Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: mlscontractcleaner on January 14, 2009, 07:45:23 pm
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??? ???Hi lads and lasses.
when cleaning carpets I use a Woodbridge Powerplus hot water extraction machine and can't fault it. In the five or more years I've had it, an it wasn't new when I bought it, I've only ever had to had one of the two vacuums repaired and it really does clean a treat.
I now want to replace the two jet wand and want to buy a 7.5m hose assembly so went to my local cleaning supplie shop in Plymouth and was quoted the following prices: £295 + vat fo the wand and £175 + vat for the hose. Now, these are from Prochem, but she said they would fit my machine fine and I said I'd let her know.
On arriving home I checked out the Woodbridge website and found their phone number. I gave them a call and asked for their prices. Buggar me, almost half!!!!
The wand is £180.97 + vat and the hoses £76.90 + vat.
When the vat is added that comes to £540.50 to £296.55, which is quite a difference isn't it.
Now, is Prochem really that good, twicw as good infact, or are they vastly over priced?
And if they are does it follow that their machines are over prices too?
I have no idea, I'm just very, very glad that I decided to contact Woodbridge before agreeing to buy locally.
So, what's the verdict???
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God, my spelling was pretty poor; sorry about that. Grammer school education too!!!
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heard that prochem pure clean went up a bit! :o :o :o
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The differential in price for the wands I can understand. Purely down to the difference in quality.
As for the hose assembly, are you sure you are comparing like for like?
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I reckon the Prochem price is for solution and suction hose.
The Woodbridge price is for suction only - add a similar price for solution hose, making them somewhere the same.
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I have 1xset of prochem hoses which came with the machine,bought another set from Olympic last year,no difference in quality only price !
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Thats because Olympic sell Prochem hoses.
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The Hose price is for BOTH HOSES!
The wand quality is fine, as I said, I've had mine for more than five years with no complaints.
I know you pay for what you get but double the price???
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Thats because Olympic sell Prochem hoses.
That's the best chuckle I've had on here for a few days, thanks John :D
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Prochem stuff IMO is ok but the machines exc TM are not worth a light even tho I have 2 steampros
Over priced chems now as well .
Ricky
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I have a local Prochem supplier, Hugh Crane Ltd, and they deliver (free) what ever I need. Just last week I had a vac motor appear to die on me, even though they were pressed for time they took the machine and repaired it and then delivered it to me! I use quite a few of their chems which have gone up quite a bit, I remember Multi Pro at £6 :o So I will be testing alternatives. Quite lucky because Hugh Crane also supply CFR gear as well as general cleaning equipment and the free delivery always helps.
As far as wands, hoses and tools I mostly use Woodbridge.
Simon
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Well that's good enough for me!
Not being a user of Prochem equipment, not even the cleaning chemicals; I use Craftex mostly, I just needed to know whether Prochem gear was really so brilliant that they warranted such a hugely inflated price.
It would appear that that's not the case.
Many thanks for your input folk ;D
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I have dealt with woodbridge for quite a few years now and always found them to give good service and excellent prices, I purchased a 50! length of vacuum and solution assemblies last year with a 2" bore and all the cuffs and brass fittings for under £200 and that was with vat and delivery ! I also think Prochem have out priced themselves out of the market, they have always been expensive, and I think they will have to be careful in this day and age with the recession looming, folk will only pay so much
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try being up in fife, we only have the choice of prochem or chemspec with, the nearest supplier from that is over 100 miles away ??? ??? :-\ :-\ :-\
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The vast majority ofProchem chemicals are worth the price we have to pay due to the fact that they are of the highest quality. Prochem Pure Clean is a excellent product well worth the price. The same goes for Powerburst, Citrus Gel, Red RX, Ultrapac, Traffic Clean.....the list goes on & on. The good thing about the majority of Prochem chems is that you can be assured they will do the job right first time.
Richie.
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That still doesn't warrant rip off prices for their accessories does it. I'm paying half the price Prochem wanted, which is quite a saving, and it's not as if I'm buying inferior quality goods, just cheaper ;) ;) ;)
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It is true that Prochem do make quality chemicals and you cant realy skimp on them, i dont think that they are anymore expensive than Chemspecs range but i do prefer Chemspecs of the two,
Although parts and machines from Chemspec and Prochem can be obtained a lot cheaper elswere
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That still doesn't warrant rip off prices for their accessories does it. I'm paying half the price Prochem wanted, which is quite a saving, and it's not as if I'm buying inferior quality goods, just cheaper ;) ;) ;)
Just playing Devil's Advocate here but...
