[takinatrip]

Just asking how much of a difference a 40 40 will make over my 300gpd ?
The water pressure here is low so I use a booster which takes it to about 80psi but even with that production rate is painfully slow.
I have fitted new filters and membranes and its still the same. Just looking at a way of speeding up production without breaking the bank.

[chris turner]

I started with a 450gpd system. It would generally take around 5-6 hours to fill a 400 litre tank, longer in winter.
My twin 4021 system ( basically a 4040 ) fills my 500 litre tank in 2 hours 15 minutes.
So yes it's much much quicker and well worth the money.

[nathankaye]

Ive not looked into the 4040 options but would I be right in thinking you dont use the 1/4 piping that makes the 350gpd SSSOOOO slow

[Spruce]

Ive not looked into the 4040 options but would I be right in thinking you dont use the 1/4 piping that makes the 350gpd SSSOOOO slow

Its the membranes that determine the speed of the r/o.  A 350gpd r/o is only going to produce that at perfect water temperature, perfect water pressure and perfect mineral content.
The 'day' is 24 hours and its an American gallon (4 Liters).

A 4040 uses 1/2" piping. It needs a flow rate at the tap of 9 lpm and needs optimum pressure.

If you need a booster pump with a 350gpd you will definitely need one with a 4040.

My 4040 produces 2lpm of pure with 2lpm going to the drain (waste.) Tap water pressure 50psi, no booster, HF5 membrane and water flow rate of 13lpm from the supply tap.

.

[chris turner]

Ive not looked into the 4040 options but would I be right in thinking you dont use the 1/4 piping that makes the 350gpd SSSOOOO slow

1/2 piping on the bigger systems. Changing a 350gpd system to 1/2 piping won't make the slightest bit of difference to water production.

[chris turner]

Ive not looked into the 4040 options but would I be right in thinking you dont use the 1/4 piping that makes the 350gpd SSSOOOO slow

Its the membranes that determine the speed of the r/o.  A 350gpd r/o is only going to produce that at perfect water temperature, perfect water pressure and perfect mineral content.
The 'day' is 24 hours and its an American gallon (4 Liters).

A 4040 uses 1/2" piping. It needs a flow rate at the tap of 9 lpm and needs optimum pressure.

If you need a booster pump with a 350gpd you will definitely need one with a 4040.

My 4040 produces 2lpm of pure with 2lpm going to the drain (waste.) Tap water pressure 50psi, no booster, HF5 membrane and water flow rate of 13lpm from the supply tap.

.

Spruce do you disconnect your RO from the resin when first switching on your system each day to let the TDs from the RO to drop down?
I seem to be changing resin more often then my calculations suggest I should be. I wonder if its because of the first few minutes of higher TDs water running through the resin whilst the RO settles down to about 9-10 ppm.

[Spruce]

Ive not looked into the 4040 options but would I be right in thinking you dont use the 1/4 piping that makes the 350gpd SSSOOOO slow

Its the membranes that determine the speed of the r/o.  A 350gpd r/o is only going to produce that at perfect water temperature, perfect water pressure and perfect mineral content.
The 'day' is 24 hours and its an American gallon (4 Liters).

A 4040 uses 1/2" piping. It needs a flow rate at the tap of 9 lpm and needs optimum pressure.

If you need a booster pump with a 350gpd you will definitely need one with a 4040.

My 4040 produces 2lpm of pure with 2lpm going to the drain (waste.) Tap water pressure 50psi, no booster, HF5 membrane and water flow rate of 13lpm from the supply tap.

.

Spruce do you disconnect your RO from the resin when first switching on your system each day to let the TDs from the RO to drop down?
I seem to be changing resin more often then my calculations suggest I should be. I wonder if its because of the first few minutes of higher TDs water running through the resin whilst the RO settles down to about 9-10 ppm.

I don't tbh Chris.

My son and son in law used to draw water when I wasn't around so I didn't bother teaching them how to do it. For me the most important was having a system that would automatically replenish the water they drew so our IBC tank was always full for the next person. Most times when I came in in the evening, I didn't know if water had been taken or not.

