[eddie d]

i was wondering if its worth employing .(at present i sub cxontract)

pay =500 pw +running costs + holiday pay + sick pay +10%ni = around 800 per wk .

so i need a wc to turn over 1175 inc vat to make 200 per wk .(flat rate vat )

so i will need 5 vans and 5 v good wc to make around 1000 a wk .this seems a lot harder than just doing a grands worth of wk .

what do you think 

[NWH]

You can earn that on your own in less than a week and without any of the hassle,think again if i were you.

[bluez]

IME employing needs someone to think like an employer not like an employee, 500 a week no chance from me if an employee isn't producing at least 3 times his cost. That would mean 1500.00 which would give you at least 750.00 a week.

I generally operate on labour of 35% including hol pay and 10%prsi(nat i )

 

[eddie d]

thanks for that .
do you retain stakk paying 35% or do you have very good prices

[East coast window cleaning Services]

Why not sub some out?

[eddie d]

p&r i do sub out at present .it does have advantages .but also disadvantages .ie my wk comes second to thiers .


i was hoping for some info from others who employ .come on guys ,helen ,trevor , are these figures ok or way out .
thankyou .

[Ian Lancaster]

Eddie

If your "pay to revenue generated" ratio is more than 35% you're going to find it isn't worth it.

You know how I do it, and I get £150-200 per man per week without any of the hassle, and the men get a much better than average slice of the cake.

If you're going down the employing route, don't pay more than 35% because after you've covered all the other expenses there'll be nothing left for you.

[bluez]

thanks for that .
do you retain stakk paying 35% or do you have very good prices

I do not give anyone stakes EVER. It is my business and I have worked hard for it I am not giving it away. I will give a good employee financial incentives and penalties.

Incomlpete daily job list costs employee €5.00
Any Re -do other than 1st in a week is done on employees own time
I pay whichever is the greater 35% of the daily list total or the hourly rate(encourages productivity).
Turnover above €300.00 per day is shared 60/40 in my favour.
Monthly sales targets for turnover, above which 10% goes in the kitty to be shared out annually based on time served.

I also give use of the vehicles to staff for local use and pay €10.00 per week for mobile phone credit. I think that you should just try it, whatever way you feel it will work for you and make changes as required. Even if you only break even you are adding to the value of your business and increasing your options ie renting, selling, bank financing for growth etc. It will also help spread the cost of insurance and safety costs.

















   

[eddie d]

sorry been off line .
but thankyou for opinions . :

[Helen]

p&r i do sub out at present .it does have advantages .but also disadvantages .ie my wk comes second to thiers .


i was hoping for some info from others who employ .come on guys ,helen ,trevor , are these figures ok or way out .
thankyou .

Eddie. sorry, wasn't on here much over the xmas period and as I hate January finding it hard to generate enthusiasm for getting going again.)
First impressions of your figures without looking into it....your would be paying too high! £500 per week = £26000 per annum plus another 2600.00 for extra nat ins, plus all the rest of the overheads. Will look more closely later this week

[Helen]

Eddie,
Firstly do you have the turnover yet to be thinking of 5 employees or is that your plan of where you would like to be?
Also do you intend to be a "hands on" working employer or just in a supervisory capacity?

Lets say that you at present you have the turnover for one employee.

The first thing I would do is check your local Job Centre and Sits Vac in the loacal paper. What is a good average wage round your area and for what sort of work?
Ok WC'ing does need skill, but do you want to pay more or the same as what a qualified tradesman ie scaffolder etc is paid? I use this as an example only, i am sure you will catch on to what I mean!
 For example the figures you have quoted, if my top guy were to be earning £26k gross (his OTE is not far off that) he would have to bring in £65k nett of vat plus per annum worked out over 47 weeks to allow for holidays. Which is the best part of £1400 nett of vat per week, which is a constant £280 nett of vat per day over a 5 day week.
Is your £26k going be a set figure or is it going to be made up of hourly rate and bonuses? You need some incentives along the way to get the best out of people!
Is £26k your maximum rate you will pay? If so, where do you go from there? There is no incentive there for an employee to want to better himself!
Personally, and this is how we pay , I think that an hourly rate around the going average for your area, plus bonuses (which can be forfieted if requirements are not met) is the best way to motivate and to give a good level of pay. Our top guy is on OTE of £24k gross in his first year, he has put himself out, he has worked unsociable hours when others didn't want to and except for the odd slip now and again, his standards are first class and work ethics second to none.(yes he is Polish) The job was advertised as OTE £20k per annum, but once he was trained and had got into a routine, he soon saw his own potential for earning more! which of course then brings us more in too!

Hope this has helped and If I think of anymore I'll add on to it

[Helen]

Just seen your figure of £1175 including vat!!!!!!!
WOW STOP!!!!!!
When working out wages work on nett of vat figures this is not including vat even if you are on flat rate! Just forget about VAT full stop when calculating wages!
If you work out on yours, your nett of vat figure would be £1000.00 and your gross wage alone would then equate to 50% of your nett income.....TOO HIGH % on the wages!
So £1000 brought in over 47 weeks (remember holidays) equals £47k. All of a sudden your 50% has become 55.32% Then you have all the rest of the overheads, you will end up by not making much this way

[eddie d]

helen .thx very much for your input .
at the mo i contract out a fair amount of comercial wk to 4 other window cleaners .this way i dont have the costs of employing .the problem  is i  loose control of the wk ,and potentially they could try and poach the jobs .i generally take a 20% cut across the board and have to price high to make it worth while .
these contractors work on a daily rate of 150/250 .which is the norm for essexc .

since posting ive decided to give the "ian lancaster " system a go .and carry on as im doing with the subbys .

thxc eddie

[Helen]

good luck, let us know how it goes