[Gav Camm lammy 283]

wot u saying im the bad crowd
lol  u ronnie biggs u 

[Perfect Windows]

It's got nothing to do with looking down on anyone.  It's to do with running a business.

Who is more likely to burgle a house or violently lose his temper with a customer?  Someone with a criminal record, or someone without one?  I'm asking in the real world here, as a general point.  I'm not suggesting that those of you who ARE rehabilitated would do it again, just which one of the two people is more likely to commit a burglary or assault.  I'm afraid that in the real world, it's the guy with the record.  Whether you like it or not, it is.  You obviously have worked your way through this.  Many (possibly most) people with records don't.

So, given that my customers have to be able to trust their cleaner, who should I employ?  What will happen to the reputation of my business if I send someone out who isn't rehabilitated who then commits some sort of crime against my customer?

I'm not looking at this emotionally; I'm looking at it from the point of view of a business.  As I've said, and you all seem to be ignoring this I would happily employ someone with a record in a role that didn't place them alone at customers' houses.  It's hardly a bigoted view.

there are people who learnt by there past and want to put things right, so why don't they deserve a chance, but you got to be a good judge of character to spot them as there is some wrong-ens.

I don't know how to tell one from the other, so I'm forced to take the blanket view I'm mentioning.

Vin

[mark dew]

Would you employ someone who has a criminal conviction, even if spent?

Yes, if I felt comfortable with the person and felt they could be an asset to the business.

So what happens to those who have unspent convictions? Depending on the conviction of course.
Does it mean;
- they couldn't work around vulnerable people at all?
- is it upto the discretion of the management of the areas worked?
- they can work but must be supervised?

[darren clarke]

doesnt it depend on what the criminal record is?

[G Griffin]

doesnt it depend on what the criminal record is?

Yes, but if it`s Yesterday by Guns N Roses, not a chance 

[KLEENAWAY]

iv been to jail does that mean u all look down on me on here, jail isnt just a place to punish criminals its a place where you go to rehabillitate and work on dealing with problems etc this cud be drink,anger,drugs etc if like me ya use ya time in jail to teach u about ur mistakes and come out and make a fresh start i think its good to give people a second chance, and for all those wondering what i done to go down i got cant dangerous driving in a ringered car 10days after being disqualified, im not a bad lad im actually one of the most honest lads u will meet but because iv got a criminal record from 5-6 yrs ago when i was 23-24 that still tars me as a bad person

Well said mate. Iv got a conviction for 2 counts of ABH from when i was working on the doors a couple years ago for fighting with 3 lads. Oh well poop happens, iv learnt my lesson and give up the doors  . I come from a good back ground but mistakes can happen and will, if some one decided not to give me a job then it would be their loss not mine

Danny

[P @ F]

I was once done for ABH with a fishing rod  , does that count  

But on a more serious note , 15 years ago i was facing 7 years for a stupid mindless prank , several of my friends and i were on the lash at christmas , we were out of it on vodka and whacky , we then got ejected from a pub rather harshley in my view by the locals , revenge was taken after closing time during a lock in , we got traced and sentenced to 3 years of which 2 of us served 18 months hard labour  

I then came out into the real world with no immediate prospects , couple of interviews bombed out due to record , then i applied for a position with a builder clean company , amazingly i got the job , after all anybody with a shady record can be a wc , obviously not true by some of the replies on this post !

The funny thing is , the company owner was an ex police chief , he was well aware of my record he gave me a second chance , and it paid off , he got several years of service from me , i moved on and set up on my own .

I do not at all regret what i did to the said pub , it was wrong to do what i did i know , but had i not have done it and get banged up , then i really dont know where i would have been today , in short i reckon all people should get a second chance , if they mess that up then there is no hope for them , personally if i have seen the ex con ,  i can tell you within 2 minutes if they will re offend , criminal records are not to be affraid of , in my case my offence actually turned my life around .

Regards Rich  

[Paul Coleman]

It's got nothing to do with looking down on anyone.  It's to do with running a business.

Who is more likely to burgle a house or violently lose his temper with a customer?  Someone with a criminal record, or someone without one?  I'm asking in the real world here, as a general point.

I do take your point but you are also asking "Who is more likely to burgle a house or violently lose his temper with a customer?  Someone who go caught or someone who didn't?"