Our water is between 76 and 99ppm from the tap. The r/o takes it down to between 1 and 2ppm. Whilst that is fine for normal day to day window cleaning, I insist that the water we clean with is 000ppm. A 7 liter di vessel lasts about a year before the output goes up to 1, so for me its not really worth the chew on.

I'm also not a good example to follow when it comes to flushing. I think the last flush I did was about a month ago.

.

[Spruce]

Just asking how much of a difference a 40 40 will make over my 300gpd ?
The water pressure here is low so I use a booster which takes it to about 80psi but even with that production rate is painfully slow.
I have fitted new filters and membranes and its still the same. Just looking at a way of speeding up production without breaking the bank.

I had a 450gpd r/o before I replaced it with a 4040.

When I saw how fast the 4040 produced water compared to my 450gpd I had a smile on my face that lasted a long time. I should have done it ages ago as we were always struggling for water. On the odd occasion I didn't have enough for my van as the lads (son and son in law) came first.

.

[nathankaye]

Just asking how much of a difference a 40 40 will make over my 300gpd ?
The water pressure here is low so I use a booster which takes it to about 80psi but even with that production rate is painfully slow.
I have fitted new filters and membranes and its still the same. Just looking at a way of speeding up production without breaking the bank.

I had a 450gpd r/o before I replaced it with a 4040.

When I saw how fast the 4040 produced water compared to my 450gpd I had a smile on my face that lasted a long time. I should have done it ages ago as we were always struggling for water. On the odd occasion I didn't have enough for my van as the lads (son and son in law) came first.

.

Side point, but why dont your son n son inlaw produce their own water?

[Dry Clean]

Ive not looked into the 4040 options but would I be right in thinking you dont use the 1/4 piping that makes the 350gpd SSSOOOO slow

Its the membranes that determine the speed of the r/o.  A 350gpd r/o is only going to produce that at perfect water temperature, perfect water pressure and perfect mineral content.
The 'day' is 24 hours and its an American gallon (4 Liters).

A 4040 uses 1/2" piping. It needs a flow rate at the tap of 9 lpm and needs optimum pressure.

If you need a booster pump with a 350gpd you will definitely need one with a 4040.

My 4040 produces 2lpm of pure with 2lpm going to the drain (waste.) Tap water pressure 50psi, no booster, HF5 membrane and water flow rate of 13lpm from the supply tap.

.

Spruce do you disconnect your RO from the resin when first switching on your system each day to let the TDs from the RO to drop down?
I seem to be changing resin more often then my calculations suggest I should be. I wonder if its because of the first few minutes of higher TDs water running through the resin whilst the RO settles down to about 9-10 ppm.

My 4040 takes the tds from around 240ppm down to 2ppm for the first few years and its now sitting around 4ppm, I put my
water through the resin on demand and 11lts lasts well over a year before even going to 1ppm which could still use if I wanted to,
I could even get away without using resin altogether but it costs me peanuts to polish the water of to 000 so why not.

[chris turner]

My tap TDs is 349, RO brings it down to 10.
7 litre resin vessel lasts about 6 weeks before rising to 1.
It can hold on 1 for a week or 2 before it rises and I normally change it as soon as it hits 3ppm.
I'm forever blaming the quality of resin but no matter what resin I use its the same.

[p1w1]

I disconnect the ro from the di vessel when I first switch on until the to is producing it's lowest tds. Probably the first 3-5 litres doesn't get used

[andyM]

I disconnect the ro from the di vessel when I first switch on until the to is producing it's lowest tds. Probably the first 3-5 litres doesn't get used

+1

[chris turner]

I disconnect the ro from the di vessel when I first switch on until the to is producing it's lowest tds. Probably the first 3-5 litres doesn't get used

I think I need to do the same and see if I can get longer resin life.
I suppose the only reason I don't now is laziness.
It's so easy to pull the van up, run hose to van, switch on system then forget about it for a couple of hours.

[p1w1]

All i did was put a john guest tap (t piece) just before the di vessel with  to save having to keep actually disconnecting it . My water has a very high tds around 550-600 and when i first switch it on there would be water over 100ppm going through the vessel and gradually coming down to about 17 after a minute or so  (its lowest).

