Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: rs_cleancare on March 23, 2009, 06:25:18 pm
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Hi,
I cleaned a four bed house last thursday the job went fine, lots of draught marks all came out.
Got a phone call today from the customer to say that where the furniture had been moved it has left indents in the carpet. I had put foil protecters under everything and can't understand why.
I asked if they had tried gently teasing the pile back with there hands but to no avail.
The carpet is 100% wool loop so it has not got a thick pile to it.
Going round tomorrow to see what i can do but thought i would seek advice from anyone who has had this problem.
Rob.
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thought all furniture left indents in the carpet. ???
derek
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Didnt you notice if the indentions where their in the first place ?
did you place the furniture in exactly the same place ? I always try to ensure replaced in same place ?
Geoff
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It sounds as if you have moved the funiture away from its natural position to clean behind it. If the funiture has been left in the middle of the room it may have made some indent marks.
Bob
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Sell them some castor cups with a good markup.
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From what i can gather the main problem is with the dinning room chairs.
They not that heavy so can't understand why.
I do always put furinture back where it came from except for the chairs as it's easy for the customer to pick up foil protectors instead of crawling under tables to get them.
Mike thats a good one! Never miss a trick..
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Put some ice cubes on the indentations and let them melt.
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Steve
Does that work ???
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Certainly does mate.
The bigger the indentation the more ice cubes you use - works better on twists, but it's worth a try on this loop pile problem.
Steve
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Surely they'll go back to their original state after a short while ???
As for the ice cube trick, I've tried it and it does work, but I prefer mine in a tumbler with a Vodka and Iron Brew....
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If the furniture didn't leave permanent marks when the carpet was dry, they won't be permanent now. Dining chairs shouldn't be a problem, unless they're really heavy.
As said above, heavy stuff like big tables and 3pc suites etc should go back exactly where they came from.
Don't forget that indentations are a 3-layered sandwich. You've got the crushed pile, then below it the backing will be stretched and finally under that the underlay will be crushed. Temporary indents from light furniture on a 100% wool carpet will look quite severe, as you've bulked the pile of the carpet back out when you cleaned. The difference will be more pronounced.
One word of warning about ice cubes... I'd be very wary, either of of doing it or advising your customer to do it.
Quick quiz:
Wool + wet for a long time = ?
Ice is made of water. The temperature doesn't do anything, therefore just dampening the area in a controlled manner and leaving it to dry will do the same thing. Personally if I had to take any remedial action at all I'd set up my machine with a hand tool and simply extract over the depressions, making sure the carpet isn't left any wetter than after a normal extraction clean.
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When furniture was in middle of the room did you use polystyrene blocks or foil protecters.
They must be heavy dining room chairs ;D
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Ice cubes can also cause browning problems as melted water can wet the backing.
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Rob,
I have had a very simular problem to your customers.
To correct there problem, take your spotting machine in [for quickness]
and rinse over the depressions with hand tool and an extra dry pass to finish.
Colin.
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Some god replys above to use :)
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Jim
I appreciate what you are saying about caution using an ice cube, having said that there is not a lot of water in an ice cube.
You would be amazed at some of the tactics that were employed in the past when fitting the old body width carpets - when the pattern wouldn't match no matter how much it was stretched, the seams would be soaked to encourage shrinkage !
Fortunately in these days of broadloom carpet, such extreme measures are no longer necessary.
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It's not the amount of water Steve, it's the uncontrolled manner in which it's administered. The idea is that you dampen the pile, not wet the floor underneath! Introducing water to the woollen fibres is what bulks them out again and reduces the depression. You actually need very little water to wet the tufts covered by one dining chair leg!
Given that many of our customers put more vanish on to do a better job, could you really trust them to stop at one or two ice cubes and not 10?
As John and Colin already said before me ( :D ) browning could bite you on the bum, and if you're going to do anything wouldn't it be far better to use a professional looking method? Just my opinion :)
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Thanks for the advice on this one chaps.
I think i will try extraction method.
If that dosn't work then try the ice trick followed up with a hair dryier.
Personaly I guess the customer might be a little fussy as I have been cleaning carpets for 5 years now and never had a call back for this problem.
Going round tonight lets hope i can walk away with a happy customer!
Rob.
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Forget the ice cube you'll be there all night, just wet it thats all the ice cube is doing. The ice doesn't actually do anything. Wool absorbs 30% of its weight in water and it is this that bulks it up. Put a couple of drops of water on, gently tease up with a fringe comb or blunt spatula and dry off.
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Just a quicky as im off now.
I had the saame last year when an ex customer called to complain that the indentations are worse now than before the cleaning.
The cleaning had brought the pile up "nice and fluffy", and because of this it made the indentations look deeper.
Went back to re do, and then got a call to say I had damaged some furniture which was not the case.
Some peope are uber fussy.
Good luck.
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Ice cubes can also cause browning problems as melted water can wet the backing.
So how about some ice cubes mixed with some debrowning solution?
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Warning!
If the customer has told you they are indentations and they have appeared where you placed the dining room chairs elsewhere in the room, I would immediately be concerned that they were not indents but either rust marks or colour transfer.
