now comes to the point where lives are being shortened and the next generation will not be educated well enough to find a solution, we have been failed by politicians for many ,many years.

[Slacky]

That’s all very true.

[Soupy]

These avoiders are taking money off every single one of us, The education and Health systems are ridiculessly underfunded compared with many of our international rivals, as for many years, we have put the persuit of money and profit, in front of the future, it now comes to the point where lives are being shortened and the next generation will not be educated well enough to find a solution, we have been failed by politicians for many ,many years.

Not the tax avoider's fault. They have broken no laws.

It's utterly ridiculous, the government is responsible for setting the laws, no one else, the blame lies entirely with them. If the government came out tomorrow and said 'if you clean windows you don't have to pay any tax', every single one of us would stop paying tax, regardless if we consider it morally correct or not.

[robert mitchell]

These avoiders are taking money off every single one of us, The education and Health systems are ridiculessly underfunded compared with many of our international rivals, as for many years, we have put the persuit of money and profit, in front of the future, it now comes to the point where lives are being shortened and the next generation will not be educated well enough to find a solution, we have been failed by politicians for many ,many years.

Not the tax avoider's fault. They have broken no laws.

It's utterly ridiculous, the government is responsible for setting the laws, no one else, the blame lies entirely with them. If the government came out tomorrow and said 'if you clean windows you don't have to pay any tax', every single one of us would stop paying tax, regardless if we consider it morally correct or not.

It’s still their fault , you close one loophole then another one is found .

Louis Hamilton’s private jet is a prime example , using shell companies where one of his  company’s buys the jet , they lease it to another shell company who then lease it to Hamilton, he knows he is cheating the system .

[Dry Clean]

I'm just thankful my name wasn't mentioned, luckily enough the Queen God bless her took the flak away from me.

[Soupy]

These avoiders are taking money off every single one of us, The education and Health systems are ridiculessly underfunded compared with many of our international rivals, as for many years, we have put the persuit of money and profit, in front of the future, it now comes to the point where lives are being shortened and the next generation will not be educated well enough to find a solution, we have been failed by politicians for many ,many years.

Not the tax avoider's fault. They have broken no laws.

It's utterly ridiculous, the government is responsible for setting the laws, no one else, the blame lies entirely with them. If the government came out tomorrow and said 'if you clean windows you don't have to pay any tax', every single one of us would stop paying tax, regardless if we consider it morally correct or not.

It’s still their fault , you close one loophole then another one is found .

Louis Hamilton’s private jet is a prime example , using shell companies where one of his  company’s buys the jet , they lease it to another shell company who then lease it to Hamilton, he knows he is cheating the system .

Don't be daft, he'll have no idea, same as most of these people. The schemes are set up by accountants, usually former HMRC employees, and are really complicated.

Hamilton will have been asked, do you want to avoid £xxMillion in tax. Asked that question there is only one reply that, if you're honest, you'd give: Is it legal?

[tony day]

The government has the cheek to expect us working class to pay our tax while the rich don`t. And when the rich banks collapse we must bail them out.Even the cabinet ministers in parliament don`t pay on money earned in our country. It`s offshore, it's legal they say. |But moral it`s not as we can not do the same. Most y rich person is involved. The financial investment advisers help them screw us.

Your very profound ent ya!

[Soupy]

It's like leaving the stable door open and blaming the horse for running away.

[Soupy]

It’s still their fault , you close one loophole then another one is found .

It's only difficult because they make it difficult.

The media can report tax avoiders all day long and we can all be outraged and repulsed at their lack of moral fibre, but it achieves nothing. Do you think we're going to shame them into paying tax they are not legally required to pay? Seems unlikely to me, one or two, maybe, but then what's that? A tax on morals? To me, that seems worse.

The problem is systemic. Until the government sort the system and make it fair, people with the resources and opportunity to exploit it, will exploit it.

[Steve Newres]

The most pointless 'scandal' ever. None of these people have done anything wrong. Naming them is pointless.