[mufcglen]

im double di guys with a tds of around 76ppm and i used 4-500 litres a day, im going through a bag of mb115 every 2 months and been wondering would it be worth my while buying a 4040 ro to fit in the van as i dont want a storage tank at home.
my tap pressure feels average compared to other water flow's ive seen in taps at customers homes etc, how long would it take me roughly to fill about 500 litres up and would it be worth it investing in an 4040 ro over constantly buying a bag of resin every 2 months?

[p1w1]

im double di guys with a tds of around 76ppm and i used 4-500 litres a day, im going through a bag of mb115 every 2 months and been wondering would it be worth my while buying a 4040 ro to fit in the van as i dont want a storage tank at home.
my tap pressure feels average compared to other water flow's ive seen in taps at customers homes etc, how long would it take me roughly to fill about 500 litres up and would it be worth it investing in an 4040 ro over constantly buying a bag of resin every 2 months?

If it was me personally i would be switching to 40/40. In the longer term you would be better off with a tds of 76 the membrane is going to get it down to nearly zero. Depending on how fussy you are with having 0 tds you could possibly get away without having to use resin at all and if you did 1 bag would last years. For what you would spend currently over 2 years on resin that would pay for all your set up costs for a 40/40 and probably have a bit of change out of it.

[takinatrip]

Thanks for all the replies so my next question is whats the best value system to buy.

[p1w1]

Thanks for all the replies so my next question is whats the best value system to buy.

You need to see what your water flow rate is really to make sure a 40/40 is ok (think its something like minimum of 9lt per min but not 100% sure, i have 13lt per min with a booster pump and that works great) you've already stated you have low water pressure so your going to need a booster pump to go with it to get the best results (will be different to your current booster pump, that will be no good for a 40/40 if your using the basic aquatec style booster pump for your 350gpd system. But as to where you get good value 40/40 systems from, there are a few companies that won't sell you what you dont need... Gaps water, Daqua are a couple to mention personally i use Daqua for things like this (great service and usually slightly  cheaper than the others for the same thing).
Best thing to do is give them a ring they will tell you what your going to need. Also take into account 40/40 use half inch fittings so you're going to have to change all your fittings etc.

[Spruce]

Just asking how much of a difference a 40 40 will make over my 300gpd ?
The water pressure here is low so I use a booster which takes it to about 80psi but even with that production rate is painfully slow.
I have fitted new filters and membranes and its still the same. Just looking at a way of speeding up production without breaking the bank.

I had a 450gpd r/o before I replaced it with a 4040.

When I saw how fast the 4040 produced water compared to my 450gpd I had a smile on my face that lasted a long time. I should have done it ages ago as we were always struggling for water. On the odd occasion I didn't have enough for my van as the lads (son and son in law) came first.

.

Side point, but why dont your son n son inlaw produce their own water?

Son in law lived in a flat at the time so getting water from me was the easiest solution. He gave up window cleaning a couple of years ago and sold his van, believing he wasn't suited to being self employed as he didn't have the self discipline needed. He was doing our work which I passed onto another young couple to work for us. They provide their own water.

I started window cleaning when I lost my last job. I spend the first 3 years building up a round and changing it to wfp. So I had all the equipment I needed at home. Son later resigned from his job in 2008 and joined me so he just drew water from the IBC tank I had here.

SIL joined us in 2010 and cleaned with us for 4 years.

[craigR]

The water pressure at my place seems low to average to me at 11 and half litres per minute is this sufficient for a 40:40 without a booster pump ?

Thanks.
Craig

[8weekly]

Don't forget the halfway house of a Merlin.

[mufcglen]

how do you guys check the pressure at the tap,is there a gauge you can buy?

[p1w1]

The water pressure at my place seems low to average to me at 11 and half litres per minute is this sufficient for a 40:40 without a booster pump ?

Thanks.
Craig

Thats just a flow rate of the water, not the mains tap pressure, you need to see what this is really.

[p1w1]

how do you guys check the pressure at the tap,is there a gauge you can buy?

something like this http://www.screwfix.com/p/monument-tools-mains-water-pressure-test-gauge/82412 maybe cheaper elsewhere.

[mufcglen]

thanks pal, 2 more questions!!
the ro housing ive noticed theres 2 types, the stainless one and the white plasic champ housing, which is better?
secondly the 10 or 20 inch prefilters, looking on daqua site says they need to be replaced every 20'000 litres surely your gonna go through a few of them every few weeks?

