Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: simon knight on March 13, 2010, 03:45:45 pm
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I was this morning doing my little row of 2 up 2 down terraces (11 of them all in a line and I charge £10 a pop, front and back). Woman comes up to me and says: "I've just had my windows cleaned but could you pop over and tell tell me how much you'd charge".
Goes over and it's a fair bit bigger: 3 beds, 2 reception, kitchen, one bathroom, one downstairs loo and 4 veluxes. All very accessable. In and out 90 minutes if I was hungover and in lazy mode 8)
ME: How much have you just been charged?
HER: £110...took the 2 of them about an hour.
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o
ME: You've been shafted love...£40 with me.
HER: See you in 2 months time and every 2 months after please.
Result: Rip-off merchants £110....Simon Knight £240pa for as long as she lives there ;D
OK, they did a fair job...but £110 for an hours work???
Question: Is my attitude right?
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yea, some one wont be happy when they next turn up lol
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Hang on - she gets in and out done for a £110 and it takes two man-hours yeah?
If I've got that right they are earning £55ph each.
You are offering to do it for £40 and for two hours (those inside veluxes can be a bit more time consuming) you'd get £20 ph.
You reckon you can do it in 90 mins and so that's about £26.66 per hour.
If that is true I think (especially as you know their price) you could have prolly gone for £55 - half price and both of you would have been happy.
Sorry to rain (well drizzle a bit) on your parade.
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it is a dog eat dog world
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You are offering to do it for £40 and for two hours (those inside veluxes can be a bit more time consuming) you'd get £20 ph.
You reckon you can do it in 90 mins and so that's about £26.66 per hour.
The veluxes are low level...stand on a kitchen stool low level, so no problem there.
As I say 90 mins top whack...£26.66ph?...happy days Malc ;)
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Maybe the original price was for a builders clean.
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Maybe the original price was for a builders clean.
No. No buliding work done. Just an ordinary clean.
Basically the guys had her eyes out.
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110 to clean a house inside and out feckin robbery big time. I dont care what anyone says. To have windows cleaned in yer house that is scandalous. If any of us were not WC's would you be happy paying that to someone?
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There really are some ridiculous examples of prices floated around this forum....cloud cuckoo land some people live in ::)
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Just goes to prove that until we properly regulate this (and most other parts of the cleaning) profession, there are going to be these cowboys giving us all a bad name.
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I was this morning doing my little row of 2 up 2 down terraces (11 of them all in a line and I charge £10 a pop, front and back). Woman comes up to me and says: "I've just had my windows cleaned but could you pop over and tell tell me how much you'd charge".
Goes over and it's a fair bit bigger: 3 beds, 2 reception, kitchen, one bathroom, one downstairs loo and 4 veluxes. All very accessable. In and out 90 minutes if I was hungover and in lazy mode 8)
ME: How much have you just been charged?
HER: £110...took the 2 of them about an hour.
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o
ME: You've been shafted love...£40 with me.
HER: See you in 2 months time and every 2 months after please.
Result: Rip-off merchants £110....Simon Knight £240pa for as long as she lives there ;D
OK, they did a fair job...but £110 for an hours work???
Question: Is my attitude right?
It's not £110 for an hours work though. It's £110 for two hours work - therefore £55 an hour. Still quite a high rate mind you. I can get to that sort of rate myself if I'm flying and on my better work. It's just that it doesn't show up so much because it doesn't all come from one household. When it's one household I try to moderate things somewhat. Mind you I have a job I do for £65 and I've got that down to 1hr 20m. It does have to be done while the customer is in though due to front security gates.
Anyway, back to the other guys. £110 for two man hours is on the high side but there is no way of knowing how much they had to disrupt their schedule in order to do the job as it involved insides. The disruption alone may have cost them half a man hour to get there.
Mind you, you did say it was 90 minutes for you alone so presumably they were taking the p and hanging it out in case they got hassled.
It does sound like they were taking the p a bit but maybe not as much as it first appears as we don't know all the circumstances.
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sounds ok to me, i try and earn £60 phr. i wouldnt call them cowboys just cos there on more than you.
