Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: GB Window Cleaning on October 29, 2009, 01:50:43 pm
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i think im under pricing my jobs or im too slow...
ive read alot of you price for £15 to £30 per hour.
ive also read alot of you price £1 a window and 50p per ladder lift.
when you say £1 per window does that include frames and sills?
im not making enough money at the moment and im getting disalusioned to be honest!
any advice and tips are very welcome!
thanks, george.
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what area you in,
are you trad or wfp,
what would you charge for 2 up 2 down
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im in the east midlands area.
im trad and w.f.p.
for a 2 up 2 down with 6 windows i would charge £6 incuding frames and sills each and every time!
£3 for just glass!
what do you recon r w c?
thanks.
p.s i would charge £1 extra for each door (which would include glass and door)
p.p.s my serice includes any paint and sticker removal from glass frames and sills.
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I would of thought you should be looking for between £10-£12 including frames on that sort of property, I charge for frames on every clean as custys like this when I say that I do it,Im wfp and far far south so things may be different from where you are, theres quite a few on here from your area so im sure youll get a few more replys.
Chris
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thanks chris
it looks like im under charging by about 50%.
i might start charging £1 for just glass and £2 for glass frames and sills! what does everyone think?
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Thats pretty much what I would have suggested,
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really matt? okay i'll give that a try!
by the way matt how much do you charge and where abouts do you live and work?
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really matt? okay i'll give that a try!
by the way matt how much do you charge and where abouts do you live and work?
He doesnt do many houses as he too busy getting locked behind bars ;D
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really matt? okay i'll give that a try!
by the way matt how much do you charge and where abouts do you live and work?
I have customers in the Hinckley area of Leicestershire, I charge £1 per window, £1.50 for patio window/french doors, £2.00 for bay windows/windows on the second floor and sky lights and 50p per door, I only scrub the frames on the first clean, then quickly go over them every other clean.
Matt
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really matt? okay i'll give that a try!
by the way matt how much do you charge and where abouts do you live and work?
He doesnt do many houses as he too busy getting locked behind bars ;D
;D ;D ;D
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lol yeah i heard about that! some customers are so effing stupid matt.
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GB,
I don't think there is too much wrong with your current pricing, so it must be your speed!
By all means up your pricing if you think you can get away with it
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I basically offer two seperate services, a basic clean (just glass) and a premium clean (glass frames and sills) does anyone think this is a good idea?
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Hi GB, Here is what Ian Giles said about pricing and hourly rates etc, He doesn't post much, but when he does it makes sense (Most of the time :D ). Hope it helps.
Break down windows into a unit cost.
Then it is just a case of walking around a job, counting up the windows, breaking them down into what you consider to be a unit and multiply by whatever you have allowed as your unit cost.
It makes pricing far more accurate and takes out a large element of 'guess-timation' from the equation.
If you are fairly new to the game then you need to know what the average time it takes for an experienced window cleaner to clean your average window.
In basic terms, an average casement window, about 45" tall and about the same in width, with 3 panes of glass, one narrow opening light above a single fixed pane, and a longer opening pane to the one side will take approx 90 seconds to clean, including any detailing thats needed.
And that is to a good standard including the sills wiped down properly.
Oh, the above is for trad window cleaning, but generally, even if WFP, it is best to price up as for trad.
AS Simon said, to begin with you will be miles slower than someone experienced, but these are the people you are pricing against, so you need to be competitive...
AS your skills and speed increase then so do your earnings.
What you charge per window (or unit) is up to you, and is also to a degree governed by your location in the country.
My own unit charge is £1.00, and my rate - per - minute - worked is also £1.00
This does not mean earnings of £60 an hour...not by any stretch of the imagination...there is a world of difference between the rate - per - minute - worked and what you eventually earn per hour.
The rate per minute is the time taken when you are actually at the windows cleaning them, no allowance for talking to customers, setting up or putting away or driving between jobs, or time off because of the weather/holidays/sickness/breakdowns and so on.
I'm WFP so my time per window is more like 30 seconds rather than 90 seconds and an average semi will take me around 10 minutes to actually 'clean'...but there is no way I will average 6 semi's an hour!!!!
Mr average on a good day will ...er...average about 3 0r 4 an hour over a full days work, oh, and for most an average days work will rarely be more than 6 hours before he (or she) is heading off home. That isn't to say many don't work considerably longer hours, we often work much longer ourselves (6am starts and 5pm finishes).
Something else to ALWAYS remember is that your hourly turnover rate (perceived not actual!!) is not your wage! it is your business income/turnover from which you take your wage....
Have a minimum charge and over and above that, price per unit and NOT per hour.