Name the charlatans within the government and HMRC who have allowed these loopholes to exist and in many cases advised the rich how to exploit them.

Almost totally agree. We all act in the most tax efficient means we can. We share our tax benefits with partners, we go limited and pay dividends, pension contributions etc.  The difference here is that those that make the laws seem to do so in a way that benefits big business and often the friends of the law makers. So it is a "cozy"  arrangement. Then they demonise the single mum that can barely feed her children.

[Soupy]

David Mitchell puts it better than me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmR5aun7WqY

A bit sweary...

[Missing Link]

Hamilton will have been asked, do you want to avoid £xxMillion in tax. Asked that question there is only one reply that, if you're honest, you'd give: Is it legal?

Apparently not; he signed saying it was being used for business purposes only and then took it on holiday to Hawaii.

HMRC is investigating him according to Question Time.

[robert mitchell]

Hamilton will have been asked, do you want to avoid £xxMillion in tax. Asked that question there is only one reply that, if you're honest, you'd give: Is it legal?

Apparently not; he signed saying it was being used for business purposes only and then took it on holiday to Hawaii.

HMRC is investigating him according to Question Time.

They showed the form on the program , he put i think it was an 85/15 split on business /private use .......usage is more like the other way round but even if his split was correct he should still have payed vat on 15% of the purchase price but payed nothing .

[Soupy]

Hamilton will have been asked, do you want to avoid £xxMillion in tax. Asked that question there is only one reply that, if you're honest, you'd give: Is it legal?

Apparently not; he signed saying it was being used for business purposes only and then took it on holiday to Hawaii.

HMRC is investigating him according to Question Time.

They showed the form on the program , he put i think it was an 85/15 split on business /private use .......usage is more like the other way round but even if his split was correct he should still have payed vat on 15% of the purchase price but payed nothing .

So the scandal is 'racing driver doesn't understand tax form.'

[Steve Newres]

Does anyone use their vans for private use yet claim 100% relief for their business?

[Soupy]

Does anyone use their vans for private use yet claim 100% relief for their business?

No one.

[robert mitchell]

Hamilton will have been asked, do you want to avoid £xxMillion in tax. Asked that question there is only one reply that, if you're honest, you'd give: Is it legal?

Apparently not; he signed saying it was being used for business purposes only and then took it on holiday to Hawaii.

HMRC is investigating him according to Question Time.

They showed the form on the program , he put i think it was an 85/15 split on business /private use .......usage is more like the other way round but even if his split was correct he should still have payed vat on 15% of the purchase price but payed nothing .

So the scandal is 'racing driver doesn't understand tax form.'

Ignorance is not a defense , you can’t tell me that he didn’t have any discussion about how they would avoid the tax on his new toy .

I claim van costs per mile and only claim business mileage , I would condemn anyone that cheats the system and stops the poorest , sick , disabled , mentally ill people getting the help they need .

Far too much greed in this world .

[JandS]

He's done nothing wrong....good accounting to maximise profits....blame successive governments for not sorting it.
Would you like to buy this van without the VAT legally sir....oooh no stick the extra £3600 on the bill.

[Soupy]

Ignorance is not a defense , you can’t tell me that he didn’t have any discussion about how they would avoid the tax on his new toy .

You're right, it's not. That's not the point I was making though.

The story should not be Hamilton, Bono, or any other 'tax avoider'. If Hamilton has broken the law then he's broken the law, most of the paradise papers are about perfectly legal tax avoidance schemes, they are the real story, why are they not illegal? All this celebrity pish is just a distraction from the actual problem.

[johnwillan]

David Mitchell puts it better than me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmR5aun7WqY

Very good 😊
A bit sweary...

[robert mitchell]

He's done nothing wrong....good accounting to maximise profits....blame successive governments for not sorting it.
Would you like to buy this van without the VAT legally sir....oooh no stick the extra £3600 on the bill.

Yes he has , just because something is legal doesn't always make it right( hunting animals just for sport is legal and i think that is very wrong ) ........... also he lied about the ratio between business and private use.