[p1w1]

thanks pal, 2 more questions!!
the ro housing ive noticed theres 2 types, the stainless one and the white plasic champ housing, which is better?
secondly the 10 or 20 inch prefilters, looking on daqua site says they need to be replaced every 20'000 litres surely your gonna go through a few of them every few weeks?

Not sure really i use the plastic version and its solid and has been fine (my thinking  was that it might have a better insulation for the membrane in the freezing temperatures then the metal version)
As for filter size personal preference really i guess. I use 10" ones as i already had them. I would say get your sediment filter housing in the clear version, its much easier to see when its getting green and needs changing instead of having to keep unscrewing it to check.
Pre filters will always be recommended to change at certain times no matter what system you use. Fibredyne filters are supposed to be changed less frequent then your standard carbon filter but the do cost more, i personally dont change mine that often as recommended, generally i change the carbon filter every 3-4 months and the pre filter once its gone green all the way through.
If you have a pressure gauge after your pre filters that can also help you know when its probably time to change them when the pressure starts dropping a bit.

[Spruce]

thanks pal, 2 more questions!!
the ro housing ive noticed theres 2 types, the stainless one and the white plasic champ housing, which is better?
secondly the 10 or 20 inch prefilters, looking on daqua site says they need to be replaced every 20'000 litres surely your gonna go through a few of them every few weeks?

Not sure really i use the plastic version and its solid and has been fine (my thinking  was that it might have a better insulation for the membrane in the freezing temperatures then the metal version)
As for filter size personal preference really i guess. I use 10" ones as i already had them. I would say get your sediment filter housing in the clear version, its much easier to see when its getting green and needs changing instead of having to keep unscrewing it to check.
Pre filters will always be recommended to change at certain times no matter what system you use. Fibredyne filters are supposed to be changed less frequent then your standard carbon filter but the do cost more, i personally dont change mine that often as recommended, generally i change the carbon filter every 3-4 months and the pre filter once its gone green all the way through.
If you have a pressure gauge after your pre filters that can also help you know when its probably time to change them when the pressure starts dropping a bit.

That's a good answer with regard to the difference between stainless and 'plastic' 4040 housings.

[Spruce]

thanks pal, 2 more questions!!
the ro housing ive noticed theres 2 types, the stainless one and the white plasic champ housing, which is better?
secondly the 10 or 20 inch prefilters, looking on daqua site says they need to be replaced every 20'000 litres surely your gonna go through a few of them every few weeks?

I went for 20" prefilter housings as the filters will last longer.

The 20" Fiberdyne carbon filter is good for 75,000 liters according to the suppliers spec. Doug from Daqua once posted that the chlorine content in the water will become less the further you are from the dosing station. So it could be that those filters could last even longer, but I stick with the 75k. The membrane is 5 years old next month and still performing to spec so this service schedule is working for me.

We are using less water than we did a few years ago.  A few years ago there was 3 of us drawing water from the system.  We were using about 26000liters of water a month through the r/o = waste and pure. As our waste to pure ratio is 1 to 1 we used about 13,000 of pure a month. (I have a water meter on the r/o.) So carbon block prefilter changes were done about every 3 months. As our water is full of sediment from time to time, I have be known to replace the sediment filter once a month.

I have a pressure gauge on each side of the prefilters. Once the gauges start to read a difference of 10psi I change the sediment filter. I'm approx 32,000 liters from the last filter change and it looks as though I will be replacing the sediment filter shortly.  I also recommend clear housings - they cost slightly more but you can visually see the state of the sediment prefilter without taking the filter out to inspect it as p1w1 says.

We got a warning tag in a set of GAC filters I purchased when I first bought the 4040. The label says it had a service life of 2500 USA gallons or 10000 liters.  Obviously if I used those then I would need to replace them every 10 days or so if we were still using the same amount of water as we did.
   

[takinatrip]

Ok so water pressure is 32 psi and flow rate of 6.5 ltr per min.
Is it going to work effectively?

Did someone mention a Merlin? Can you still buy these?

[andyM]

Ok so water pressure is 32 psi and flow rate of 6.5 ltr per min.
Is it going to work effectively?

Did someone mention a Merlin? Can you still buy these?