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Hang on - she gets in and out done for a £110 and it takes two man-hours yeah?
If I've got that right they are earning £55ph each.
You are offering to do it for £40 and for two hours (those inside veluxes can be a bit more time consuming) you'd get £20 ph.
You reckon you can do it in 90 mins and so that's about £26.66 per hour.
If that is true I think (especially as you know their price) you could have prolly gone for £55 - half price and both of you would have been happy.
Sorry to rain (well drizzle a bit) on your parade.
not everybodys as greedy as you Malc ;D
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110 to clean a house inside and out feckin robbery big time. I dont care what anyone says. To have windows cleaned in yer house that is scandalous. If any of us were not WC's would you be happy paying that to someone?
No I wouldnt but at the end of the day the woman excepted the quote...sounds ok to me, i try and earn £60 phr. i wouldnt call them cowboys just cos there on more than you.
Couldnt agree more, some are cowboys when they quote too low now cowboys when quoting too high......There really are some ridiculous examples of prices floated around this forum....cloud cuckoo land some people live in ::)
Why assume people live in cuckoo land....
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i think you have done wrong here for two of them thats about right
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
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I was this morning doing my little row of 2 up 2 down terraces (11 of them all in a line and I charge £10 a pop, front and back). Woman comes up to me and says: "I've just had my windows cleaned but could you pop over and tell tell me how much you'd charge".
Goes over and it's a fair bit bigger: 3 beds, 2 reception, kitchen, one bathroom, one downstairs loo and 4 veluxes. All very accessable. In and out 90 minutes if I was hungover and in lazy mode 8)
ME: How much have you just been charged?
HER: £110...took the 2 of them about an hour.
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o
ME: You've been shafted love...£40 with me.
HER: See you in 2 months time and every 2 months after please.
Result: Rip-off merchants £110....Simon Knight £240pa for as long as she lives there ;D
OK, they did a fair job...but £110 for an hours work???
Question: Is my attitude right?
What part of London do you work Simon?
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sounds ok to me, i try and earn £60 phr. i wouldnt call them cowboys just cos there on more than you.
I didn't call them cowboys, in fact I said they did a "fair job".
It's just that clearly to most people £110 for a 3 bed house is the "wrong" money (why else would the woman want a second opiniion?) and it doen't matter if there was "half a man hour to get there" (per StanA) as we all have to accept that it takes time to get from one job to the next.
Proof of the pudding is: They will in future earn nowt from this customer.
I will earn £240 a year.
QED
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
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I was this morning doing my little row of 2 up 2 down terraces (11 of them all in a line and I charge £10 a pop, front and back). Woman comes up to me and says: "I've just had my windows cleaned but could you pop over and tell tell me how much you'd charge".
Goes over and it's a fair bit bigger: 3 beds, 2 reception, kitchen, one bathroom, one downstairs loo and 4 veluxes. All very accessable. In and out 90 minutes if I was hungover and in lazy mode 8)
ME: How much have you just been charged?
HER: £110...took the 2 of them about an hour.
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o
ME: You've been shafted love...£40 with me.
HER: See you in 2 months time and every 2 months after please.
Result: Rip-off merchants £110....Simon Knight £240pa for as long as she lives there ;D
OK, they did a fair job...but £110 for an hours work???
Question: Is my attitude right?
What part of London do you work Simon?
Putney
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Can't knock the guys for charging what they did, we don't know the circumstances or the conversation they had with the customer. They could well of thought she was gonna be a one off, you know, when you get that feeling, they say they're gonna be regular but you get the feeling they're not. Think we've all been stung with that one.
Anyway Simon Knight, I would have done the same to be honest if it suited me & my work, although I might have gone a tad higher on the price.
Infact, just last year I got a job (houshold name, extremely wealthy) The last guy charged just shy of £500 & he was wfp too like me. I quoted £135, it's approx 3 hours work wfp! I never knew the other guys price untill after I quoted mine, but like you, I told the house keeper they'd been shafted! ;)
Needless to say, it's still my job & both me & the customer are happy. :D
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
Simon
What I am trying to say, is do not quote lower than what you are already earning.