Ian
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thanks guest,
anyone else got any input?
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Are you getting 100% of the work your pricing if so your too cheap id raise new work to an extra 50% and if your still getting it all double your original price. Also give your current work a rise in the new year.
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i would say i get 9 out of 10 jobs i price.
good advice r w c thankyou
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£6 for six windows seems good to me. £3 for just glass is where you are going wrong, sills everytime but frames every now and then if you are using squeegee etc. A house like this should take 15 minutes maximum so 4 in an hour £24. How long are you taking to clean them?
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im thinking it should be more like £12 for 6 windows and £6 for just glass to be honest!?!?!
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im thinking it should be more like £12 for 6 windows and £6 for just glass to be honest!?!?!
£6 for the glass is about right to me but always give the sills a wipe it takes a second and it will keep your customers happy.
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dont price by the glass , just price by how much you want to clean the lot .
think how long it will take by trad not wfp that way you get what you want. ;)
wfp is faster .
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yeah i always wipe any dirty water i create on the sills and frames while cleaning glass
anyone else got anything to add?
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really matt? okay i'll give that a try!
by the way matt how much do you charge and where abouts do you live and work?
He doesnt do many houses as he too busy getting locked behind bars ;D
I forgot to say in the original thread when she got back she tied me to the bed and smothered me in chocolate and ice-cream.
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really matt? okay i'll give that a try!
by the way matt how much do you charge and where abouts do you live and work?
He doesnt do many houses as he too busy getting locked behind bars ;D
I forgot to say in the original thread when she got back she tied me to the bed and smothered me in chocolate and ice-cream.
was that it, no specials
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I'd be banned (agsin) if I told what else she did to me ;D
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thanks guest,
anyone else got any input?
You won't go far wrong if you go for £1 a window with a £10 minimum. Do sills as standard and charge 50% extra when they want frames cleaned. Alternatively, retaining the £10 minimum, maybe £1.20-£1.40 a window and wipe frames each time. Try to keep the pricing to £1 multiples though.
Particularly on larger or unusual jobs, it's a good idea to do a frame count AND a time estimate. You can then go for the higher of the two if you're unsure what to charge. The worst that happens is they say no.
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I'd be banned (agsin) if I told what else she did to me ;D
we do not want to know what her dogs did to you Matt. ::)
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ive been thinking about this alot over the last few days and i think i might be setting myself up for a fall for when i go full time on my w.f.p let me explain...
at the moment im offering two seperate services,
service 1, basic (just glass)
service 2, premium (glass frames & sill)
(doors are optional extra's)
i use traditional methods for basic cleans (just glass) and wfp for anything above ground floor for premium clean (glass frames and sills).
Now the problem i have with this way of working is when i go w.f.p full time the two seperate services will go out the window becaause the w.f.p does frames glass and sills anyway!?!?
can you see my dilema? and what is everyones thoughts and idea on this?
help im confused!?!?!
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hmmm thanks ewan,
I think you might have a good point there! i think im over coplicating things!
what about doors do most window cleaner incude doors or are they optional extra?
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thanks GDroundbuilder,
The only thing that suprises me about what youve just said is that i should include doors as standard!
thanks for your input im in lincoln by the way.
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i include doors as standard, whats the point in cleaning the windows, when some one walks up to the door and it is dirty, i use wfp and takes a min to clean a door, most custy dont even realise that a window cleaner has been unless theres a note (i hope this doesnt mean i am a crap wc) but where i am in cornwall a lot of the doors are pvc and collect a lot of dirt on the patterns more than the , its like when i do commercial, i clean signs takes a few minutes but can be the difference between a regular custy or a one off
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GB, how long have you been window cleaning? Because if you have just started, you will double your speed by 6 months anyway.
I look at your pricing and think that is fine. I have a £10 minimum but your prices are good.
I clean every hole in the wall that has glass in it. The frames as well.
The only problem i can see is working 2 methods alongside each other. You would be better off using wfp on everything.
As i asked how long have you been cleaning traditionally and wfp. Because on repeat work you can end up doing work in fractions of the time that you do now.
I would also clean the frames as well for that price. They set the scene. They only need scrubbing well once then a quick rub on repeat cleans.
If you haven't been going long, your slowness is understandable compared to hourly rates seen on here. The speed will come automaticallywith time, as you understand each property.
All you really need to do is keep doing a good job. The speed will come without the need to cut corners. As tempting as that can be.
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I multiply standard windows X 80 pence. And round up to nearest pound.
Non standard windows are £1 or more.
But with a minmum of a tenner. The tenner minimum only exists for new work taken on which i explain over the phone before i go and quote.