It is a tough question really.
My own dim and distant past is very murky.  There are only two convictions for relatively minor stuff - the most recent being 34 years ago.  But those two convictions don't really tell the story.  OK I wasn't violent and didn't break into people's houses.  The person I hurt the most was myself.  So I was a drug addict.  Most of it was done legally with home office consent via the medical profession.  So what.  It's ancient history.  Not touched a thing in nearly a quarter century.  Most people on here take more drugs than me as I haven't even had a drink in all that time.  That part of my life bears no relation to the here and now.  I went to work regularly even in the darkest days.  The fact that I spent a lot of it on doctor's fees and a private prescription is not particularly relevant either.   There are always people who go against the stereotypes.
In fact, I would say that due to my past, I am less likely to offend because a guilty conscience is not a good bedfellow for abstinence.  Apart from that, I do have enough social awareness to understand the devastating effect on victims of crime.  Indeed, a few years into my recovery, I was actually burgled.  I felt I didn't deserve it because I had never done anything like that to anyone else  .  On the other hand, forgetting to shut a window properly was a bit silly 

My problems did not stem from innate badness.  They stemmed from inner emotional turmoil that I needed to block out and an inability to cope with life.  The probable causes of this state are not relevant here but I did come to terms with it all eventually.  To stay stopped, those are the things that need to be sorted.
Do I give a damn what anyone on here thinks of me.
Do I hell?
If someone on here didn't want to employ me because of my past then it would be their loss as they would be losing a conscientious, honest worker.  You would only need to ask the people from whom I've subbed work from.  Not saying I'm the fastest thing on two legs - far from it.  But I do do my best most of the time.

[Paul Coleman]

personally if i have seen the ex con ,  i can tell you within 2 minutes if they will re offend , criminal records are not to be affraid of , in my case my offence actually turned my life around .

Regards Rich  

Although it might not be the right choice 100% of the time, I reckon I would get it right most of the time too.  Maybe it's necessary (or at least helpful) to have been there yourself to be able to assess people accurately.

[dai]

I would only employ someone I could trust 100%, my judgment my call, previous offences irrelevant, trust is everything, and that's why I would sack any employee that lied to me.

[Londoner]

First of all, even if they have a string of convictions, you will only know if they choose to tell you about it.

The other thing is that not having a criminal record is no guarantee of anything. Some of the worst lazy unreliable petty pilfers haven't even got the drive and personal ambition to get themselves banged up.

[DaveG]

I had a Police record years ago.....























Walking on the Moon 

[Paul Coleman]

Some of the worst lazy unreliable petty pilfers haven't even got the drive and personal ambition to get themselves banged up.

I don't know if that was meant to be funny but it had me smiling 

[formb]

so all you stuck up lot your telling me you never made a mistake or just f**ked up. or you have and got away with it , so you can say you have never done anything,   cant quite see everyone is that squeaky clean, Ive made mistakes but i learnt by them, that's the main thing if the person learnt there lesson, there are a small few that never learn, that includes the so called squeaky clean lot

My argument is that my customers might not like having someone round the back of their house when they are out who isn't cleaner than clean.  My business pays my bills and feeds my kids.  Why should I risk my customers?

If I ran a busines where people were supervised, I'd have no problem at all employing someone with a criminal record. Our circumstances as w/c are different.

Vin

P.S. By the way, I can tell you honestly that I've never burgled anyone or thumped anyone or nicked a car or..., so it's not really a matter of "getting away with it", it's more a matter of never having done it.

Ever driven with a hangover? Or on your mobile phone?

[s.w.c]

I would only employ someone I could trust 100%, my judgment my call, previous offences irrelevant, trust is everything, and that's why I would sack any employee that lied to me.

well said that man,

[Perfect Windows]

Ever driven with a hangover? Or on your mobile phone?

1. No - don't drink

2. No - enjoy being alive

Vin

[formb]

Ever driven with a hangover? Or on your mobile phone?

1. No - don't drink

2. No - enjoy being alive

Vin

Geeez, are you the dullest man alive?

[s.w.c]

or lives in a monastery

[scud]

  Perfect Windows, is your real name Mr Perfect Windows.

  I have a criminal conviction, more than one as it happens, mostly from a mis-spent youth, but one from slightly later in life is for a very serious offence.

  Without going into details, which I won't on an open forum and to strangers I found myself in a "me or him" situation, it was "him".

  I didn't end up in clink due to the circumstances which were none of my making, but I did have to endure a Trial By Jury.

  I feel that those of you looking down on people with criminal convictions should think a bit deeper about what may happen if you were to find yourself in a situation that forced you to do something you didn't want to do, before you tar everyone with the same brush.

   I have never stolen a thing and am a very placid person by nature, but would not hesitate to defend myself in the same way again.

 

[Perfect Windows]

  I feel that those of you looking down on people with criminal convictions should think a bit deeper about what may happen if you were to find yourself in a situation that forced you to do something you didn't want to do, before you tar everyone with the same brush.

I'm not "looking down" on anyone.  My sole reasoning, in answer after answer, has been that I'm thinking about my customers.  Nothing more.  No-one seems willing to address that point.  You all get on your high horses and tell us there's something wrong with this attitude on a personal basis (hence "Looking down on", "all you stuck up lot", "small minded people", "does that mean u all look down on me on here", etc, etc).

Bear in mind that one of the first points I made was:

Depends on the conviction

So, faced with someone with a conviction for theft or robbery, I need to protect my business.  Sorry if it's harsh, but it's reality.

And as for all the snipes about whether I'm law-abiding or just lucky never to have been caught, I can honestly tell you that there is no point in my life when you would have risked anything being nicked if you'd left me alone anywhere.  Boring, maybe, but true.

Vin