I have a minimum hourly rate of between £35 and £40, I do not compromise on these figures, if they are not willing to pay what I quote then that is up to them.
I also have quite a few jobs where the hourly rate does reach £100 and above, I am not embarrased by these charges, I do an excellent job and never let them down, they have also been on my books for quite a few years and they have been approached by other cleaners at cheaper prices but they still want me.
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
So what you saying is your new custy doesnt have any sense as she agreed and paid it ???
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
So what you saying is your new custy doesnt have any sense as she agreed and paid it ???
She obviously does have sense because she she sought a second opinion(with me) because she realised/suspected that £110 was a rip-off.
It's a bit like you going to a shop and buying a product for X amount and when you get home thinking "Hm, I'm happy with the product but with hindsight perhaps I've paid through the nose and could have gotten the same product cheaper had I shopped around".
It's all very well trying to maximise ones earnings but we're offering a luxury product which has to be affordable month in month out. Clearly £110 bi-monthly equates to £660pa...this is a 2 week holiday in Spain.
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
So what you saying is your new custy doesnt have any sense as she agreed and paid it ???
She obviously does have sense because she she sought a second opinion(with me) because she realised/suspected that £110 was a rip-off.
It's a bit like you going to a shop and buying a product for X amount and when you get home thinking "Hm, I'm happy with the product but with hindsight perhaps I've paid through the nose and could have gotten the same product cheaper had I shopped around".
It's all very well trying to maximise ones earnings but we're offering a luxury product which has to be affordable month in month out. Clearly £110 bi-monthly equates to £660pa...this is a 2 week holiday in Spain.
I am araid that she is the one who will be going to spain for 2 weeks while you might be able to get a day trip to the sea side. ;D
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
So what you saying is your new custy doesnt have any sense as she agreed and paid it ???
She obviously does have sense because she she sought a second opinion(with me) because she realised/suspected that £110 was a rip-off.
It's a bit like you going to a shop and buying a product for X amount and when you get home thinking "Hm, I'm happy with the product but with hindsight perhaps I've paid through the nose and could have gotten the same product cheaper had I shopped around".
It's all very well trying to maximise ones earnings but we're offering a luxury product which has to be affordable month in month out. Clearly £110 bi-monthly equates to £660pa...this is a 2 week holiday in Spain.
I am araid that she is the one who will be going to spain for 2 weeks while you might be able to get a day trip to the sea side. ;D
;D
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what goes around comes around
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money, how much do i earn yawnnnnnnnnnnnn
here we go again
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money, how much do i earn yawnnnnnnnnnnnn
here we go again
Yeah heard it all before, especially around Christmas time when many of the millionaires on here were crying poverty due to having 2 weeks off due to the snow.
Me...... i earn £40 a week all in, and i keep the lot 'cause i'm a selfish sonofabitch ;D
What i earn is between me and my accountant, not for all and sundry to paw over. It does this trade no good what so ever as it only encourages others to move in on us and undrcut our prices.
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sounds ok to me, i try and earn £60 phr. i wouldnt call them cowboys just cos there on more than you.
I didn't call them cowboys, in fact I said they did a "fair job".
It's just that clearly to most people £110 for a 3 bed house is the "wrong" money (why else would the woman want a second opiniion?) and it doen't matter if there was "half a man hour to get there" (per StanA) as we all have to accept that it takes time to get from one job to the next.
Proof of the pudding is: They will in future earn nowt from this customer.
I will earn £240 a year.
QED
I disagree. I don't know how you work your round Simon but I do mine in areas. It's by doing it this way that I can keep my overheads down a bit. If a new customer wants an individual appointment (i.e. doing the insides as well) and this pulls me from the area where I'm currently working then I'm afraid they can pay a bit extra for that. Naturally I won't always do this. If it looks like it might be a good, solid, regular customer then I may well swallow extra costs for the first clean. However, if it appears to me that this might be a customer who will want to have a one off or a customer who will often be after special treatment (i.e. increase my costs) then I'm afraid that this has to be passed on. It's either that or the rest of the customers pay indirectly for this or I earn less.
