[david68]

i give customers a choice with upvc cleans

choice 1....pole, brush, water & virosol.....is basic clean charge £?

choice 2.... using cream & non scratch scourers is restoration work for a better finish charge £££ more than basic

i tell them i cant restore f/s/g above connys, only basic, choice 1 because of reach

tony

Choice one is what she was told, until good neibour mention cream cleaner, which took him all day and next to do his own front. Then looking at all my equiment, then on evening i think he drummed ideas to the person not happy.

My house was two house together knocked through so at the front was four large bay windows (so this job was two house together not one)

[dazmond]

hi david sorry to hear your not well.hope your treatment goes well tomorrow.

i suppose that explains the 17 hours on the job.if you were fully fit you d get that job done a lot quicker im sure.

add on work is harder than regular maintenance window cleaning but even so i wouldnt be happy with the job judging by the pictures but id of paid you in full anyway after all your effort.

best wishes mate


dazmond

[david68]

hi david sorry to hear your not well.hope your treatment goes well tomorrow.

i suppose that explains the 17 hours on the job.if you were fully fit you d get that job done a lot quicker im sure.

add on work is harder than regular maintenance window cleaning but even so i wouldnt be happy with the job judging by the pictures but id of paid you in full anyway after all your effort.

best wishes mate


dazmond

This is getting confusing, the finished photos are not there, due to leaving job before taking them. but i have linked on this post my standards of work.

Maybe i have not worded it right, but these pictures are showing size of job with some pictures of before and after of the little photos i took when partly cleaned, Yes if this was my finished work i would not pay myself either

[david68]

Here is the link again

Not sure if i am linking it right?

http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=183915.msg1569673#msg1569673

[david68]

Also this is the size of property

Google mapped it

[david68]

Also this is the size of property

Google mapped it

This is an old photo before cleaning,

[Window Lickers]

window lickers im sure you will find this is standard procedure, as you can see another member who is quite successful also impliments this

One swallow doesnt make a summer.

[Clever Forum Name]

I think you have been stitched up by the owner 

I get the whole thread, and i have met customers like this before.

A chap told us we HAD to use sugar soap on his FSG. Told him no problem. Job was a quicky £50 for an hours work if that. Told him it would be £200 as using sugar soap will be far slower to apply by hand. He still wanted it doing, so like an idiot i did. I got paid the £200 and he still wasnt happy with the results. I done the whole lot again using ubik and he was over the moon. I asked for another £50 and the poop really hit the fan lol.

I got paid in the end though

[rosskesava]

Yeah, I think it was a stitch up as well.

The idea about the UPVC cleaner stuff was the excuse. If the OP had gone ahead and used it, she might have paid up as she would then have got a lot more work done for the same money. She knew how long it took when the neighbour used the stuff so she knew it'd take longer yet offered no more money.

[Spruce]

How would you use cream to clean on the house side of the conservatory?

I agree with the other posters - this is an excuse. A good customer gone bad. Keep her and you will end up with all sorts of issues later. If she didn't tell you how she expected the conservatory to be cleaned - just presumed how you would clean it - then this isn't your problem.

I would take small claims court action and never clean again.

[andyM]

David sounds like a nice bloke, particularly with his charity work and donations.
However a small minority of people seem to think nice people are a pushover, and I do think in this case the customer has seen it as an opportunity to take advantage and not pay the full price.

[Spruce]

David sounds like a nice bloke, particularly with his charity work and donations.
However a small minority of people seem to think nice people are a pushover, and I do think in this case the customer has seen it as an opportunity to take advantage and not pay the full price.

This my take on this as well Andy. They agreed a price to begin with and the customer moved the proverbial goal posts.

[david68]

Thanks guys for information, She will not be getting away with it as i have found me orginal quote.
Which mentions my method i will be using.
Just had alot going on and after hospital today, i will send her a letter of future actions.

You are right being too nice can be a bad thing, But another lesson is learnt by me, But i created some nice tools to get to the middle.

Glad some of you get my post, as i was getting a little stress thinking i am not explaining myself

[david68]

Update on my message to her as follows

Me:-
Window cleaner
Sorry you are unhappy and was thinking i was going to use upvc cream.

Looking back on my notes for quoting you, It does say i will be using chemicals to clean with ( which i did Maxima & Virosol and 800 litres of purified water.

As for your front door, this was not yet finished, as i know this door leaks quite badly if i water fed it.

But it would have been done by hand, but again not using a upvc cream cleaner.

My notes on quote also say as your conservatory is very long and panels are double sided, The blind spots will be scrubbed blind with very little pressure, may not be so good results as the areas of easy reach, but trying is better than not.

Anyway you look at one of my posts on facebook and the customer said that she was well pleased with my results and her roof looks new again.
These words are from a customers who is pleased,
Reason i mentioned this is because you said your roof does not look new again.
Sorry to say if you want new, best to buy new.
But it was clean using the same methods.

My notes state the words your upvc will look fresh again and clean.