Sometimes when we put foil under the legs the customer will remove them when we have gone thinking the carpet is dry, hence the problem.
Simple tip for the ice cube problem, just place them in a sandwich bag, tie end in a knot and tell the customer to remove them once thawed out.
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Simple tip for the ice cube problem, just place them in a sandwich bag, tie end in a knot and tell the customer to remove them once thawed out.
:-\ As has previously been said, it's the water that rebulks the fibres. If you put the ice cubes into a sandwich bag the water isn't going to touch the fibres therefore there will be no effect whatsoever.
In any case the ice doesn't actually do anything. This ice cube lark is a Kim and Aggie type solution and designed as a DIY tip for householders. As a professional you have the equipment to sort out this problem in the proper way.
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OK lets put this ice cube business to bed once and for all.
John you are quite right it is a DIY tip for householders and I have suggested it to non-clients in the distant past as a possible solution to a problem that I haven't created and am unlikely to be asked to solve.
It can be successful but as John and Jim have correctly pointed out we have more professional means to rectify our own clients problems.
As I consider myself a professional I shouldn't have suggested it to a fellow cleaner on an open forum.
Steve
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Yep I'm in agreement with Steve, John and Jim. There is nothing magical about an ice cube. It is simply a defined amount of water. (You could just as easily say, for example, half an egg-cup full amount.) If you were to advise a customer to simply wet the fibres and tease them out I would have visions of them pouring a 10l bucket of water over the indent. Now that would cause some problems. :o
The way I describe it is to say that when fibres have been wetted they loose their memory of how they should lie. Why else do we set the pile on a carpet or fabric after cleaning?
Yes we can do a "call-back" but a client who uses a small amount of water (an ice-cube amount) could then just reset the pile/tease the indent out.
Apologies to all for me adding my own rambling explanation.
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Used ice cubes in the bag for years, the cold and warm meeting will create moisture enough to raise the pile, does not always work of course but it won't flood the area so no problems with browning etc. ;)
Try it.
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Good point Hilton. Admit I'd never thought of that. Still think its easier just to wet the fibres.
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Sounds like indents from air movers,just add moisture and brush.
Mark
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i'm afraid i would have told the customer to sling his hook in the nicest way possible, you should have just told him that they would come out in time by themselves and left it at that, some customers are waaay too fussy and often they are the same customers who have the dirtiest carpets to start with,
colin
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Surley they are taking the mick ::), carpet+furniture = indents, its just going to happen, unless they
want an empty room to live in!
Did they also ask you to clean the carpet without walking on it? ;D
Think I would have explained that it happens and not spent too much time trying to rectify otherwise
they might continue being time wasting !
steve
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Spot on Steve tell em to SOD off ;D ;D
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Hand held steamer should help to lift the indents.
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it's not just the fibres that are crushed it's the backing also, in an ideal world you need to push the backing out from the other side.
Shaun
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Update on the indents!
I went round the customers house last night and could not belive what i saw.
Every piece of furinture that had foil protectors underneath had left indents.
From where the foil protectors had been under the dinninig chairs there were perfect squares quite deep. Even on heavy furniture where the foil had curled up the indent were the size of the foil.
Method i used for removing the indents was just a quick fresh water rinse they came out without too much problem.
This is something i have never seen happen before and the customer had every right to call me back. They wouldn't come out using a little water and teasing the fibres up with hand.
I had cleaned the carpet with microsplit and a fresh water rince. The customer said the carpet took about 6 hours to dry. Can't think of anyway to avoid this happening again.
I will try to upload some pics later when i work out how.
So just be aware if you get a call back for this problem they may not be taking the mick!
Rob.
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Quote "Even on heavy furniture where the foil had curled up the indent were the size of the foil."
General comment. Sounds like you used the very thin foil protector.
There is a thicker one with a card backing. Costs a little more.
You may still get some indentation but probably more shallow and definately not in a square shape.
The sticky tabs from John Kellyalso would resist the "squaring" but too expensive for chair legs, I use them on tables and lounge seating.
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Hi Joe,
I use the thick type. I belive that this was a very strange accurance and no matter what i had done this problem would of accured.
In one of the bedrooms the customer had moved a chair very light (you could pick up with one finger) and the feet had left deep impressions.
The whole situation has been very odd and i don't expect i will come accross this again hopefully.
Rob.
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6 Hours to dry?
what were you extracting with, a vax?
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Phillip, It was a "Thick Woolen Carpet" which, as you will know, takes a good bit more water into its natural fibres! 6 hours is a fairly reasonable amount of time to expect a carpet like that to dry if you haven't got the sahara snail kicking out the air. I dare say a good vacuuming by the custy once the carpet was fully dried would have sufficed at plumping the fibres back up.... Some customers want the moon on a stick!
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Hi Colin, was being a bit flippant I must admit. I agree with you about the vacuuming though.
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Six hours is a good time for a wool carpet to dry. I bet there's plenty of people out there that don't do dry passes with the wand and take 24 hours to dry.
With the indents there would have been no chance of them coming out with a vac...
Rob.