It was very easy at first to fill my books with customers who wanted me to jump through hoops for minimal reward. I was often grateful to do it too as it was either that or sit at home. The challenge came when my books were full. I had to ask myself whether I wanted to go out and get a better customer who pays a good rate and is happy to fit in with my work schedule or do I continue working for say 70% of the money for someone who p's me about.
IMO empathising with a customer is good and healthy.
Thinking like one is bad for business though.
£55 an hour IMO is only a bit on the high side because it's all from one household. If they had to defer other work to give her an appointment then it doesn't sound unreasonable. Personally, unless it was very lucrative, I wouldn't even want a domestic job where I have to do insides every time or most times.
Imagine you're doing compact work in one town and someone wants you to break off from that to do what might be a one off in another town twenty minutes drive away. If you have a full schedule, that is going to cost you time (aka money).
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
So what you saying is your new custy doesnt have any sense as she agreed and paid it ???
She obviously does have sense because she she sought a second opinion(with me) because she realised/suspected that £110 was a rip-off.
It's a bit like you going to a shop and buying a product for X amount and when you get home thinking "Hm, I'm happy with the product but with hindsight perhaps I've paid through the nose and could have gotten the same product cheaper had I shopped around".
It's all very well trying to maximise ones earnings but we're offering a luxury product which has to be affordable month in month out. Clearly £110 bi-monthly equates to £660pa...this is a 2 week holiday in Spain.
I am araid that she is the one who will be going to spain for 2 weeks while you might be able to get a day trip to the sea side. ;D
;D
Can you bring me back a stick of rock Simon? ;D
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
So what you saying is your new custy doesnt have any sense as she agreed and paid it ???
She obviously does have sense because she she sought a second opinion(with me) because she realised/suspected that £110 was a rip-off.
It's a bit like you going to a shop and buying a product for X amount and when you get home thinking "Hm, I'm happy with the product but with hindsight perhaps I've paid through the nose and could have gotten the same product cheaper had I shopped around".
It's all very well trying to maximise ones earnings but we're offering a luxury product which has to be affordable month in month out. Clearly £110 bi-monthly equates to £660pa...this is a 2 week holiday in Spain.
I am araid that she is the one who will be going to spain for 2 weeks while you might be able to get a day trip to the sea side. ;D
;D
Can you bring me back a stick of rock Simon? ;D
I am sorry, but Simon does not earn enough for luxuries, you will have to buy your own rock. 8)
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When someone knocks on her door and offers to do it for £30.00 she will soon sack you.
You work in Putney where the average house must be £500,000 and are earning £55.00 an hour doing 2 up 2 downs
And you are happy coz you got a job that you estimate will earn you £26.00 an hour doing a semi in and out
Is that good business? NO
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Simon
You said you did 11 terraced houses at £10 a pop, how long did they take you?
2 hours(ish)
You're now gonna say: "So you're earning £55ph Simon"
True, but I'm not stinging one person for £110...there is a big difference!
Yes you are, because it took 2 of them 1 hour which matches your figures of £55 per hour per man.
You also have to work out what you normally do per hour over the whole week.
I also price what my hourly rate currently is so if I am earning £55 per hour and you reckon that this job will take you 1 1/2 hours then I would charge £82.5
Throw the maths around as much as you like but at the end of the day nobody with any sense will pay £110 for their 3 bed semi to be cleaned both sides...would you?
So what you saying is your new custy doesnt have any sense as she agreed and paid it ???
She obviously does have sense because she she sought a second opinion(with me) because she realised/suspected that £110 was a rip-off.
It's a bit like you going to a shop and buying a product for X amount and when you get home thinking "Hm, I'm happy with the product but with hindsight perhaps I've paid through the nose and could have gotten the same product cheaper had I shopped around".
It's all very well trying to maximise ones earnings but we're offering a luxury product which has to be affordable month in month out. Clearly £110 bi-monthly equates to £660pa...this is a 2 week holiday in Spain.