Upvc cream i would never use or quote a job using it, Reason to busy and also it needs to be hand applied like polishing a car, alot of your areas your hands could not reach, but again if you mentioned this type of cleaning method you wanted, i would have not taken the job on or quoted it.

As a good will guester i would have cream your door and porch, but to my understanding you want it applied to every part of the upvc.

You quoted that your husband mentioned i was just cleaning it the same way i would do a standard window clean, This is far from the truth even by the hours spent, But on thinking that why did he not mention this to me or you the next day, All was mentioned as job was almost completed.

You offered some part of payment, which i refused at least till i went home to view further information.

Excuse any spelling mistakes and grammar i am typing this while have a two hour dose of chemotherapy.

Bottom Line my quote was £245 with the window cleaning included.
Hours grafted 17 in total plus chemicals ect.

So please advise your amount you would like to offer for my efforts.


HER REPLY WAS

You are getting nasty now, i am not happy with this,. You have not cleaned PVC Marks all over,
Window seels all still dirty where you can stand. Scratches on my roof due to your brush.
My front door does not leak if shut properly, I am so upset with your work, as i have always been pleased with my windows when you cleaned them.


My reply
You even said on my first part of the day, i am pleased so far looking good.
So i think the nasty part is from you.
I am not a nasty person who what i have written, when your mother passed away, i even gave you the £20 for windows back to buy flowers.
I believe if i was a nasty person i would have not been a victim to this con

[tompoole]

I always tell the customer it's a wash and not all white will look
New but if they wanted that then I can recommend a guy that
Recons upvc conservatories and his prices start at £200 per roof
Where all I offer is a spruce up from £50 dependant on size.
     Once I spay g101 with hot water the dirt falls away and the customer
Is over the moon. It's all about expectations. If I think the customer is really fussy ,
I always make sure they know what they are paying for  before I start.

[rosskesava]

'Clean' means exactly that and does not mean 'like new'.

The lady said that on the face book page another customers comments were 'looks like new'. The point is that those were a customers own choice of words and doesn't imply that David would make every conservatory 'look like new'.

The customer had false expectations and instead of paying for what was stated before hand to which she agreed, she then decided she wouldn't pay based on her own unstated false expectations.

I think the words 'reasonable' and 'fair' come into it as in 'is it reasonable and fair for her to pay for the work done or is it reasonable and fair for her to not pay for the work done'.

[Window Lickers]

I think you can kiss her goodbye as a customer  


Avoid the personal stuff about her mothers death. Its got nought to do with it. The judge will dismiss all that palarvar. Get a solicitors letter out to her. Leave it to them. If she texts you do not reply.

[Craigp]

I would have said "Excuse me we agreed a price, I have done a good job, now you need to pay, that's your end of the bargain"

The work has been done, if its not like new as she expected doesn't matter, you still did the work.

[davids3511]

how on earth has that job taken you 17 HOURS!!

f/s/g clean and roof and windows(i dont do gutter clearing)would have taken me around 5 hours.

roof     3 hours

f/s/g     1 hour

all windows and frames(and packing up) 1 hour

i would of charged £120 for roof.£60 for f/s/g plus the normal window clean price.

why havent you cleaned the edges of the conny roof?you can clearly see their still dirty.also the plastic struts and some panels still look a bit grubby.

this is how i would of done the job

f/s/g cleaned first and windows at the front of the property.pure water only.

next id clean the same on the sides and back(upper windows/f/s/g).

then id spray the finials and panels with virosol on the awkward side of the conservatory and use ladders and stand off.plug into customers outside tap and scrub and rinse everything lots of times paying particular attentions to finials and plastic struts.

then id spray a strong mix of virosol and clean the whole front and sides of the roof ,again paying a lot of attention to everything.really scrubbing and rinsing everything loads of times with high pressure from outside tap.

then id get up the ladder and check the whole roof and give a final rinse.

on to outside gutters on conservatory then switch back to pure for cleaning the windows.then pack everything away.job done.

5 hours.£200(if the normal window clean price is say £20)

Not even tempted to explain or comment of this above post. Seems like a previous customer of mine

Why not. I do quite a few connys, s/f/g's a year and Daz seems spot on to me. 17 hours is crazy. I bet they had it built quicker than that.

[Smudger]

One man 5 hours your having a laugh at 30 foot long ! And both sides particularly the back pitch towards the house. Personally it's well underpriced but neither the time or cost is the issue.

This is now quite complicated as you (by your own admission) have not finished the job, If you had and they were not happy my understanding is they should still pay for the work then make a formal complaint in writing then finally court action, with the work completed and refusal to pay you can take them to court, with your quote and pics you'd win hands down unless you wrote on the quote it will be better than new!

It has already become a personal thing between you, with little chance of settlement, it's a black art writing letters to these type of customers so no one get offended.

Get customers to pay up front ? And you decide what's acceptable ??

Sounds like the sort you see on rogue trader to me......😇

Darran