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

If you avoid paying the right amount of tax then you have no right to complain about the state of the nhs, the lack of affordable housing, police not turning up because they are so stretched.......its an almost endless list.

[Soupy]

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

So lets vilify the laws and law makers. Not those that exploit them. The media bumping their gums about people who avoid paying tax legally achieves absolutely nothing. MAKE AVOIDING TAX ILLEGAL.

If Hamilton lied, he lied and will have to pay more tax. He isn't the problem.

[Dry Clean]

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

So lets vilify the laws and law makers. Not those that exploit them. Bumping your gums about people who avoid paying tax legally achieves absolutely nothing. MAKE AVOIDING TAX ILLEGAL.

If Hamilton lied, he lied and will have to pay more tax. He isn't the problem.

We cant keep blaming the law for our own flaws, these are beyond selfish greedy people who in many cases wouldn't even miss the tax.
Yes change the law but don't let the fact that its legal let these disgusting scumbags off the hook, there was a tv programme on
last week called how the super wealthy spend their money, throwing away brand new one million pound kitchens and so on.
the show actually explained that these people are that wealthy they don't give a toss about money unless it comes to paying tax.
Guillotine them all.

[Soupy]

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

So lets vilify the laws and law makers. Not those that exploit them. Bumping your gums about people who avoid paying tax legally achieves absolutely nothing. MAKE AVOIDING TAX ILLEGAL.

If Hamilton lied, he lied and will have to pay more tax. He isn't the problem.

We cant keep blaming the law for our own flaws, these are beyond selfish greedy people who in many cases wouldn't even miss the tax.
Yes change the law but don't let the fact that its legal let these disgusting scumbags off the hook, there was a tv programme on
last week called how the super wealthy spend their money, throwing away brand new one million pound kitchens and so on.
the show actually explained that these people are that wealthy they don't give a toss about money unless it comes to paying tax.
Guillotine them all.

Besides murder, what are you suggesting here? That we shame them into paying? Do you think that will work?

[robert mitchell]

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

So lets vilify the laws and law makers. Not those that exploit them. The media bumping their gums about people who avoid paying tax legally achieves absolutely nothing. MAKE AVOIDING TAX ILLEGAL.

If Hamilton lied, he lied and will have to pay more tax. He isn't the problem.

Im all for making tax avoidance illegal .........that doesn't excuse people like hamilton and others that are avoiding paying tax that they know full well they owe ........and that goes right down to the self employed taking cash and not declaring it , or lying about expenses, something an employed person can not do , there needs to be a level playing field .

[Soupy]

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

So lets vilify the laws and law makers. Not those that exploit them. The media bumping their gums about people who avoid paying tax legally achieves absolutely nothing. MAKE AVOIDING TAX ILLEGAL.

If Hamilton lied, he lied and will have to pay more tax. He isn't the problem.

Im all for making tax avoidance illegal .........that doesn't excuse people like hamilton and others that are avoiding paying tax that they know full well they owe ........and that goes right down to the self employed taking cash and not declaring it , or lying about expenses, something an employed person can not do , there needs to be a level playing field .

You need to forget about Hamilton. If he has done something illegal, he'll have to pay. The celebrity angle is just a distraction from the actual problem.

[robert mitchell]

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

So lets vilify the laws and law makers. Not those that exploit them. Bumping your gums about people who avoid paying tax legally achieves absolutely nothing. MAKE AVOIDING TAX ILLEGAL.

If Hamilton lied, he lied and will have to pay more tax. He isn't the problem.

We cant keep blaming the law for our own flaws, these are beyond selfish greedy people who in many cases wouldn't even miss the tax.
Yes change the law but don't let the fact that its legal let these disgusting scumbags off the hook, there was a tv programme on
last week called how the super wealthy spend their money, throwing away brand new one million pound kitchens and so on.
the show actually explained that these people are that wealthy they don't give a toss about money unless it comes to paying tax.
Guillotine them all.