I am araid that she is the one who will be going to spain for 2 weeks while you might be able to get a day trip to the sea side. ;D
;D
Can you bring me back a stick of rock Simon? ;D
I am sorry, but Simon does not earn enough for luxuries, you will have to buy your own rock. 8)
Call me old fashioned but I don't think £26.66ph is all that dreadful...enough for a stick of rock and probably a plate of whelks as well. ;D
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i wouldnt have the front to charge what those guys were- but i spose if theyv got the front ,every now and then somebody takes the bait and maybe only need to work a few houses
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£26.66 per hour might sound a great income if you are an employee, but it sucks if you are self employed.
Your wages and your business turnover are two very different things.
If at the end of your financial year and after completing your accounts the income you draw off your business turnover is £55,452.80 per year then WOW! fantastic income.
for a 3 bed house the price does sound excessive, but also the time taken too.
For instance; WFP outside = 20 minutes absolute max for one person.
Inside trad = 40 min max for one person, depends of course on how awkward the insides are, ie, furnishings, carpets, window sills full of ornaments and whatnot.
But if you are earning £60.00 an hour doing little terraced properties, what on earth is the point of taking on a house that will actually cause your income to drop?!
Pricing per hour on individual properties is not a good way of going about it, for one thing, as you get faster at a job you end out doing more work in that hour, ergo if you start out that way from the beginning your relative income for work done will keep dropping as your speed increases!!
You are not being paid for how long a job takes you, if I did that I have some shop fronts that I'd only have to charge 50p for!
Some window cleaners will be 2 or 3 times faster (or slower!) that other window cleaners, does this mean that its perfectly ok for the slow window cleaner to charge 3 times more than the fast one??
And if you are a London window cleaner your rate will also need to be higher due to the higher cost of living there.
Window cleaning is a manual job, just about any grunt can do it, but it is also a business and a great many just do not have a clue as to how to run a business, they look at one job (for instance) where they earn £30 for an hours work and then convince themselves they are on a rate close to 60k a year.
When they see someone claiming to have work earning them £60.00 (or more) an hour they shout out that they are rip off merchants...though that £60 per hour will not mean they are earning £60 an hour 40 hours a week, 52 weeks of the year.
Far from it, I have plenty of work at those kind of apparent rates, but my ACTUAL income from my business is a fraction of that.
Ian
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Well said Ian and I agree with everything that you said, its about time that window cleaners start to look at their trade as a business not as a job.
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£26.66 per hour might sound a great income if you are an employee, but it sucks if you are self employed.
Your wages and your business turnover are two very different things.
If at the end of your financial year and after completing your accounts the income you draw off your business turnover is £55,452.80 per year then WOW! fantastic income.
for a 3 bed house the price does sound excessive, but also the time taken too.
For instance; WFP outside = 20 minutes absolute max for one person.
Inside trad = 40 min max for one person, depends of course on how awkward the insides are, ie, furnishings, carpets, window sills full of ornaments and whatnot.
But if you are earning £60.00 an hour doing little terraced properties, what on earth is the point of taking on a house that will actually cause your income to drop?!
Pricing per hour on individual properties is not a good way of going about it, for one thing, as you get faster at a job you end out doing more work in that hour, ergo if you start out that way from the beginning your relative income for work done will keep dropping as your speed increases!!
You are not being paid for how long a job takes you, if I did that I have some shop fronts that I'd only have to charge 50p for!
Some window cleaners will be 2 or 3 times faster (or slower!) that other window cleaners, does this mean that its perfectly ok for the slow window cleaner to charge 3 times more than the fast one??
And if you are a London window cleaner your rate will also need to be higher due to the higher cost of living there.
Window cleaning is a manual job, just about any grunt can do it, but it is also a business and a great many just do not have a clue as to how to run a business, they look at one job (for instance) where they earn £30 for an hours work and then convince themselves they are on a rate close to 60k a year.
When they see someone claiming to have work earning them £60.00 (or more) an hour they shout out that they are rip off merchants...though that £60 per hour will not mean they are earning £60 an hour 40 hours a week, 52 weeks of the year.