If your price per square metre is say double that of one of your local competitor's then are you ripping off your clients?
If you're not ripping them off then the reasons you can think of as to why this is so will probably apply to why Prochem think they can charge more for the kit and chemicals that they sell. ???
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theres a lot more to prochem than just selling products.
i know they do a lot of research and testing. that doesn't come cheap. i'm happy to pay prochem prices and other top companies prices, cos i know i can trust them.
derek
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Have also used prochem for many years and find thy might be a little more expensive than other cleaners but they do invest in there research before puting the prouct on the market :)
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Careful on the wand because as far as i know Woodbridge sell PMF wands which wouldnt be of the same quality as other brands.
But generally Prochem is more expensive.
Mark
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As a supplier I probably see things from a differnet slant. Everyone wants to save money. But just like carpet cleaners service a huge swathe of different customers, we do likewise. I tend to attract the top end of the market in the local area, don't know why or how but thats the way it seems. I do get some low cost cleaners in but not many.
We also operate a flood restoration business as well as a couple of other things. I personally have always bought the best equipment available to enable us to carry out the work efficiently and effectively. I soon learnt that you couldn't dry buildings out effectively with little domestic Ebacs so I invested £30,000 in Drieaz and Coroventa drying equipment. This was money well spent and the investment has been paid back many times over.
What I find is the cleaners who I would say are making the most money just want good kit and products which are going to do the job for them, regardless of the cost. Thats not to say they just go and spend money for the sake of it but they tend to spend that bit more for a good product and service.
At the other end of the scale there are cleaners who shouldn't really be in business and are accidents waiting to happen. They skimp on maintenance, buy cheap gear, usually second hand which is virtually knackered and use a very limited range of chemicals, usually one product for everything.
Personally I don't think any products are overpriced, some are more expensive than others but when you consider the return you can make on a carpet cleaning machine, if you do it right! it is buttons.
PS Prochem spent $10 million dollars developing ONE cleaning chemical.
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The thing with Prochem is that they have bumped the price up very heavily and it looks bad, good quality items are worth the money but when you are in a recession every penny counts but I always say that!
I have moved over to a lot of Craftex products but they aren't as cheap as they used to be but I do like the quality of them.
Shaun
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Blame the Chinese. They are sourcing a lot of acricultural product from other Asian countries as more and more of their workers turn from agriculture to industry and land is used for building. This in turn has resulted in a massive demand for Phoshates, a major component of some cleaning products. The price has risen by 800% since November last year.
I'm afraid you will see more price rises over the coming year as the majority of everything we use is sourced from abroad and unless the pound picks up it is all going to be more expensive.
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Before you know it we'll have to go back to hot water to make things clean again ;D
Shaun
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Shaun
Now you have let the cat out of the bag ;D ;D
We have got away with it for 20 yrs :D
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What's the woodbridge site address.
Tried woodbridge.co.uk but got a timber firm.
John
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Woodbridge
http://www.wcsuk.com
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Halved my chemical bill for the year since I stopped using Prochems' products for Ashbys. I was finding Prochems products a bit weak from when i first started 10 years ago .Ashby's Supreme is something like 55 pounds for 25 kilos and is just as good, if not better than crystal green .Still use a Prochem steam-pro though ,but thinking about a Ninja with 3 vacs,just got to earn more money before i buy that though .
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Dave
Is there a new ninja on the market mate ???
Cheers clinton
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Clinton well it's not new been around for a year or two . People i know that have them say that they can get the carpets dry within about 20 mins and that there regular customers are well impressed :)
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Cheers Joe
John
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Dave
Is there a new ninja on the market mate ???
Cheers clinton
The 3rd Ninja vac is an external add on, another plug point.
Bit like the Scorpion external heater needs another plug point.
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Halved my chemical bill for the year since I stopped using Prochems' products for Ashbys. I was finding Prochems products a bit weak from when i first started 10 years ago .Ashby's Supreme is something like 55 pounds for 25 kilos and is just as good, if not better than crystal green .Still use a Prochem steam-pro though ,but thinking about a Ninja with 3 vacs,just got to earn more money before i buy that though .
Dave 123, what type of job do you use the Ashby Supreme on?
High ph at 11.5
but very economic at 1 to 1333 !!