I have several £6 jobs that are £10 because of it. I am too expensive for others.
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thats a politicians answer, what do you charge?? and where are you?
What do you mean politicians. There is no standard 4 bed detatched house round here.
I have 3 and the cheapest is £15 and most £22. I'm in north suffolk and work mostly villages.
I gave price per type of window so you can work it out.
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They all have conservatories. And the cheapest i know from my pricing had 18 windows. The £22 26 / 27 windows.
My 80p per standard window seems cheap compared to many on here but i achieve £30+ per working hour.
On conservatories i clean the fascia and gutters which are at head height in the price. This only needs thoroughly doing the 1st time, then a quick brush whenever there's a little dirt.
Over 90% of my work is in villages. I get many calls from town but it's 50/50 if i am too expensive or not.
I stopped working town 4 years ago cos i was fed up with prices. I've only in the last year stopped turning down work in the towns. But as i say, sometimes i'm too expensive.
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Fair play to you fella, if you can get those kind of prices in villages then i would steer clear of towns too.
Most of these prices were from when i was traditional. I priced and still do per window. Not time. It is only when quoting commercial work where there are sheets of glass that i will take time into account.
The best bit of advice i have implemented from here is to have a minimum charge.
I pondered for ages, then when i went wfp i got calls for quotes and always said i have a £10 minumum charge. I think people expect it because i have only had 1 person say ok no thanks.
I have about a dozen jobs that would have been priced between 6-8 quid.
I am in north suffolk in villages around the lowestoft, beccles and bungay area. There is a huge price different between lowestoft and the villages.
There is good money in the coutryside. Most houses have more and larger windows than town equivalents.
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I have picked up directly and indirectly (neighbours/relatives/friends etc) around £1500 per month of work from a £10 a year advert in a parish magazine. 5 years it's been now.
Parish magazines are the best way to get a foothold in the coutryside. The types that get it are community types who network. Cracking properties and good working environment.
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Why do you guys get obsessed with Roundbuilders making money?? Surely we are all in business to make money???
So if you had two houses together for £8 you would still insist on a £10 minimum charge??
No I dont clean windows but I work very closely with my customers to make sure they are happy, if you read my post again you will see I agreed with a minimum charge in principle just not across the board.
I still stand by that...
That is because you do not clean them fella, you dont own a window cleaning company, you see it from your business view and to window cleaners that make monmey for this very reason it is wrong.
I do not in anyway have a problem with you making money, I use round building companies from time to me to add to work load..
Min charges are there for a reason ;) even if you have 2 £8 house either side, I call it customer loyaltiy bonus , sorry cant read what I am typing as ciu and msn ie seem not to like each other at the moment.
Ian
p.s I really dont have a problem, but it is good for you to listen m8 ;)
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customer loyalty bonus?? wow
longer they stay the cheaper there prices will be from others, trust me it work have been doing it many years ;) this is why you knocking and giving a new customer it cheaper than min charge does not work fella, it is flored and will only long term earn you more money not the window cleaner, unless they are very lucky
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I also price up each job as a stand alone. I don't do discounts if i have next door as well. I do this because if i lose 1 the other isn't worth doing so i in effect lose 2 customers.
I don't reduce prices over time either. I look at each new quote and think would i be happy cleaning this for ££ for the next 3 years. If no i add a quid on or whatever.
Any extras i do might be low level guttering around porches and conservatories. But i have to be happy with the price. It can be demoralising going to a job semi unhappy.
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I also price up each job as a stand alone. I don't do discounts if i have next door as well. I do this because if i lose 1 the other isn't worth doing so i in effect lose 2 customers.
I don't reduce prices over time either. I look at each new quote and think would i be happy cleaning this for ££ for the next 3 years. If no i add a quid on or whatever.
Any extras i do might be low level guttering around porches and conservatories. But i have to be happy with the price. It can be demoralising going to a job semi unhappy.
Spot on. ;)
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My average price is over a tenner anyways and we hardly ever drop below, but that said if its only a small house you just cant get away with a tenner....
For someone who is established and has all the work they need it is very easy to be picky about the new work they take on.
I have been doinf this since march and only very very rarely have i quoted cheaper prices than the customers is already being charged.
I know full well some people on here pump up there prices on this forum to make themselves look better(and I am not aiming that at anyone in particular) I work all over the UK on a daily basis and probably have a better feel for REAL WORLD national prices than anyone on here.
In most areas when I knock on and quote 11 to 12 for a 4 bed detached they reel a little as they are not or have not paid that kind of money before, it takes hard work, skill and persuasion to get them to change to pay more.
And I have references on here to prove my word...
