Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Luc on January 06, 2010, 07:31:27 pm
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hi guys.
After buying a hydramaster 318 last year and having a really busy year, im thinking of buying another truckmount but this time buying a dual wand machine. i always work as a team of 2 and sometimes wonder if having the abiltity to dual wand on say a large house would be quicker??
does anyone on here regulaly use dual wanding in a customer house and lets say on a rather large upholstery job?? are there any plus's and minus's?
second queston - some of the engines on the larger dual wand machines are simular to car engines and are probally not reving as high and lif this is true does the engine last longer??
Ive looked both a woodbridge 25 and a prochem peak and thinking of looking at the bluewave line. Dose anyone recomend a good machine?
Many thanks guys
luc
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Luc there are lots of variables such as your budget your location and more importantly work load,
not forgetting your expectations ,
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Luc
As with all machines, there are entry level dual wanders. Some of these lower spec machines will only perform to an acceptable standard with one wand and one upholstery tool over modest hose lengths, so you will need to define your needs quite accurately.
My gut feeling for residential work is that the time saving for 2 wands wouldn't justify the capital outlay. Because of hose management and set-up/breakdown times, it could conceivably be slower :o How many of your jobs a day/week are housefuls that would possibly justify the two wands?
If your 318 has only one solution outlet, try a line-splitter and your assistant can use an in line sprayer whilst you are wanding. This could save a lot of time and bucket loads of cash. If the assistant were also to agitate with, for example, an Envirodri, this too could make the wanding much quicker. Depends on your soil types and density.
Safe and happy cleaning :)
The Ken
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Must admit I had a few problems with my air cooled engine getting too hot but never had that problem with my water cooled only trouble is with my short hose runs are that I get locked on and have to reduce the revs and also a bigger engine will cost more to run, if someone made a water cooled TM but 318 is I'd be happier but it aint gonna happen as water cooled engines are too expensive for the smaller TM market.
If you are doing commercials with it get a water cooled engine or even a diesel.
Shaun
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Hi Dave,
ive been looking at buying a new machine for a few months and feel i have the workload to support a dual wand machine. The reason im asking is today i had to clean a rather large house, 4 large bedrooms, kitchen, lounge, hall stairs and landing and 2 2 seaters. im thinking that having the ability to dual wand and use two upholstery tools on a job this size would cut the time down by half?? i take turns with my brother to clean and spray etc but felt that there was long periods when i was doing nothing. (apart from drinking tea and chatting to the custie ;)
I also have regular comercial work where i feel i need to upgrade the machine.
I have seen a prochem apex in action on single wand and was amazed at how smooth and it seem to be quieter than my 318. im based in Essex and altho i feel hydramster make good machine, havin to drive 2 hours to service or 8 hours main dealer is a nightmare.
to be honest when i first brought my first TM (a spitfire) i used to think i would never have to upgrade from that lol. But now with a increase work load im wondering if buying a larger engine with dual wand will have its advantages in time saved.
Many thanks
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Good answer Ken only down side is whilst his mate is pre spraying the water flow will greatly be reduced at the wand thus slowing the opperation of cleaning down.
Shaun's answer is the better one to go with as he has the experience with these types of machines.
When I ran my business in Wolverhampton dual wanding on furniture in the silly season was a bonus, so if you have high volume it can be something to look at.
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Ken - i have tried using a splitter but the flow was reduced really badly.
Dave - exactly my point. before xmas we was so busy and had a rather increase in the amount of furniture we had to clean, i had 5 or 6 days when i was cleaning two sets of furniture along with carpets etc.
Shaun thats another reason why i want to buy a liquid cooled engine, as i feel my 318 gets to hot at times.
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Ken, didnt realise you had truck experience ? Fair answer though.
Luc, try and twist Dave arm for a part ex with the 318 as I know for a fact he has a really nice 25 dual wander sitting in a garage somewere snowy ;)
Shaun, why are you after moving yours on so soon?
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Something to bear in mind when buying a dual opperator machine is it is what it says on the can for dual use.