Besides murder, what are you suggesting here? That we shame them into paying? Do you think that will work?

These people appear to have no shame or any sense of social responsibility ......but shaming people is not far from the truth .

Look at lord ashcroft in that documentary , if he had nothing to be ashamed of then why did he keep running away?

Its the attitude of the country as a whole that is ok to avoid tax , duty free at airports etc that needs changing through education.

[robert mitchell]

There are people who make a lot of money from getting around every change in the law thats made , add to that the conflicts of interest that some(most) politicians have .

So lets vilify the laws and law makers. Not those that exploit them. The media bumping their gums about people who avoid paying tax legally achieves absolutely nothing. MAKE AVOIDING TAX ILLEGAL.

If Hamilton lied, he lied and will have to pay more tax. He isn't the problem.

Im all for making tax avoidance illegal .........that doesn't excuse people like hamilton and others that are avoiding paying tax that they know full well they owe ........and that goes right down to the self employed taking cash and not declaring it , or lying about expenses, something an employed person can not do , there needs to be a level playing field .

You need to forget about Hamilton. If he has done something illegal, he'll have to pay. The celebrity angle is just a distraction from the actual problem.

Its not just about whats legal and illegal , its the entitled attitude.

[JandS]

Claiming fuel costs back on your tax form is avoidance...in fact every little thing you claim back against your tax is a form of tax avoidance so really there is no such thing as tax avoidance....if you owe it and don't pay that is tax evasion which is illegal.

[robert mitchell]

Claiming fuel costs back on your tax form is avoidance...in fact every little thing you claim back against your tax is a form of tax avoidance so really there is no such thing as tax avoidance....if you owe it and don't pay that is tax evasion which is illegal.

no it isn't , thats a legitimate cost of running your business.

[robert mitchell]

Claiming fuel costs back on your tax form is avoidance...in fact every little thing you claim back against your tax is a form of tax avoidance so really there is no such thing as tax avoidance....if you owe it and don't pay that is tax evasion which is illegal.

The only difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion is the legality of it , both are morally wrong .

I think you completely misunderstand what tax avoidance is , claiming legitimate expenses is not tax avoidance , you are taxed on your profit , if you channel that profit through a tax haven and avoid uk tax that is tax avoidance , not necessarily illegal but still morally wrong .

[Soupy]

Pension schemes are tax avoidance, is that immoral?

[robert mitchell]

Pension schemes are tax avoidance, is that immoral?

No , because you pay tax on the income you receive from it when you retire .

[JandS]

Claiming legitimate expenses still means you're effectively avoiding tax but legitimately  just like these people are legitimately avoiding tax.
Morals as got nothing to do with it.

[robert mitchell]

Claiming legitimate expenses still means you're effectively avoiding tax but legitimately  just like these people are legitimately avoiding tax.
Morals as got nothing to do with it.

Oh dear , have a word with yourself ......tax is only payable on profit .....PROFIT , not turnover .

You cant avoid paying tax that you never owed in the first place.

[Shrek]

Hmm , I do like having  a limited company.
The main advantage is paying less tax than a sole trader , that’s because I can pay myself a small wage so I don’t get taxed and then pay myself dividends (which I also don’t get taxed on) .....

It’s not just celebrities who do it, maybe some people just haven’t legally done what they can to avoid paying tax .

Happy days 

[robert mitchell]

Hmm , I do like having  a limited company.
The main advantage is paying less tax than a sole trader , that’s because I can pay myself a small wage so I don’t get taxed and then pay myself dividends (which I also don’t get taxed on) .....

It’s not just celebrities who do it, maybe some people just haven’t legally done what they can to avoid paying tax .

Happy days 

Do you not pay corporation tax then?

[Soupy]

Hmm , I do like having  a limited company.
The main advantage is paying less tax than a sole trader , that’s because I can pay myself a small wage so I don’t get taxed and then pay myself dividends (which I also don’t get taxed on) .....