I have tio say you do talk the talk, not saying your not being honest as I do belive you, there are just so many poor round builders out there that promise and cant deliver, it gets a little annoying.
but still I would stick by min charge as I do it daily and I know my areas obviously :)
i
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I have minimum charge but if a neighbour wants the front done that's a fiver or whatever. I'm not that hard.
But if it is a new job and requires a its own single trip, that's a tenner minimum please.
Gd roundbuilder, do you find 80p per standard window excessive?
I get 90% of rural work and 50% of town work using this method of pricing.
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ask marccope or deantaberner,
I have a list of customers nationwide, and they will always back me up. I have had one come back to me today after I had not heard from him in a while.
you are right I do talk the talk but I can back it all up with daily results....
Good for you,
I do not agree with your last post by the way as I do not want to be a busy fool
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you would lose a job over a pound????
would you pay me £1 per month that they stayed a customer ? :-\
to help you, if they was under my min charge then yes I would turn them away, I have a min charge for a reason and because the odd person does not want to pay it is not a reason for me to drop it. That is not good business at all.
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mark, that sounds spot on to me mate.
One thing I would say is dont walk away from a job for the sake of a pound or two, its the old glass half full or half empty conundrum. I would much rather have a job for £9 even if it should be £10 rather than no job at all....
You never know where that job might lead...
Yes i understand what you say. And good advice.
But it's never been a case of walking away. They just never accepted the quote. I am too long in the tooth now (not window cleaning) to realise that what i've never had i've never lost.
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well all i would say to that is when you deliver the price, if they dont say yes ask why? Then just discuss and come to a compromise if you can. Each quote is worth £120 a year to you so dont just give up on the first no....
I seem to have a different sales pitch to most, I do not go in at a higher price in the hope of getting it, I quote the price I want and it is plain and simple, they can have it cheaper if they have it over a longer period but the price per clean goes up I win either way.
each customer is not worth £120 at all
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So if you quoted 11 to a customer and they said 'would you do it for a tenner?' you would walk away?
No i wouldn't. I would call it a tenner. It would increase to 12 eventually.
I don't haggle, i give my price and that's it. There is no haggle going on. I explain my service and that's it.
Having different prices where the people that questioned my quote the most had the cheapest prices, doesn't sit right with me. ???
Thing is i'm building something to serve me well for years. I've got to be happy to provide the level of service i promise the customer.
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So if you quoted 11 to a customer and they said 'would you do it for a tenner?' you would walk away?
no I would offer them a different service ;)
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All this for a pound? well guys you crack on...
I am off to the land of nod, sweet dreams.....
Hope your dreaming of a pound :P
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Yeah go on ewan. You've got me thinking i might not know now. ;D Put us out of our misery.
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Is it me Mark or is he avoiding the subject? Have I not used my manners? oh i am so sorry.... will you enlighten me please, in fact pretty please with bells on... that better???
You still think i gave a politicians answer earlier?? ;D
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I think a minimum charge only works for jobs you have to travel to, when we work an area we tend to get a high density of work so if we get any below a tenner(which is rare these days) then they work into the round and become viable...
Do understand the minimum but I wouldnt impliment it across the board...
As has been stated, a job must be priced as if it stands alone. No point discounting if you get four in a row etc. This is because custies move on/cancel etc. Then you get left with one on their own that is too cheap. Usually the workload increases but sometimes it reduces in a street too. As a canvasser, I assume you've only ever seen increasing amounts of work occurring rather than a few months/years down the line when out of those four houses, only the two at either end remain - each requiring their own equipment set up due to hoses being across the driveways of now non customers. Of course it does happen thew other way too with gaps being filled in. This is my point. There is no way of predicting it so you have to do standalone pricing just in case.
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My average price is over a tenner anyways and we hardly ever drop below, but that said if its only a small house you just cant get away with a tenner....
For someone who is established and has all the work they need it is very easy to be picky about the new work they take on.
I have been doinf this since march and only very very rarely have i quoted cheaper prices than the customers is already being charged.
I know full well some people on here pump up there prices on this forum to make themselves look better(and I am not aiming that at anyone in particular) I work all over the UK on a daily basis and probably have a better feel for REAL WORLD national prices than anyone on here.
In most areas when I knock on and quote 11 to 12 for a 4 bed detached they reel a little as they are not or have not paid that kind of money before, it takes hard work, skill and persuasion to get them to change to pay more.
And I have references on here to prove my word...
If you feel that a W/C wants a higher than average price for jobs in a particular area, my guess is that rather than trying to keep the price of the clean down, you ought to be asking extra per clean from the W/C e.g. rather than 2x maybe 2.5 or 3x. Possibly with the extra bit being paid after a while if the customer is retained. Or am I being naive in assuming that most W/Cs would be as honest with you as I would be?