I'm not taking the pea but these machines deliver some serious heat as Shaun will tell you . So to get the best from them they have to be used as they were made for,
Speak to Shaun I do believe he has what your looking for as you have what he wants
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I was looking at the prochem range as they are only based under the hour from where i live.
They have just released a new machine called the peak gts and the apex is quite powerful. Either that or im looking at the altec range.
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In that case can i have the pro 25 please.
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Have an idea or dream of getting a smaller van, before Xmas I was thinking of getting a 4 x 4 single cab and putting it in there and I wish I had today.
There isn't anything wrong with my machine had a problem with the solenoid valve sticking with the lpg which was trying to find a needle in a hay stack the problem thing is I paid for it last month.
Shaun
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Shaun, before Xmas you posted you were getting a second van and truck this year !
Also you were doing 5k a week on your own.
Now you are looking to down size.
Whats happened over the past two weeks ?
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His had his credit card bill for xmas silly
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i would go for a 25 woodbridge mate good machines and after care no matter what people say i have a 15 and had one problem and was sorted straight away cant go wrong only my opinion mind end of day its your cash.
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Fresh I hear what you say as I have had a 20 and now the 25 as well as the Phoenix but like Luc if I was looking to dual on a regular basis then it would have to be water cooled engine driven machine for me and they are
Max 450 diesel
Max470 petrol
Boxxer 427
Or if I was flush i'd go for the new Titan range
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Just in the process of buying another dry cleaners which is a lot bigger than the one we have already got, last year early on I was planning another van but just didn't want the hassle, planning a change though simpler carpet cleaning in a more multi purpose vehicle, I think I have hit my carpet cleaning high and may be looking for a different challenge but with carpet cleaning thrown in for cash flow.
Shaun
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Those Titans do look good and I have heard (well I haven't heard anything) that they are very quiet.
Shaun
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Hi Luc ,
Remember me - john JSM who moved to wales - i used to clean your windows and your dad taught me all I know ........ ;D
good to see you doing well ... i did grab your number of the web as i was going to give you a bell as im looking at a trucky too .
chat soon fella -- you still got the TT ???? lol
Forget the two man truckmount - just get your dad back out on the Ninja lol
love to family .
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Luc
Both Alltec and Woodbridge are near to you I'm a big believer in being near enough to get problems sorted in a day!
I have the Cobalt which seems a good machine although to be fair I haven't used any others.
Cheers
Doug
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Location of supplier is a bit a pain when there is non within miles and miles.
Here in north Cheshire we got Dry Fusion and Host within 40 minutes, neither do portables, never mind TM's.
Hence Prowler, dealer 175 miles away.
and Scorpion, dealer 325 miles away.
It doesnt matter to me what I have - they all a long way - so service I get over the phone is paramount, and from these 2 suppliers I get very good service.
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hiya John,
yep i remember you lol. Yeah still got the tm. Amazing machines and would never go back to the portable unless i cant get access. Anything for a easier life lol. Only thing is the servicing and oil change every 50 hours.
thanks for all the advice guys. im gonna go and look at the new prochem machine and also see the promount 25 in action. only thing im worried about with the promount is it only a 25 hp engine. and i understand that the liquid cooled engines run better.
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I have heard that the Prochem range are really good and much easier to work on than Prochem Truckmounts of years gone by. Ive had a look around some of the newer generation Prochem units and they look very impressive. I can fully understand your thinking regarding service/repair. The last thing you want is a breakdown and having to travel hundreds of miles to get the repair sorted. Water cooled engines are built to last and do last much longer than air cooled engines. If you choose a petrol engine then if i were you id get it LPG converted. The alternative is Diesel powered engine. In theory these engines should out last petrol engines plus remember that you can run a diesel powered truckmount on Red Diesel.
Richie.
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Thanks for the advice richie. The prochems do look nice but then i have heard good reports about the boxer 427, is it possible to run lpg on the 427? I just wish hydramaster were based that little bit closer to me. ??? overall i have always found john to be quite helpful when ive had problems with my old spitfire or my 318
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Yes the 427 can be run on LPG, i would have thought that any petrol engine can be ran on LPG. Having spoken to other CCs i have been made aware that Alltech do a better LPG conversion than Hydramaster. Hydramaster & Alltech are the two company names that crop up on these forums for been the best when it comes to after sales / service / repair. I have dealt with Hydramaster and always found them very good.