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Think its the ashbys dual heat machine ???
Joe
That a v economical solution.
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Clinton
but that machine still only has 2 - 3 stage vacs as I read the spec. 1 is heavy duty, 1 is standard.
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Joe
Had a look to and your right on that one :)
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Joe , I use it on heavily soiled or greasy carpets.
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I used to have that setup with a 7" three stage motor coupled to the back of the ninja, trouble is that you have three vacume motors sucking in series, and i have found with experience and also having purchased a scorpian that sucks in Paralell the latter is by far the best! Best at removing more soil and best by far for drier carpets, also you have to bear in mind that the Ninja only has one inlet port and restricts airflow vastly, wher as the Scorpian has three
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Think the scorpion is the mos powerfull portie on the market i guess ???
Canot see any more advancement in the market as the ampage is restricted ::)
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Stuart,
I got around the 3 vacs in series by modifying the set up a little. I attached the 3rd vac directly into the waste tank. It makes a huge difference. I prefer this set up to my Scorpion.
Nigel
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I used to have that setup with a 7" three stage motor coupled to the back of the ninja, trouble is that you have three vacume motors sucking in series, and i have found with experience and also having purchased a scorpian that sucks in Paralell the latter is by far the best! Best at removing more soil and best by far for drier carpets, also you have to bear in mind that the Ninja only has one inlet port and restricts airflow vastly, wher as the Scorpian has three
Hi Stuart
You know, your the first that I can recall that has mentioned the fact the Scorpion has 3 ports.
Must be a factor of its efficiency.
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I'll have to have a look at the Scorpion and compare
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Which one is the more powerfull ???
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Nigel posted that pic in a thread a couple of months ago, we had a bit of a chat about it there I think :)
http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=64927.20
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Impressive conversion Nigel, especially with the 2" hose. Were you able to convert to a 2" hose port or is it still 1.5"?
I see a short exhaust hose also. Could this cause a heat related damage problem on some hard floors or do you extend and exhaust ourside? If so, does this cause a slight drop off in performance?
Safe and happy cleaning :)
Ken
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Hi Ken,
I ordered the Ninja with a 2 inch vac port. The short exhaust hose is just to keep the vacuum exhaust noise down. It would benefit from a longer hose but by the time I have lugged the portable gear up to a 4th flr apartment in London I am not looking for extra things to take in. :o
I like this set up because it is quieter than the Scorpion so I can sit it on a marble/stone entrance hall and not be embarrassed by the noise level. I can also run up to 100 foot of 2 inch hose and still get acceptable performance. I find the Ninja is more solid and much better made and I like the internal heat exchanger. It is quite flexible too because it performs well without the 3rd vac over 25 foot for small jobs. On the downside it is heavier by a few pounds which I accept given the more rigid construction.
If I were running from a van I would still probably choose the Scorpion because noise would not be an issue, the machines is under less stress because it is not being bumped around and I could sit a heat exchanger in the property.
As usual in this this business its horses for courses.
Nigel
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Has anyone seen the alltech with the 3 vac set up ???
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Sorry Ken to finish the answer I also carry some 1/2 inch rubber mats to place under the machine if the floor is susceptible to damage from the heat of the machine. Fortunately the great laminate craze didn't reach the designer end of the London market ;D
Nigel
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Nigel
Good idea that with the mats :)
Usually have dust sheets and sheet of plastic
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I like that Ninja as stated by Jim it's been on here before in my eyes it looks better than the Scorpion but what do I know? I am an advocate of heat so it gets my vote just wondering how many plugs it needs?
Shaun
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Shaun
I guess about three ???
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I used to run my old Bane clene with 2 wires, I had 2 vac blowers to increase the power that was OK but a third would put me right off!
Years ago I had a self build TM from Dave Ingram which ran a 1000psi water pump and a vac blower on one lead never had a blown fuse the heat was from a burner from a pressure washer so did take a small amount of voltage.
Shaun
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Also usually get a twin socket in the hall or nearby,just would not fancy any more as need a couple for my dryers spec if a doing a suite ::)
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Shaun
Did dave ingrahm make them then ???
Never thought of a home made one.
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Where's the £180 one at Woodbridge?
Twin jet on there at £141 + the dreaded.
Looking for a twin jet myself, the Prochem one does sound expensive but the Woodbridge sounds too cheap.
Looking for something in between, ant ideas?
John