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I am sorry but it just seems like another case of glass half empty, if you are doing a good job then your work load in a particular area should only ever rise, as long as you not travelling miles between jobs then I cant see a problem.....
Not necessarily so. It is normal for a workload to rise in an immediate area but there are occasions when the opposite is true. The quality of work and the pricing are just two of a number of factors. The customer deciding to clean their own windows, moving away and the new owner doesn't want a service, and unemployment (or the fear of) are other reasons that are not cleaner related. Also, some retire from work and need to cut back on expenditure. Indeed, sometimes in a block of work there will nbe one or two customers who mess about. In those circumstances, it is I who makes the decision to stop cleaning to keep the work viable.
Customer does not pay for lack of density. In my business the customer pays the same price whether the work is dense or not.
I do see things from your perspective too.
You are the canvasser. The money you get from the W/C is your business income. The quality of the work is not your problem. The longterm viability/sustainability of the work is not your problem. Padlocked gates and dogs mess all around the patio are not your problem. You are better off obtaining the work a little cheaper if it means a higher volume of customers. I'm not having a go at you. I would probably view it the same way if I were a canvasser rather than a cleaner.
There is a big grey area where a canvasser's requirements and a cleaner's requirements are not the same. It is that grey area that has brought about conflicts between the two parties in the past. If there were acceptable ways of addressing those differences, a lot could be gained by both parties.
For instance, canvassing work along a stretch of double yellow lines in a busy area near traffic lights or a junction. If I were doing my own canvassing, I would avoid like the plague. Areas where parking is particularly difficult also. I always avoided such work - even when I was building the round up at first. Not so bad back then if I could park legally and walk with the ladder but now it's tricky when using hose. Although a backpack will do some situations, it is limited IMO.
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If you read through the posts, I have never said that you should discount a job if you have more in an area. What i did say is that maybe a minimum charge does not work in that scenario.....
You've already said that you don't actually do the cleaning. If you did, you would realise why having a minimum is a good idea.
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Mate on friday i picked up £164 worth of work in 13 jobs at over a £12.50 average.....
My point with some of the guys on here is that they would turn the work away if it was a little under priced rather than take it on and develop it.....
Once I have spent time with people explaining what you can get away with they usually come round to my way of thinking....
or you would come round to our way of thinking ;)
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get away with what?
doing a slap daash job for low prices?
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i cannot believe you lot have been up all night talking about this :o
does your wives snore ;D
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I dont have a minimum , but dont do anything for less than a tenner!!!! ;D ;D
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how can people be underpricing surely it all depends on where you live,
i would love to have a average of 12.50 a job, but i live in cornwall and have a average of 6 quid due to all the starter homes and 2 bed houses and 1 bedroom bung for people waiting for death by the sea down here
if i lived in london then prehaps i would be classed as undercutting other window cleaners, if i wasnt charging 15 a house
the reason i took on "crap jobs" is because when i started, i need work, and took on anything that would pay reasonable, to build up round and get me known, which it did, but am slowly replacing it with better work
prehaps the people who say that 12.50 is cheap must have more work can they can handle and only want the cream which i understand
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i cannot believe you lot have been up all night talking about this :o
does your wives snore ;D
Like a pig ;D
I do actually live on my own. As I was so tired I went to bed around 9. Therefore I woke up a bit before 3. Then I went back to bed about 5.30 and slept some more until about 8.30. Funnily enough, I had a far better nights sleep than I usually get.
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how can people be underpricing surely it all depends on where you live,
i would love to have a average of 12.50 a job, but i live in cornwall and have a average of 6 quid due to all the starter homes and 2 bed houses and 1 bedroom bung for people waiting for death by the sea down here
if i lived in london then prehaps i would be classed as undercutting other window cleaners, if i wasnt charging 15 a house
the reason i took on "crap jobs" is because when i started, i need work, and took on anything that would pay reasonable, to build up round and get me known, which it did, but am slowly replacing it with better work
prehaps the people who say that 12.50 is cheap must have more work can they can handle and only want the cream which i understand
I do have a fair bit of work in the £10 - £13 bracket. A property has to be a lot smaller now to do for a tenner than it used to be. Although I will still do new jobs for £10, it's very unusual for me to price under £12. Also, I do have some pre-existing work that is cheaper (a bit too much of it if truth be told). The cheapest house I do is £6 (3 tiny cottages in a row). I also do a ground floor maisonette for a fiver. The only reason I haven't put it up is because he has no cheque book and sends cash in the post ;D . In truth, the actual clean really is just about 6 - 7 minutes at a plod and I drive right past his door anyway.
