[ecowasher]

I see different interpretations posted on this,  and also what i percieve as a certain amount of scare-mongering coming from the WFP brigade.

In short:

My understanding of TWH and the HSE WAHD,  is that provided a personal risk assement of the proposed work is conducted, and the equipment in use is sound, fit for purpose and checked for issues, and that appropiate number of 'points of contact' are maintained whilst at height, then trad window cleaning to a 1st storey level (typical domestic 2 up two down house bedroom for instance) is within guidelines and is not working outside of regs.

Yes or No??

[stephen.b1]

you can clean the third floor if you want  as long as its safe to do so
its just scare tactics again
after all firemen carry women and childern down down ladders i think they call this (rescue)  WILL THIS BE STOPPED

[chris@c.m.s]

I see different interpretations posted on this,  and also what i percieve as a certain amount of scare-mongering coming from the WFP brigade.

In short:

My understanding of TWH and the HSE WAHD,  is that provided a personal risk assement of the proposed work is conducted, and the equipment in use is sound, fit for purpose and checked for issues, and that appropiate number of 'points of contact' are maintained whilst at height, then trad window cleaning to a 1st storey level (typical domestic 2 up two down house bedroom for instance) is within guidelines and is not working outside of regs.

Yes or No??

As long as there isnt a safer alternative yes, if there is one "and we all know there is" then no and I think it will be that rule that the HSE and WAHD will be tightening up on 

[Trevor Knight]

you can clean the third floor if you want  as long as its safe to do so
its just scare tactics again
after all firemen carry women and childern down down ladders i think they call this (rescue)  WILL THIS BE STOPPED

This quote has to be the most extreme opposite ends of the scale I can remember being seen on this forum. Hmm, let me see, cleaning windows or saving a life, close but no cigar I think??

Perhaps a more realistic comparison would be a BT engineer, when using a ladder now has to either be footed or tied against the pole he is climbing. Think this is a little closer don't you??

Regarding the WAH the basis of the conditions are simple. Using the safest method ensuring all risks are taken into account. Therefore, at present, if you use ladders and take all necessary precautions then you can carry on as normal.

So my friend, next time your up your ladder cleaning windows and you need to fireman's carry your customer out the bedroom window just make sure you're being footed.

I love this forum     

[twt]

im a retained firefighter and when using ladders they are always footed. Also were are no longer allowed to practice carrying people down ladders as it is considered too dangerous!!!! However if we need to we can carry someone down ladders to rescue them even though we recieve no training on this anymore.

[Easyclean Windows]

Also were are no longer allowed to practice carrying people down ladders as it is considered too dangerous!!!! However if we need to we can carry someone down ladders to rescue them even though we recieve no training on this anymore

Surely this is the same principle as the ladder regs.

If a risk assesment proves that in certain curcumstances a snatch rescue can be used rather than a stretcher say you can still use that practice like using a ladder because a wfp wouldnt be advisable?

[ecowasher]

The argument of the avilability of 'an alternative safer method'  ie; wfp over ladder work, is a bit shallow really, especially for low level (say,  up to 1st floor).

If we take driving a car as an example, crash helmets are accessible and available to everyone, and would reduce the number of serious head injuries that occur each year through accidents at the wheel,  however nobody wears one, nor are we encouraged to.

Its all in the interpretation,  risk assement and appropiateness / availability / accessability of safer alternatives in my book,  but applying the risk assement correctly and making a mature decision based on the results is key.

[jeff1]

If you read the hse guide lines it actually says in them that emergency services are exempt.

[Helen]

one of our customers works for H & S and commended us when we changed to WFP. We asked him for the "correct" interpretation and it came back as:
You can use properly secured/footed ladders for access to work.Ie gaining access to  flat roof/platform to work from.
There is no min height in the working at height regulation. Ie standing on a 6 inch footstool!
Ladders can not now be used for working at height, if there is an alternative way of doing that work. H & S would not accept the excuse, that "I didn't have" or "haven't purchased an alternative"  in an investigation, when there are products readily available on the market.
Some ground floor windows warrant ladder use due to sloping ground etc and come under the regs too.