Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: seanpaul on January 24, 2010, 01:00:26 pm
-
Seen this on youtube and wondered if anyone has used this method and how effective it is---
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6t5axVtq2I
seanpaul
-
Very interesting. I find it quicker to clean sheeting glass as less rinsing seems to be needed.
-
He forgot to tell us what this chemical was that he was using,which
To me was the most important thing of all.
I wish all window glass would `curtain`.
Lewis Doubtfire
-
Its simple vinegar Lewis, old but good video.
However as the nature of the glass is unchanged, the solution still spots. :'(
-
I prefer beading windows. Can you change sheeting windows to beading?
-
Yes, easy ! get some rain x car window cleaner, pledge or any petroleum based wax based polish
-
In my experience some glass beads and some curtains but they come up as clean as each other in the end.
Though it is satifying when you clean a pane and it curtains down to a spotless dry finish. You just have to trust you done enough sometimes
-
OK. Time for a bit of physics.
A water surface (and in fact any liquid surface) has an effect called surface tension. It's caused by the molecules of water to the side and underneath attracting the molecules on the surface. This causes a "skin" effect, but it's not a real skin. It's just that the surface behaves like a skin.
You can see from the diagram below that the molecules on the surface aren't "balanced" like the ones deep in the body of the liquid. It's this lack of balance that causes the tension.
(http://z.about.com/d/physics/1/G/8/0/-/-/SurfaceTension.png)
Here's a photo of a paper clip "floating" on the surface of a glass of water:
(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:mwFQ3TbzpNpY9M:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9c/Surface_Tension_01.jpg)
That's why rain falls in droplets, and why fog is made up of minute water droplets.
(To be really scientific about it - and you don't need to know this - the surface has energy and any physical system naturally tends to its lowest energy state. So a water droplet tries to have the smallest surface area possible - and that is a sphere.)
Water molecules are also attracted to the surface of the glass. The strength of the attraction depends on the surface finish and the precise chemical composition of the glass. Altering the surface by abrasion or applying chemical will have an effect, which is what Jef was talking about.
If the attraction of the water molecules to the glass is weaker than their attraction to each other, the glass will be hydrophobic and the water will not wet the glass, but will run down in rivulets and form beads.
If the attraction of the water molecules to the glass is stronger than their attraction to each other, the glass will be hydrophilic and the water will wet the glass, and will give the curtain effect.
Here's a picture of the effect:
(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:Nb4kgRrPYnxojM:http://www.pcn.org/images/Technical%2520Notes%2520-%2520Corona1.jpg)
You'll notice that water tends to creep up the sides of a drinking glass. That's because drinking glasses are usually made of "soft" glass which is hydrophilic.
Here's a picture, but you can do this at home. It works with whiskey and vodka, I believe.
(http://www.aversis.be/tutorials/vray/images/vray_glass_liquid/small/page2_0018.jpg)
Adding vinegar reduces the surface tension of the water - that's why it wets the hydrophobic glass better.
To answer Phil, you can't change the nature of the glass, but you can apply finishes. As an example, so-called self-cleaning glass has a layer of titanium dioxide which is strongly hydrophilic.
You can find lots of information about surface tension by googling. Some of the pictures are quite good as well.
Oooooooooo - I LOVE physics.
-
Very informative and a great reply. thanks wally.
-
the chap on the youtube is a member of this forum , cat9921 is his name on here.
he got me into wfp very helpful bloke.
-
what is the point of this method there are 2 types of glass thats life ,
-
I guess I am wondering, that given the advantage is a small amount of time saved by rinsing less, but it would take time to treat the glass...Why not merely live with the glass finish the customer has...
I know it sounds ungrateful for the interesting discussion so far, but am I wrong
-
you can make the water curtain better by using fast upstrokes to the top of the glass with your brush and quickly follow the water down with your jets on the way back down on beading glass.
That way istead of chasing spots you are following a sheet, try it next time you are out on beading glass, you will be amazed with the results
Another top tip from mr big head, david @st ives ;D
-
I guess I am wondering, that given the advantage is a small amount of time saved by rinsing less, but it would take time to treat the glass...Why not merely live with the glass finish the customer has...
I know it sounds ungrateful for the interesting discussion so far, but am I wrong
Exactly right. You have to live in the world as it is, not the world as you want it to be.
It's pointless bitching about a piece of glass or wishing it to be something that it isn't. It ain't going to change to suit you!!!! You find the best approach for the window you're working on.
Accept the glass for what it is and treat it as it should be treated. It's a kind of "zen" thing.
I made my "scientific" post because I thought that it would be a good idea to understand a little about what is behind that phenomenon. I find that a little understanding can go a long way toward solving problems and seeing solutions.
I wonder if we could adopt the same approach to colleagues?
-
I guess I am wondering, that given the advantage is a small amount of time saved by rinsing less, but it would take time to treat the glass...Why not merely live with the glass finish the customer has...
I know it sounds ungrateful for the interesting discussion so far, but am I wrong
Exactly right. You have to live in the world as it is, not the world as you want it to be.
It's pointless bitching about a piece of glass or wishing it to be something that it isn't. It ain't going to change to suit you!!!! You find the best approach for the window you're working on.
Accept the glass for what it is and treat it as it should be treated. It's a kind of "zen" thing.
I made my "scientific" post because I thought that it would be a good idea to understand a little about what is behind that phenomenon. I find that a little understanding can go a long way toward solving problems and seeing solutions.
I wonder if we could adopt the same approach to colleagues?
Thanks for your scientific post, I find physics very interesting too. I said that very sentence once at a meal with the lads, and it went quiet. But I don't care I know how to have a laugh, even at myself.
-
Point is you don’t have to spend any longer rinsing, whatever the glass.
And Brushes wear quicker a lot more than you think. My Super-lite flagged brush only lasted a couple of months, won’t bother with flagged brushes again not suitable for window cleaning IMO, I will just stick with mono-filament and change them regular.
2 months what did you do to it i have had mine over a year now