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thanks to everyone for all your input, your opinions and this forum are pricless to me.
i think i am going to implement a min £10 charge from now on too.
I have been cleaning windows for about six months now, on my own with no training or help from anyone.
in the last month i have gone w.f.p from trad, but i only filter water using d.i in a tap water p.p.m reading erea of 300. hence the reason im only using w.f.p for 1st floor and above.
Now to simplify my orignal question what do you all think an east midlands (lincolnshire) indow cleaner should earn an hour?
many thank again everyone george
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Then just discuss and come to a compromise if you can.
I wouldnt pay money to a roundbuilder if he wasnt securing properties at their true worth. Lower your price, and work for less than your true worth or value??? You really shouldnt have posted that about your business methods on a national forum.
I would presume that you would do that to help ensure you line your pocket and do your customer (the window cleaner) out of the products (the round you are being paid to build) true worth. Not good.
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See, me and Ewan.....peas from the same pod :D
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Now to simplify my orignal question what do you all think an east midlands (lincolnshire) indow cleaner should earn an hour?
£25 an hour? Not less definately and more if you can. Once you take into consideration daylight hours, time off for inclement weather, holidays and sickness; you'll still be skint at £25 an hour if you've got a family to maintain.
But I would say that unless you're a natural, you won't be upto full speed after six months.
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okay thanks tosh.
i was thinking £30 an hour to be honest?!?!
anyone from lincolnshire on hear can tell me what they earn an hour?
thanks again. george
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I think it is wise to pay heed to ones client even round builder.Getting step with our income base in never a bad idea.Allowing your client to dictate is no wise business practice.
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so £30 an hour for lincolnshire w.c about right? :)
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I think gdroundbuilders words have been seized on a bit harshly. What he says about the 10 or 11 quid job is right i think. I did the same when i was building my round to a level that i could live off.
Only once i reached that point did i become more true to my word.
The majority of us on this post are only looking to improve our work, rather than try to suck everything up. That i think is why gd has been jumped on. But for those who need to grow asap, his canvassing methods are sound. They could always be better, but there isn't anything wrong with it. I think it's a positive at the building stage of business.
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100 phour is right if you can get it, and clean it :)
you decide what you want
it all depends on type of customer, how good a service you offer/do, the competition, the demographic, how efficient andquick you can clean and work
i might earn more than you doing the same work as i clean faster so there is no "hourly rate" it all down to you
rather than per hour canvass work per unit ie £1 per window that way you will never go wrong and extra money comes from your speed cleaning them
if you can demand a higher price for your work then do so
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rather than per hour canvass work per unit ie £1 per window that way you will never go wrong and extra money comes from your speed cleaning them
thanks sean...
when you say £1 per window does that include frames?
george.
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Dear All,
I am only going to post once more on this subject, I work very closely with my cleaners to make sure our relationship is profitable for us both. I do not underprice or undervalue work in any way, I will however not walk away from a deal over a pound!!
I am fully aware my kind of services are not for everyone, and I am not trying to convert anyone(I dont need to for a start as I have plenty of work) all i was trying to do was make a point to a guy who is just starting out...
One day you guys will realise all this is subjective and there are no set rules....
Have a great day
George
I agree that it is subjective. It just appeared that you were the one who was trying to tell people with full rounds how to price. Of course I priced lower when I first started. Only because I didn't know any better though - I had no mentor and the internet wasn't really about back then like it is now.
Pricing can be regional. I do accept that. I don't accept about pricing differently because the work is compact though. I've done that before and it was a mistake IMO.
It's a pity you don't intend to contribute more to this thread. I do like to exchange ideas on different ways of doing things.
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rather than per hour canvass work per unit ie £1 per window that way you will never go wrong and extra money comes from your speed cleaning them
thanks sean...
when you say £1 per window does that include frames?
george.
the £1 is for a unit so say 3 windows in a set you would reach in one go
frames would be extra again to me but others do them ? another subject that :)
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lol ive opened up a can of worms with this thread!
anyone else from lincolnshire on here can tell me what there hourly rate is?
sorry for being nosy
thanks george.
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dont think you will get an answer, and an average over the year is different to what they would aim for or even there best rate
you really need to decide in your head how much you need per week, how much you want, what is realistic given you know how much you are charging per house and how long they take you
how many houses/hours you want to do each week, how much time off you want, what youre over heads are then you will have some kind of idea what hourly rate you want/need to make a living :)
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thanks for your input sean. anyone else? might as well make this thread 8 pages long lol.
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thanks for your input sean. anyone else? might as well make this thread 8 pages long lol.
how long you been cleaning?