Far from it, I have plenty of work at those kind of apparent rates, but my ACTUAL income from my business is a fraction of that.
Ian
i have to disagree with some of what you say ian £26 an hour is a decent rate you only have to look at some other cleaning tasks to recognize window cleaning is very well paid in comparison, i have work that is priced at well below £26 an hour and yet make a very good profit margin from it i have other work priced well above £26 an hour and i also have some work priced at about £12 an hour and still manage to turn a profit from it so i keep this work on as it keeps my men in employment to cover the better priced jobs if i was a one man band i couldnt make some of these jobs worthwhile but it is all a numbers game some really large companies can work at profit margins of just 3% and still make large amounts but for the average firm this wouldnt be worthwhile, there are lots of debates on here about prices but everyones situation is different so there is no set price structure apart from what each individual is willing to work for and then it is up to the customer to decide which service to take i think simon was right to take the job as he can obviouly make the job pay for him.
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£26.66 per hour might sound a great income if you are an employee, but it sucks if you are self employed.
Your wages and your business turnover are two very different things.
If at the end of your financial year and after completing your accounts the income you draw off your business turnover is £55,452.80 per year then WOW! fantastic income.
for a 3 bed house the price does sound excessive, but also the time taken too.
For instance; WFP outside = 20 minutes absolute max for one person.
Inside trad = 40 min max for one person, depends of course on how awkward the insides are, ie, furnishings, carpets, window sills full of ornaments and whatnot.
But if you are earning £60.00 an hour doing little terraced properties, what on earth is the point of taking on a house that will actually cause your income to drop?!
Pricing per hour on individual properties is not a good way of going about it, for one thing, as you get faster at a job you end out doing more work in that hour, ergo if you start out that way from the beginning your relative income for work done will keep dropping as your speed increases!!
You are not being paid for how long a job takes you, if I did that I have some shop fronts that I'd only have to charge 50p for!
Some window cleaners will be 2 or 3 times faster (or slower!) that other window cleaners, does this mean that its perfectly ok for the slow window cleaner to charge 3 times more than the fast one??
And if you are a London window cleaner your rate will also need to be higher due to the higher cost of living there.
Window cleaning is a manual job, just about any grunt can do it, but it is also a business and a great many just do not have a clue as to how to run a business, they look at one job (for instance) where they earn £30 for an hours work and then convince themselves they are on a rate close to 60k a year.
When they see someone claiming to have work earning them £60.00 (or more) an hour they shout out that they are rip off merchants...though that £60 per hour will not mean they are earning £60 an hour 40 hours a week, 52 weeks of the year.
Far from it, I have plenty of work at those kind of apparent rates, but my ACTUAL income from my business is a fraction of that.
Ian
Well written Ian. I have a couple of jobs which, if the rates were matched on the rest of my work, would net me a turnover of £150k. The reality is vastly different of course. By the time I've paid my taxes/NI, business overheads, and had a little time off for a break or for illness, general down time, I doubt I take much more than £20k. By the time capital allowances are taken into account, it may not even be £20k. Mind you, I doubt there will be any big outlays now until the next van change (unless something big goes wrong with it).
Don't get me wrong. It's not a bad income for a job with relative flexi time but it could be so much better.
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£26.66 per hour might sound a great income if you are an employee, but it sucks if you are self employed.
Your wages and your business turnover are two very different things.
If at the end of your financial year and after completing your accounts the income you draw off your business turnover is £55,452.80 per year then WOW! fantastic income.
for a 3 bed house the price does sound excessive, but also the time taken too.
For instance; WFP outside = 20 minutes absolute max for one person.
Inside trad = 40 min max for one person, depends of course on how awkward the insides are, ie, furnishings, carpets, window sills full of ornaments and whatnot.
But if you are earning £60.00 an hour doing little terraced properties, what on earth is the point of taking on a house that will actually cause your income to drop?!
Pricing per hour on individual properties is not a good way of going about it, for one thing, as you get faster at a job you end out doing more work in that hour, ergo if you start out that way from the beginning your relative income for work done will keep dropping as your speed increases!!