Looks like you will need a booster pump.

[JandS]

If your using 500 litres a day with TDS of 76 your going to have a lot of waste per week....mine is 100 and I've just gone double Di due to all the waste water....I am on a water meter though.
6000 litres to get 2500 litres pure a week would cost around £20 per week in water rates above your normal consumption so £80 per month on top of your normal water charges......if your not on a meter though your ok.

[mufcglen]

If your using 500 litres a day with TDS of 76 your going to have a lot of waste per week....mine is 100 and I've just gone double Di due to all the waste water....I am on a water meter though.
6000 litres to get 2500 litres pure a week would cost around £20 per week in water rates above your normal consumption so £80 per month on top of your normal water charges......if your not on a meter though your ok.

cheers mate yes im not on a water meter otherwise i'd have stuck with double di set up!
very confusing all this ro stuff

[johnny bravo]

I have often looked for advice about changing over from my 300 RO.     i use atm     around 2000 - 2500  some weeks,      it means RO goes on during day,    sometimes evenings,     i try to keep 2x220 butts full, as well as 500  tank in van
I work from the kitchen ,   my kitchen faces driveway, front of house,   mrs says no ibc tank in garden.    I have no access to water supply at rear of house.      I just cannot get my head round as how and where to set up a 4040,          if i had the vision and plumbing know how i think i would try a 4040 set up.
Has anyone set up a 4040 in my scenario.    house front water supply

[Terry A]

I've just bought a great R/O from pure freedom
Have a look on their website you should find one that suits your needs
You have to remember you only get what you pay for. Produce more water,clean more windows,earn more money
I also have poor water pressure so need their large booster pumps as well.it produces more in 2 hours than my old system did in 8. 😁😁

[takinatrip]

What did you buy Terry A?

[Dave Anderson]

johnny bravo >>>> Bury a 2000litre tank in the front with room for the 4040 then cover it over with something to hide over the inspection hatch.....  nothing for the neighbors or wife to worry about...easy peazy lemon squeezy... only thing to really sort is where the waste will go but perhaps you have that sorted.

There is nothing rocket science about a 4040.... just water in, filters, waste, good water into tank, sub pump for to get water from tank to van... Cheers Dave

>>> https://www.tanks-direct.co.uk/water-tanks/underground-tanks/plastic-underground-water-tanks/2000-litre-underground-water-tank.html

[mufcglen]

Are these any good from Brodex on offer?
http://www.brodexbms.co.uk/products/great-special-offers/ultra-low-pressure-membrane-stainless-steel-housing-bundle-40

[p1w1]

Are these any good from Brodex on offer?
http://www.brodexbms.co.uk/products/great-special-offers/ultra-low-pressure-membrane-stainless-steel-housing-bundle-40

I think you will find  your probably best to stay away from Brodex search on here to see what many people think of them and their customer service. It also doesnt state what type/make of membrane you are getting so they could be putting a cheap chinese membrane in thats not going to last long at all, if it was coming with a high spec best quality membrane then they would be advertising the fact.
Stick with a reputable company that are known to supply good quality membranes and systems... buy cheap buy twice.

[Spruce]

johnny bravo >>>> Bury a 2000litre tank in the front with room for the 4040 then cover it over with something to hide over the inspection hatch.....  nothing for the neighbors or wife to worry about...easy peazy lemon squeezy... only thing to really sort is where the waste will go but perhaps you have that sorted.

There is nothing rocket science about a 4040.... just water in, filters, waste, good water into tank, sub pump for to get water from tank to van... Cheers Dave

>>> https://www.tanks-direct.co.uk/water-tanks/underground-tanks/plastic-underground-water-tanks/2000-litre-underground-water-tank.html

One of Jonny's problems is that he only has a trickle of water from his tap. Everyone else who lives in the same city as he does has good water flow and pressure.
He really needs to investigate why he has a slow flow of water to his property when other's in the same city don't experience it.

It could have something to do with a previous resident not paying his water bill, who knows. In a case like that the water board insert a device to restrict the flow of water to that property. For health reasons they can't stop the supply altogether.

Jonny parks his van on the driveway, so there is nothing stopping him processing water directly into his van tank. The problem is he doesn't have enough water to run a big r/o.
.