It’s not just celebrities who do it, maybe some people just haven’t legally done what they can to avoid paying tax .

Happy days 

Do you not pay corporation tax then?

Yes. At a lower rate than PAYE. (I pay myself via PAYE by the way)

[Soupy]

Pension schemes are tax avoidance, is that immoral?

No , because you pay tax on the income you receive from it when you retire .

Yes but at a lower rate.

[Shrek]

Corporation tax is 19% on profits , going down to 17% by 2020.

The main reason for people making their company a limited one is for tax efficiency. As in they don’t have to pay as much tax as they would if they were a sole trader.

Oh but that’s different to the celebrity’s doing it because it’s on a smaller scale - is that right ?

[robert mitchell]

Corporation tax is 19% on profits , going down to 17% by 2020.

The main reason for people making their company a limited one is for tax efficiency. As in they don’t have to pay as much tax as they would if they were a sole trader.

Oh but that’s different to the celebrity’s doing it because it’s on a smaller scale - is that right ?

Doesn't matter who is doing it , your paying the correct rate of corporation tax ......... but if you were funnelling your income through ireland to pay less tax on money you earned here that would be immoral, apple for instance have been avoiding around 4-5 hundred million a year in tax doing that .

[JandS]

Claiming legitimate expenses still means you're effectively avoiding tax but legitimately  just like these people are legitimately avoiding tax.
Morals as got nothing to do with it.

Oh dear , have a word with yourself ......tax is only payable on profit .....PROFIT , not turnover.


You cant avoid paying tax that you never owed in the first place.

By lowering your profit through claiming  expenses you're still avoiding tax legit or otherwise....have a word with yourself.

[Soupy]

Oh well, let's all just be outraged at evil, immoral 'celebs' like Mr Mitchell. That'll help.

Thoughts and prayers are with you.

[robert mitchell]

Claiming legitimate expenses still means you're effectively avoiding tax but legitimately  just like these people are legitimately avoiding tax.
Morals as got nothing to do with it.

Oh dear , have a word with yourself ......tax is only payable on profit .....PROFIT , not turnover.
By lowering your profit through claiming  expenses you're still avoiding tax legit or otherwise....have a word with yourself.

You cant avoid paying tax that you never owed in the first place.

Dont be daft , you have not earned any money until you make a profit.

or , if you dont make a profit , you cant take any money out , to spend , on your living expenses etc .

I find it difficult to believe anyone with the get up and go to be self employed is that stupid ......so i can only assume your trolling.

[robert mitchell]

Oh well, let's all just be outraged at evil, immoral 'celebs' like Mr Mitchell. That'll help.

Thoughts and prayers are with you.

I dont believe in god so dont bother praying for me.

You could be like soupy and completely ignore the fact that im not talking only about celebs , read back through the posts , i said it applies to everyone from the sole trader to the richest companies and yes celebs .

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

Just to clarify... my client is the tax alchemist, not Lewis Hamilton!!

[p1w1]

Just to clarify... my client is the tax alchemist, not Lewis Hamilton!!

That makes this whole thread pointless now 

[Soupy]

Oh well, let's all just be outraged at evil, immoral 'celebs' like Mr Mitchell. That'll help.

Thoughts and prayers are with you.

I dont believe in god so dont bother praying for me.

You could be like soupy and completely ignore the fact that im not talking only about celebs , read back through the posts , i said it applies to everyone from the sole trader to the richest companies and yes celebs .

So where are the outraged media stories about JandS then?

[Soupy]

I dont believe in god so dont bother praying for me.

I was being facetious, thoughts and prayers are equally as effective as your outrage.

[robert mitchell]

Oh well, let's all just be outraged at evil, immoral 'celebs' like Mr Mitchell. That'll help.

Thoughts and prayers are with you.

I dont believe in god so dont bother praying for me.

You could be like soupy and completely ignore the fact that im not talking only about celebs , read back through the posts , i said it applies to everyone from the sole trader to the richest companies and yes celebs .