Richie.
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Don't rely on Alltec for customer service, I've had a proper nightmare with them in the last few months.
The blueline machines are good though. But we have a choice now, DriEaz in Milton Keynes are (i think) owned by the same people who own blueline, so you can get the machines and servicing done there now. The only reservation about that I would have is the experience of the engineers, they'll be using you as their learning curve probably, starting from scratch means they'll not be as hot as an engineer who's been working on blueline machines for years.
I heard a rumour recently too, that Alltec were breaking ties with blueline. Don't know if that's true but might explain why they don't apparently give a monkeys about keeping my business ::)
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I'am surprised Jim that you have had a bad experience with Alltec. I don't own one of there machines and I've bought very little from them over the years. I have had excellent service with regards some repairs with my TM last year.
David
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Luc,
I take my Hydramaster down to their contractors in Oxford, last time I was there, a cleaner from Essex was having his truckmount serviced.
He told me it took him approx; 1.50 hours to get there, which isn't too bad.
The lads there are really the dogs too.
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Hi Guys
Jim, I too am surprised that Alltec gave you poor service, they have always been good when I have gone to them, in fact the best customer service I have had in the industry.
Could it be something to do with Servicemaster?
Cheers
Doug
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Luc,
I take my Hydramaster down to their contractors in Oxford, last time I was there, a cleaner from Essex was having his truckmount serviced.
He told me it took him approx; 1.50 hours to get there, which isn't too bad.
The lads there are really the dogs too.
Agree nice lads plenty of Tea ;)
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what about 2 prolwer's in the van ... just a thought .
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I've had good service from Alltec and also HM Oxford, both are the same distance from me but Alltec will do lpg repairs my old 421 knew Roger in Oxford so well and was on his christmas card list.
Shaun
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Yeah Roger and lads in oxford are top guys. My old spitfire was in there a few times when i had problems with it. Roger is always very helpful and a good guy to chat with. Oxford is not a bad run, but if anything major does go wrong then its cornwall. The only thing is the m25 with going to oxford. sometimes you can fly round there. toher times it takes 2 hours just to get to the m40 from essex.
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Hi Luc
Like yourself i work as part of a two man team a lot of the time.
We will "dual" on almost every suite we do and also on large domestics and believe me it does save a lot of time.
Yesterday we cleaned some offices(ground and first floor) which was around 480 sqm and we had the job completed in just over 2.5 hrs due to the fact we were dual wanding.
Cheers
Steve
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What machine are you running Steve ?
regards
Chris
ps I dual wand on suites with my woodbridge 20hp, using a hose splitter.
Saves a lot of time.
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Just a view but how on earth do you get around in someones house with all those pipes every where.
Its bad enough with just me tripping up over myself never mind wondering whats behind me!
Murky
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Chris
We run a Maxx 470 Turbo Diesel and a Boxxer 427
Murky
Good hose managementis the key ;D
But do agree in small domestics doing upholstery it can be a pain in the ass at times1
Cheers
Steve
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Steve,
Someone has called me regarding the Hydramaster 470 Turbo Diesel. He may be looking at buying one but wants to know as much about the unit as possible before making a decision either way. He has seen a 470 Petrol in operation & wanted to know what the Diesel is like when compared to the petrol unit. Would it be ok to pass your telephone number onto him?
Richie.
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I have used Steves 470TD, it's exactly like the Maxx470 petrol only diesel - smae vac power etc.
The heat is as you would expect on a Maxx "very hot" and the noise is smoother than a standard 450 Maxx and I'd say quieter.
Needless to say it's Very economical.
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How quiet do you think the Titan will be? do you think it will be any hotter than your 470?
Shaun
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I think it will be quieter than the Maxx due to the fact that the exhausts are different and the fact that the air pump is absent, this was somewhat noisy on high speed. The Maxx has an operating temp of 240f and then Titan some 25f higher or so.
However the Maxx is one of the hottest TM's made.
I'll let you know.
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Hi Mac
Yes you can give the guy my number
Cheers
Steve