[poleman]

I've been trad for the last 25yrs & never had a fall,I must be very very lucky according to the pole brigade! or heavens forbid that ladders are'nt the savage killers that they made out to be (or maybe thats how they justify to themselves the ludicrous amounts of money they spend, just to clean a few windows).
Ironicaly I know of a local pole monkey who tripped over & finished up with 6 stitches in a head wound whilst playing with his brush thing (should come with a health warning that wfp ha ha ). As for results I've picked up dozens & dozens of pole monkeys ex custy's, who think wfp is a joke whilst not losing a single custy to the pole monkeys !!!!! I rest my case.

The basic factor here is which one would you like to fall from! the ladder at height or the ground! I know which one I would like to fall from and its not the one that kills 3 to 7 window cleaners a year!

[Nathanael Jones]

I've been trad for the last 25yrs & never had a fall,I must be very very lucky according to the pole brigade! or heavens forbid that ladders are'nt the savage killers that they made out to be (or maybe thats how they justify to themselves the ludicrous amounts of money they spend, just to clean a few windows).
Ironicaly I know of a local pole monkey who tripped over & finished up with 6 stitches in a head wound whilst playing with his brush thing (should come with a health warning that wfp ha ha ). As for results I've picked up dozens & dozens of pole monkeys ex custy's, who think wfp is a joke whilst not losing a single custy to the pole monkeys !!!!! I rest my case.

So are you saying your ladder usage complies 100% with Current legislation?

Are you 100% sure you insurance (If you have any) will cover you in the event of a ladder related incident?

Regardless of your personal views of the quality of trad work compared to wfp,.. the law is the law.

Choosing not to answer billhope??

[billhope_1]

Sorry about the delay Nathanael (better things to do at the weekend ), in answer to your questions. 1 It is not & has never been an offence to clean windows etc from a ladder on private dwellings at  first floor height.
2 I have public liability insurance like everyone to cover any third party related incident involving ladders etc !
As far as I'm aware thats all i need to clean windows
(but no doubt you will put me right on that), and as for  my opinion on trad v pole, when I've finished cleaning a window I know I can walk away 100% happy with the finish & thats something you pole monkeys can't & thats why don't lose customers.

[Nathanael Jones]

I'm not debating trad vs wfp,.. I can get an excellent result with either method.

1 It is not & has never been an offence to clean windows etc from a ladder on private dwellings at  first floor height.

You're wrong. It doesn't matter if its a private dwelling or a business premises, it is still your place of work & the rules apply regardless. I believe the only leeway (And prob the place where ppl are getting confused) is if its your own home you're working on. The work at height rules come into play as soon as your feet leave the ground,.. you can be on the first rung of that ladder & breaking the law, so this nonsense about 1st floor being ok is simply make believe.

If you have risk assessed each and every ladder climb on your round and truly can say that ladders are the safest method, only then are you working within the law.

I don't care personally if you break the law,.. what really gets me worked up is how ppl spread misinformation about the legislation in place to justify their own actions,.. possibly encouraging others to continue unsafe working practices & newbies to start up working this way. You're potentially encouraging other shiners to risk their lives,.. simply so you can feel justified in your actions!

Maybe a bit of an over-reaction, but I'm tired & cranky & don't feel like holding back today.

[billhope_1]

I'll tell you again Nathanael whilst H&E would prefer you not use ladders, cleaning 1st floor windows on PRIVATE DWELLINGS with the owners permission is not against any law or regulation as MHSW regulations do not apply to a sole trader, providing he takes all reasonable precautions (which hopefully he would).
I've recently done a working at heights course & in a window cleaners situation a ladder is regarded as a temporary work station as you're only up there for a few minutes at a time before you move the ladder.
So ladders are not banned I'ts just a big con to scare us into buying something very expensive.  

[Elfords Carpet and Window Cleaning]

I'll tell you again

But its your first post 

I'ts just a big con to scare us into buying something very expensive.  

No its not, it was just the nanny state that Labour has always been. They think we can't look after ourselves.

[PETERjj]

Thanks for the info

[tomy jackson]

read the regs it clearly states safer alternitve

[Nathanael Jones]

Its like banging my head of a brick wall.

How temporary is the workstation if you are using it ALL DAY, EVERY DAY? When there are multiple short uses of a ladder all day long, can you really imagine that it can still be classed as "short duration" work.
Are there really no "practicable alternatives"?
Where in the regs does it say that private dwellings are excluded from the rules?

If you insist on staying 100% trad, at least look at how wagga works with a modified wagtail & poles. He still gets a fantastic result, works probably faster that I do when WFP'ing, and keeps his feet firmly on the ground.

[paul rulton]

Its like banging my head of a brick wall.

How temporary is the workstation if you are using it ALL DAY, EVERY DAY? When there are multiple short uses of a ladder all day long, can you really imagine that it can still be classed as "short duration" work.
Are there really no "practicable alternatives"?
Where in the regs does it say that private dwellings are excluded from the rules?

If you insist on staying 100% trad, at least look at how wagga works with a modified wagtail & poles. He still gets a fantastic result, works probably faster that I do when WFP'ing, and keeps his feet firmly on the ground.

have u got a link 4that please m8? 

[tomy jackson]

her wos a chap who iv kowen for years ,he looks at my set up and says il not bother as iv bin at it ror 27 years and neavr fell off ,6 muths later off he came brok his rist now carnt hold his swegy a year on and not worked .

[Nathanael Jones]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEj0qajz5eM&feature=related

He has nearly 60 video's, well worth watching.

[tomy jackson]

hell thats qick