So where are the outraged media stories about JandS then?

Whats the media got to do with my opinion on tax avoidance?

I know nothing about jands to be outraged about.

[Soupy]

Whats the media got to do with my opinion on tax avoidance?

I know nothing about jands to be outraged about.

My entire point is that being outraged at tax avoiders is utterly futile. The media have spun this to make it look like it's all Lewis Hamilton and Bono's fault.

It's not. Incorrect form aside, none of these people have done anything illegal, MAKE IT ILLEGAL.

A tax on morality is worse. Only people with a conscience need to pay tax? No thanks.

[robert mitchell]

Whats the media got to do with my opinion on tax avoidance?

I know nothing about jands to be outraged about.

My entire point is that being outraged at tax avoiders is utterly futile. The media have spun this to make it look like it's all Lewis Hamilton and Bono's fault.

It's not. Incorrect form aside, none of these people have done anything illegal, MAKE IT ILLEGAL.

A tax on morality is worse. Only people with a conscience need to pay tax? No thanks.

Explain exactly which laws you would change to make it illegal?

Explain how you stop these creative accountants from finding new loopholes that you hadnt even thought of when you changed these laws?

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

Just to clarify... my client is the tax alchemist, not Lewis Hamilton!!

That makes this whole thread pointless now 

Just thought I would add it to the mix!!

[Don Kee]

Whats the media got to do with my opinion on tax avoidance?

I know nothing about jands to be outraged about.

My entire point is that being outraged at tax avoiders is utterly futile. The media have spun this to make it look like it's all Lewis Hamilton and Bono's fault.

It's not. Incorrect form aside, none of these people have done anything illegal, MAKE IT ILLEGAL.

A tax on morality is worse. Only people with a conscience need to pay tax? No thanks.

Explain exactly which laws you would change to make it illegal?

Explain how you stop these creative accountants from finding new loopholes that you hadnt even thought of when you changed these laws?

Make the tax Law more black and white maybe...?

If you buy a biro, you must pay VAT
If you buy nappies, you must pay the VAT
If you buy a Van, you must pay the VAT
If you buy a plane, you must pay the VAT

None of this, 20% personall 80% business jobbie. None of this I just bought a guard dog to protect my water fed pole system as its an essential business cost. None of this whole, an offshore company has done this and that.
If you are a tax resident and you make a purchase, you pay VAT or is this too simplistic?

Would make it equal for everyone, only problem is then most soletraders will be in uproar as the argument will be, “but they can afford to take the extra hit...”

[Soupy]

Simplify the lot.

There are only loopholes because it's complicated.

It's only complicated so there are loopholes.

[Og]

Not sure vat on nappies is fair.

[JandS]

I'm not saying your avoiding tax altogether...what I am saying is your avoiding some of it by claiming your expenses back, legitimately, to lower your final profit figure from your turnover...the less expenses you claim back the more tax you pay.
I know it's all legally above board but....by claiming these legit expenses your effectively lowering your profit margin and thus your tax....so even a legit expense claim is still, in a way, a means of avoiding tax.
What I'm trying to say is they aren't paying the tax because like you they can offset things in certain ways to lower the tax bill.
In a way neither is tax avoidance because both ways are legit so in effect there is no such thing as tax avoidance.
You submit your tax return, the taxman either does or doesn't send you your tax bill and you either pay it if you owe it or not if you don't.
If, however, you get a nil return on your tax bill but your return is a crock of sh*t that is tax evasion.

[Dry Clean]

Whats the media got to do with my opinion on tax avoidance?

I know nothing about jands to be outraged about.

My entire point is that being outraged at tax avoiders is utterly futile. The media have spun this to make it look like it's all Lewis Hamilton and Bono's fault.

It's not. Incorrect form aside, none of these people have done anything illegal, MAKE IT ILLEGAL.

A tax on morality is worse. Only people with a conscience need to pay tax? No thanks.

Explain exactly which laws you would change to make it illegal?