You are not being paid for how long a job takes you, if I did that I have some shop fronts that I'd only have to charge 50p for!
Some window cleaners will be 2 or 3 times faster (or slower!) that other window cleaners, does this mean that its perfectly ok for the slow window cleaner to charge 3 times more than the fast one??
And if you are a London window cleaner your rate will also need to be higher due to the higher cost of living there.
Window cleaning is a manual job, just about any grunt can do it, but it is also a business and a great many just do not have a clue as to how to run a business, they look at one job (for instance) where they earn £30 for an hours work and then convince themselves they are on a rate close to 60k a year.
When they see someone claiming to have work earning them £60.00 (or more) an hour they shout out that they are rip off merchants...though that £60 per hour will not mean they are earning £60 an hour 40 hours a week, 52 weeks of the year.
Far from it, I have plenty of work at those kind of apparent rates, but my ACTUAL income from my business is a fraction of that.
Ian
i have to disagree with some of what you say ian £26 an hour is a decent rate you only have to look at some other cleaning tasks to recognize window cleaning is very well paid in comparison, i have work that is priced at well below £26 an hour and yet make a very good profit margin from it i have other work priced well above £26 an hour and i also have some work priced at about £12 an hour and still manage to turn a profit from it so i keep this work on as it keeps my men in employment to cover the better priced jobs if i was a one man band i couldnt make some of these jobs worthwhile but it is all a numbers game some really large companies can work at profit margins of just 3% and still make large amounts but for the average firm this wouldnt be worthwhile, there are lots of debates on here about prices but everyones situation is different so there is no set price structure apart from what each individual is willing to work for and then it is up to the customer to decide which service to take i think simon was right to take the job as he can obviouly make the job pay for him.
Yes I suppose it is a different ball game if employees are involved Trevor. Even a small profit is still a profit. I suppose it's a bit like the corner shop (sole trader) or the supermarket (employer) really. With the first item, the business owner's wage is a higher proportion of the turnover.
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maybe £110 is too much but it was in and out. if it took 2 blokes that long then maybe your price is too low - bet you wish you had charged more when you have done the first clean.
i dont think £50 odd per hr for 2 chaps is alot to be honest.
wc can be a strange way of income ratio - one house at £15.00 could take 40 mins but then you could have 4 smaller houses at a tenner each and it takes 40 mins.
you could work all day on houses and earn £200 or do one commercial job and earn £500 in half the time.
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Thanks for all the input guys. Some of you have made good and sensible comments.
However I still think £110 for a 3 bed house is utterly ridiculous and it's this kind of rip-off pricing that gives the industry a bad name.
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Agreed. Don't listen to the hype on here.
But I'd definitely want more than your quote if it took as long as you say.
Like Ian said though, 15 mins or so outside, maybe half hour inside really.
If it's what you say it should be 50 mins to an hour max.
And if so, then it's not even a £40 job. More like £25-30
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Thanks for all the input guys. Some of you have made good and sensible comments.
However I still think £110 for a 3 bed house is utterly ridiculous and it's this kind of rip-off pricing that gives the industry a bad name.
But at the other end of the scale it's the newbie/numpty charging £10 at the other end of the scale that augers this industry's reputation (especially ooop north) into the floor.
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Thanks for all the input guys. Some of you have made good and sensible comments.
However I still think £110 for a 3 bed house is utterly ridiculous and it's this kind of rip-off pricing that gives the industry a bad name.
But at the other end of the scale it's the newbie/numpty charging £10 at the other end of the scale that augers this industry's reputation (especially ooop north) into the floor.
Now there I agree with you, stupidly low prices doesn't do anybody a favour, not even the customer in the long run because newbies eventually wise up and dump the job.
To me the pricing is a fine balance: I want to do this house regularly and therefore I must price to make it attractive for the customer to have them done regularly.
The £110 merchant just prices on the basis of perceived customer ignorance coupled with what they feel they can get away with. The £110 merchant must realise that the chances of a repeat clean are 1000s to 1 against.