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what do you want pal it isnt a sensible question
what is the hourly rate in lincolnshire for window cleaners??
might as well ask how long is a piece of string mate
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@ mark dew. ive been cleaning roughly 6 months now.
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This thread has been superb,
I was too tired to get involved last night,
George from GD roundbuilders has done a superb job for us in the past and I would definately use him again in the future,
Ive just had my part time lad finish on me and im coming up to a very busy time so theres not much call for extra domestics at the moment but as soon as it slows down I will be on the phone to george,
Dean
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yeah ive really enjoyed this thread too. thankyou to everyone for all your help!
george (G B Window cleaning)
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I have an opinion but to some people that is not allowed as I am not a window cleaner, I could never tell any business man how to run his business..
But in my opinion if you are a window cleaner with anything less than a full work load you would be mad to walk away from a customer for a pound or two, its better to be cleaning windows than sat at home wishing you had work...
You also can readjust the pricing over the next few months as once your new customer knows you they are much more likely to accept the 2 pound price increase, you also never know where a job can lead...... I mean referrals etc.
This is where your lack of window cleaning knowledge shows up. Anyone who thinks that you can agree a price then increase it in 2 months time is delusional. In fact try upping your price in the following 12 months and you will have a problem. You may well get recommendations but they will talk about how much it costs and if they have similar houses you will be hard pressed to explain any discrepancy in price structure.
I believe only a ROUNDBUILDER would not walk away until he had under priced a customer who wanted to haggle. The reason being is that a ROUNDBUILDER will make x3 or whatever on ANY signed up customer so better for the ROUNDBUILDER to lose x3 of the difference than not secure the job . However the WINDOW CLEANER is left having to service this customer EVERY MONTH wasting time when he could be cleaning higher priced work. Plus bear in mind the WINDOW CLEANER is PAYING for someone to build him a round. The ROUNDBUILDER should work hard to get the work at the value that the WINDOW CLEANER puts on it, not how much the ROUNDBUILDER thinks he can get. If I say I want a minimum price of £15.00 I would not pay for work that was priced up at £10.00.
This particular round builder needs to realise that he does not have the experience in this trade as many others on here who have commented and been 'put down' by this know-it-all!!
But as i said before each to their own.......
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I have to say GDroundbuilder I was playing you a little the other night as I could see you biting.
But on quite a couple of points I was being serious.
main one is I make the prices up for my company, if I hire people to get ME work they work to MY pricing Not What they think because I really do know my market better than any canvasser or canvassing company, why is this? this is because I canvass my self, I speak to alot of people in my areas and I know my target markets also I am the customer and I am always right ;D
I would walk away for £1 this is what makes my company grow where others are shrinking, I can say no and will..
Would I ever use your service, I do think I would as you just come back for more and more and I like this and I was being serious when I said you should listen... as your market is limited in repeat custom
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Kind of the point of roundbuilding is they dont have higher priced work to clean!!! If they did then they wouldnt need me......
Your arguement would stand if they had a full work book but they dont....
I will take that as a compliment windowwashers, if you did a little research on me you would find out I work very closely with my clients and I rarely lose them, alot of what I talk about on here is in principle not reality. People on here dont take individual circumstances into account when they say things on here.....
Anyway if anyone would like to explore using a roundbuilder further then email me george@gdrb.co.uk
Yeah good luck. I understood what you said. :)
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I don't believe there is such a thing as a going rate in a given area.
i'm in the lucky position of having as much work as I want. the phone keps ringing and i'm working to refine my work with the right jobs at the right (ever increasing) prices.
i'm getting away with charging twice as much as many of my competitors because most custy's have no idea what the going rate may be.
as long as they feel confident that you are professional, trustworthy and will do a great job they are likely to sign up regardless of price. (that's how I seems to me).
nowadays , when I pull up outside a house I think to myself "do I WANT this job", and price it accordingly.
my advice to anyone would be- keep working hard, advertise as much as you can afford, and don't let people take advantage of you.
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I totally agree 100%. 5 years now!
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Hi Dave
Again its all a case of the position you are in, you are in a very positive position and have probably been in the business for years...
The same rules dont apply for guys who are just starting out or building their business
I am still building my business
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lol you have not offered to help once, you only offer critisism.
I know enough about pricing to know my customers are very happy with my work, I dont seek or need your approval.......
Thats my last word to you ewan....