Explain how you stop these creative accountants from finding new loopholes that you hadnt even thought of when you changed these laws?

Make the tax Law more black and white maybe...?

If you buy a biro, you must pay VAT
If you buy nappies, you must pay the VAT
If you buy a Van, you must pay the VAT
If you buy a plane, you must pay the VAT

None of this, 20% personall 80% business jobbie. None of this I just bought a guard dog to protect my water fed pole system as its an essential business cost. None of this whole, an offshore company has done this and that.
If you are a tax resident and you make a purchase, you pay VAT or is this too simplistic?

Would make it equal for everyone, only problem is then most soletraders will be in uproar as the argument will be, “but they can afford to take the extra hit...”

Madam Guillotine, starting with you and Soupy.

[Dry Clean]

I'm not saying your avoiding tax altogether...what I am saying is your avoiding some of it by claiming your expenses back, legitimately, to lower your final profit figure from your turnover...the less expenses you claim back the more tax you pay.
I know it's all legally above board but....by claiming these legit expenses your effectively lowering your profit margin and thus your tax....so even a legit expense claim is still, in a way, a means of avoiding tax.
What I'm trying to say is they aren't paying the tax because like you they can offset things in certain ways to lower the tax bill.
In a way neither is tax avoidance because both ways are legit so in effect there is no such thing as tax avoidance.
You submit your tax return, the taxman either does or doesn't send you your tax bill and you either pay it if you owe it or not if you don't.
If, however, you get a nil return on your tax bill but your return is a crock of sh*t that is tax evasion.

JandS come on man, if you spend 40p to make a £1 you haven't made a £1 you have made 60p, by claiming for the 40p your just
taking back the money you already had, if you don't claim it will have been taxed twice.

[JandS]

I know what your saying but by claiming your expenses back you are, in effect, avoiding tax.
Any expense claim against your tax bill is legally allowed tax avoidance.
What I'm saying is your avoidance is legal but so is there's.

[robert mitchell]

I know what your saying but by claiming your expenses back you are, in effect, avoiding tax.
Any expense claim against your tax bill is legally allowed tax avoidance.
What I'm saying is your avoidance is legal but so is there's.

Seriously dude , are you broken ?

[֍Winp®oClean֍]

Isn't this just the same as what "we" pay accountants for? To process our accounts in the most tax efficient way?

[Soupy]

You can choose to register to pay VAT at any point. You don't though, because it's not a legal requirement to do so until you turn over 85k in one year.

[Steve Newres]

In an ideal world we’d scrap all sales taxes and just tax income. That would throw the cat among the pigeons.

[slap bash]

It never fails to amaze me that when there is blatant injustice in our country which affects us all.  And we have to all pay to make up for the shortfall in taxation. There will be some short-sighted idiots supporting the unfair practice by the super-rich. Why do I ask is it posable they cannot see the truth for what it is?
Is it a case of just being different or just plain stupid. Surely as us, all being in the same boat face the same hardships.
Is it so difficult to see these loopholes were created by the rich a powerful to benefit there wealthy greedy needs?
|Do you as one that side with this point of view sees themselves as part of this class.
To me its a case of how we have been dumbed down so as not to see when we are been ripped off big time.

[Dry Clean]

It never fails to amaze me that when there is blatant injustice in our country which affects us all.  And we have to all pay to make up for the shortfall in taxation. There will be some short-sighted idiots supporting the unfair practice by the super-rich. Why do I ask is it posable they cannot see the truth for what it is?
Is it a case of just being different or just plain stupid. Surely as us, all being in the same boat face the same hardships.
Is it so difficult to see these loopholes were created by the rich a powerful to benefit there wealthy greedy needs?
|Do you as one that side with this point of view sees themselves as part of this class.
To me its a case of how we have been dumbed down so as not to see when we are been ripped off big time.

As I said on the VAT thread which is a good example of pleb mentality, the rich protect each other while plebs fight with each other over the scraps.

[slap bash]

you are so correct.