You can't argue with Ewan........He can pick a fight in an empty house ;D
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Took me 9 months to get to know him. He just comes across abit short sometimes.Not saying it gets better, just helps if you know him. He has been worse :D
I actually like reading his fights 8)
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We are ALL wrong. He (Ewan) knows what he's talking about, even though he is a car park attendant at Tesco's, so I've heard. ;D
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We are ALL wrong. He (Ewan) knows what he's talking about, even though he is a car park attendant at Tesco's, so I've heard. ;D
I have heard they call you Goby, I’ve also heard you & others have seen off Squeaky Clean! (Like a pack of dogs) ::)
Yes Ewan, It's Gobby and not Goby. Don't forget to concentrate on me, to make all the more difficult to answer posts go away for you.
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No Goby, I know what I wrote, maybe you should stick to single word association
::)
I don't care Ewan, if you spell Gobby with with 4 M's and a silent Q. It just shows your inability to learn. That's why YOU have problems with words like there and their, or too and to.
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Your invoices and quotes must be hilarious ;D
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No stupid, GDroundbuilder ask for help pricing, go ahead help him ::)
The reason, it's not important to you, it's because YOU didn' t pay attention at school, now it's too late and too complicated for you Ewan.
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Gaby mate he really aint worth it.....
he seems to enjoy all this, best way to get to him is ignore him...
You are absolutely right
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Ewan,
you really are a crazy character.
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We are ALL wrong. He (Ewan) knows what he's talking about, even though he is a car park attendant at Tesco's, so I've heard. ;D
lol...................... :-X sorry Ewan I found that funny.
Before i'm jumped on about my spelling and/or grammer, I know it is poor, I did not learn much at school as I was rarely there ::) not through bunking off I might add!
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Stuck at home babysitting a poorly little girl today so this forum is a bit of light relief, I was really enjoying this tread up to the point it got personal.
I was a big user of this and one or two other forums when they first started years ago but stopped as I got sick of the personal insults, I am disappointed but not surprised to see it still continues. oh well I guess I will just have to learn to accept some people can’t help themselves and either enjoy a good mudslinging match or don’t have the ability to ignore things.
Anyway as I said, A great thread and much learned, I personally have a very simple and effective method of pricing, I could explain it to a 10 year old in 2 minutes and guarantee that any house they were asked to price would be EXACTLY the right price (according to my requirements) every single time so don’t seem to have the problem many of you seem to experience. It is easy to use and adjustable by pennies or pounds with ease.
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Have to say I agree, this is the first thread I have come accross that I have thought it's gone a bit far. No need to exchange personal insults, it doesn't make for good reading. As I have said in the past this is the best forum of any type I have come across where every one seems to get on and be helpful to each other, let's keep it that way?!
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Neil i am just starting out and would be grateful of your pricing methods,i am just reading through all the comments trying to get a general idea,also could anyone tell me of a good/cheap place to get buissness cards/flyers etc
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hi neil gornall,
I too would be very greatfull to hear your pricing method!?!
many thanks, george.
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hi neil gornall,
I too would be very greatfull to hear your pricing method!?!
many thanks, george.
Neil i am just starting out and would be grateful of your pricing methods,i am just reading through all the comments trying to get a general idea,also could anyone tell me of a good/cheap place to get buissness cards/flyers etc
Sure no problem, send me an email address and I will contact you. You can contact me via my website. www.purerclean.co.uk
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At the end of the day we are all in business to make money and stay in business, and like it or not our "friends" working the same area as us are competition, therefore I see no benefit from giving out my exact pricing structure to someone who could potentially use it against me.
If however you work the other side of the country then I don’t have a problem, it’s just nice to be able to choose.
I would use the private message facility but for some reason it would appear to have been disabled on this forum. No doubt for good reason ;)
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Anyone who runs a business who does not keep one eye open to other methods of working is a fool.
In my opinion, if GD is asking how I price it does not mean he needs to ask, it means he is willing to learn and improve if possible.
Although I doubt my method will be any revelation to him or anyone else who has been in the business a while.
Ewan I have only been back on this forum for a while but have noticed you seem to like a good "heated debate" I don’t have a problem with that as I would never get involved but I do find it annoying to come onto what is in essence a place of learning only to find a stream of play ground bitching. Let it go mate and chill. I would buy you a beer if I thought it would help. :)
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Anyone who runs a business who does not keep one eye open to other methods of working is a fool.
In my opinion, if GD is asking how I price it does not mean he needs to ask, it means he is willing to learn and improve if possible.
Although I doubt my method will be any revelation to him or anyone else who has been in the business a while.
Ewan I have only been back on this forum for a while but have noticed you seem to like a good "heated debate" I don’t have a problem with that as I would never get involved but I do find it annoying to come onto what is in essence a place of learning only to find a stream of play ground bitching. Let it go mate and chill. I would buy you a beer if I thought it would help. :)
;)